I'm going to say what's on my mind.

[dilligaf0]

I have been seeing Tweets by models that complain that members don't value them.
I will stipulate that this is true in some cases, but there is another side of the story too.
I used to tip very generously. I was working and making good money and didn't mind sharing. Then my life changed. I had several health issues come up and now I'm no longer able to work and on a fixed income. I still watch and tip when I can but it's not nearly as much as it used to be.
The Tweets I'm seeing tell me the since I'm no longer a functioning ATM machine, I'm no longer wanted or welcomed by many models.
Models complain about freeloaders (justifiably), but you should remember there are some of your fans that have unfortunate luck in life and have to manage our money much more carefully.
If you're not capable of doing this, so long and good luck.
Sorry for ranting, but it's not fun feeling unwanted.

 

[MFCGod]

Is there anything they said that made you feel like they were talking about or including you personally?

 

[Tilly]

While I can see how it annoys viewers to see camgirls complain about their income, you have to cut them some slack sometimes. I don't know anyone in the world who would go along happily making less per hour than usual for the same type of work. I think a lot of people assume camgirls make great money regardless, but we only make money when people are tipping. We don't make an hourly wage if no one is contributing financially. It's just how the occupation works. I wouldn't take it personally. Most of the time when girls are 'complaining' they're just venting. Most of us don't have any outlets besides twitter, as this isn't a job we can always be vocal about with our friends and family. Most people complain about their day at work when it's over and done with, but lots of us don't have anyone to talk to about camming, besides maying yelling out into the void once in a while.

 

[Deleted member 35180]

I have no problem with "freeloaders" and I don't kick them out of my room.

However, when someone wants to sit there and send me pm after pm with nothing interesting to say (I don't block pms from non tippers either, but I am less likely to answer them for this reason) I get pissed off.

Stressing out about income fluctuations was so bad for me that I decided not to cam full-time.

 

[AmberCutie]

I have been seeing Tweets by models that complain that members don't value them.
I will stipulate that this is true in some cases, but there is another side of the story too.
I used to tip very generously. I was working and making good money and didn't mind sharing. Then my life changed. I had several health issues come up and now I'm no longer able to work and on a fixed income. I still watch and tip when I can but it's not nearly as much as it used to be.
The Tweets I'm seeing tell me the since I'm no longer a functioning ATM machine, I'm no longer wanted or welcomed by many models.
Models complain about freeloaders (justifiably), but you should remember there are some of your fans that have unfortunate luck in life and have to manage our money much more carefully.
If you're not capable of doing this, so long and good luck.
Sorry for ranting, but it's not fun feeling unwanted.

Being the girl whose (well at least I think) room you spend most of your MFC time in, I certainly hope you don't think I feel this way. I know you value my time and efforts no matter what.

I always try to remind my very sweet regulars that any frustration I show isn't aimed at them, but at the hundreds of folks who seemingly enjoy my room but don't tip. And yes I realize you're saying that some of them are in the situation as you are, but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that people do at least a *little* something once in a great while to contribute to the room.

 

[dilligaf0]

While I can see how it annoys viewers to see camgirls complain about their income, you have to cut them some slack sometimes. I don't know anyone in the world who would go along happily making less per hour than usual for the same type of work. I think a lot of people assume camgirls make great money regardless, but we only make money when people are tipping. We don't make an hourly wage if no one is contributing financially. It's just how the occupation works. I wouldn't take it personally. Most of the time when girls are 'complaining' they're just venting. Most of us don't have any outlets besides twitter, as this isn't a job we can always be vocal about with our friends and family. Most people complain about their day at work when it's over and done with, but lots of us don't have anyone to talk to about camming, besides maying yelling out into the void once in a while.

There's a huge difference between "venting" about not making many tokens and saying that "members don't value camgirls". Those who can't tip much are being lumped into the same group as those that won't tip. There's a big difference.If you don't want people in your room that can't tip much, that's fine.

Is there anything they said that made you feel like they were talking about or including you personally?

No, it was the generalization of all non-tippers are cheap freeloaders that pissed me off. I feel bad enough about not being able to tip as much as I really would like to without a fucking guilt trip about it.

 

[dilligaf0]

Being the girl whose (well at least I think) room you spend most of your MFC time in, I certainly hope you don't think I feel this way. I know you value my time and efforts no matter what.

I always try to remind my very sweet regulars that any frustration I show isn't aimed at them, but at the hundreds of folks who seemingly enjoy my room but don't tip.

No, you're not in this group. But you seem to be in the minority of cammodels anymore.

 

[Phoenix4987]

I wouldn't take it too personally man. I don't think they're trying to guilt trip you specifically. However, I think you somewhat feel responsible or maybe feel like your worth as a member has gone down because your disposable income has gone down.

If that's the case then I would lower my expectations of what you desire out of camland if it makes you feel that way. It should be an entertaining environment that you visit when you have the funds to do so. If you don't have the funds then don't go. Not to say that your presence may or may not be appreciated if you're tipping or not, but it seems like you don't feel a certain level of appreciation unless you do.

I personally don't like to show up in a model's room unless I do have tokens and I'm not a light spender. For me, I don't see a reason to hangout at someone's work to just sit around and have someone to talk to. I'll send a brief text offline to say a quick hello, how's everything going like I would anybody else.

But it just seems a little needy in my eyes to be in someone's room for some length, time after time, but not tipping: even if you want to but you can't. And especially if you're expecting tons of conversation and attention, but are now getting frustrated at the lack thereof.

From a business standpoint, you want them to invest the same amount of time and energy in you for now even less of a paycheck. It's nothing personal man, it's just business.

 

[JoleneBrody]

Even if you tip 5 tokens a week you are NOT freeloading.

In my opinion anyways. While I agree that the generalized statement about members isn't very appealing, I also don't think you should be lumping yourself in with freeloaders either.

If every member who could tip 5 tokens occasionally did, I'd never stress about goals again!
I dunno, just don't be so hard on yourself. You are appreciated and you make a positive difference.

 

[dilligaf0]

I wouldn't take it too personally man. I don't think they're trying to guilt trip you specifically. However, I think you somewhat feel responsible or maybe feel like your worth as a member has gone down because your disposable income has gone down.

If that's the case then I would lower my expectations of what you desire out of camland if it makes you feel that way. It should be an entertaining environment that you visit when you have the funds to do so. If you don't have the funds then don't go. Not to say that your presence may or may not be appreciated if you're tipping or not, but it seems like you don't feel a certain level of appreciation unless you do.

I personally don't like to show up in a model's room unless I do have tokens and I'm not a light spender. For me, I don't see a reason to hangout at someone's work to just sit around and have someone to talk to. I'll send a brief text offline to say a quick hello, how's everything going like I would anybody else.

But it just seems a little needy in my eyes to be in someone's room for some length, time after time, but not tipping: even if you want to but you can't. And especially if you're expecting tons of conversation and attention, but are now getting frustrated at the lack thereof.

From a business standpoint, you want them to invest the same amount of time and energy in you for now even less of a paycheck. It's nothing personal man, it's just business.

I'm not asking for or expecting anything. I also don't like being judged by someone with them trying to understand my situation. Don't group everyone in one pile.

 

[Phoenix4987]

I just don't think these models were referring to you specifically that's all since you do make a point to make an effort

 

[dilligaf0]

Even if you tip 5 tokens a week you are NOT freeloading.

In my opinion anyways. While I agree that the generalized statement about members isn't very appealing, I also don't think you should be lumping yourself in with freeloaders either.

If every member who could tip 5 tokens occasionally did, I'd never stress about goals again!
I dunno, just don't be so hard on yourself. You are appreciated and you make a positive difference.

Thank you. I am not lumping myself in with the freeloaders, in fact, I'm upset by being lumped in with them by these models.

 

[dilligaf0]

I just don't think these models were referring to you specifically that's all since you do make a point to make an effort

You may be missing my point. Let me clarify.
I object to being inaccurately labeled be someone. In fact I object to labels period.

 

[SMuser69]

On SM you have the advantage of the model are forbidden to tell you where offsite they plan to rant on people.

That said it's more a model mistake to treat customers this way. They forget they are a business at all times and negative blanket ranting at members can be as detrimental to their business as a if a waiter was joking about spitting in food while the restaurant was open and full of customers. The damage in some cases is very hard to reverse because you have no idea who being affected by those negative comments.

The fact Amber wanted to make sure it wasn't her OP was talking is exactly the same thing.

tl;dr indirect negativity in a customer based business can lead to unintentionally consequences.

 

[JoleneBrody]

Thank you. I am not lumping myself in with the freeloaders, in fact, I'm upset by being lumped in with them by these models.

I think I understand now! Was taken off course by the parts about your personal tipping habits. Your point is that it's very hurtful that many models tend to make such generalized negative comments towards the member community as a whole without distinguishing any separation? Is that right?

 

[dilligaf0]

I think I understand now! Was taken off course by the parts about your personal tipping habits. Your point is that it's very hurtful that many models tend to make such generalized negative comments towards the member community as a whole without distinguishing any separation? Is that right?

Yes! Thank you.

 

[JoleneBrody]

Yes! Thank you.

WOO I'M AMAZING!

 

[n_i_c_u]

I have been seeing Tweets by models

I don't know, man. I've seen perfectly happy people lose their shit over tweets (not just the model thing, but in other realms). Part of me thinks that app isn't such a good thing. I could suggest dropping the twitter thing so as not to be involved in all the small talk, but, I get it...it is impossible if you are already into it. I too tried my best with models but I am oblivious about stuff because I am not active on the twitter thing so I just feel personally bad if I am rude or something (and then, I already know after some self reflection after the fact)..

 

[uncoveredmanhole]

I wouldn't take it too personally man. I don't think they're trying to guilt trip you specifically. However, I think you somewhat feel responsible or maybe feel like your worth as a member has gone down because your disposable income has gone down.

From a business standpoint, you want them to invest the same amount of time and energy in you for now even less of a paycheck. It's nothing personal man, it's just business.

I dunno, 'it's nothing personal, I only seemed to like you because you had money' seems inherently personal, since it's a bit like saying 'you personally are nothing to me, money was your only redeeming quality'.

of course it's only business, but it's a fantasy business for some customers. Sure there are people who're almost like photographers, 'I'll hire you to model this for me, nice, pleasure doing business with you', but there are also 'I'd like to get to know you, meet you, etc.' type people who're more like a john buying a GFE from a hooker where there's some degree of fantasy/suspense of disbelief at work, and I guess after a long relationship-building series of encounters like that some guys suspend their disbelief a little too well and forget that the hired person is still only role-playing, and only playing because the money is there... and has many things they'd otherwise be doing if there was no money there.

 

[Ambers Troll]

Stop spending so much on some models and it can be a harsh reality check. It is understandable for a model to assume that we will always be able and willing to spend on them. I decided on irregular rather than looking to be someones regular years ago for this very reason. It can work if you are honest in how you spend.

Your spending decisions are a choice; also when you choose a model that you know well you have some idea of what spending on her will cost you for what you want. When you have less you can't expect concessions from a model, they just can't afford too much of that kind of time.

I also see no problem with a member judging the model who ignores previous support. A tipping member situation can change at any time, for better or worse. A model who stays with a member through worse times may be far more rewarded by that member in better times or for long into the future.

In my experience models tend to be pretty inconsiderate of when a member can spend less on them. I do think that most still notice and enjoy the support, even if that member tips less.

It is not always the member that changes circumstances. When a model becomes more popular she can lose her poorer members, even with the member being welcome to join her. This type of member she usually has great affection for as they may have got her to the place she is. The model's time just becomes too valuable to spend in the way she used to.

 

[VeronicaChaos]

I hear this a lot: guys who can't tip as much as they like get upset when models complain about freeloaders and feel they're being targeted/grouped in with the freeloaders. Why? I've seen about a million "I don't like freeloaders" rants in my 5 years camming and nearly every single one mentions that small tips when you can are appreciated. I kind of get the feeling that a lot of guys are grouping themselves in with the category of freeloaders who shouldn't be because they're self-conscious about their tipping habits. But I don't really see how that's the model's fault?

Am I missing something here? Why do small tippers assume models are talking about them when talking about freeloaders? I feel like over and over the definition of freeloaders is stressed not to include them.

 

[AudriTwo]

You do what is best for you, financially. That should always be rule one for any members on a camsite. If a model is salty because you can no longer tip the same numbers you used to, fuck her even more. What a bitch.

 

[uncoveredmanhole]

In my experience models tend to be pretty inconsiderate of when a member can spend less on them. I do think that most still notice and enjoy the support, even if that member tips less.

I would hope communication would change that.
when a guy lets me know it's late or he's out of tks or something like that, as long as I'm in the mood for fun times I'm willing to take it on faith that he's being honest with me, and make some changes to make up for his situation.
I can totally understand the $500-a-day models not giving that sort of thing the time of day, though. strippers do the same thing .... you're at work, you gotta hustle.

It is not always the member that changes circumstances. When a model becomes more popular she can lose her poorer members, even with the member being welcome to join her. This type of member she usually has great affection for as they may have got her to the place she is. The model's time just becomes too valuable to spend in the way she used to.

yeh. for me, the option I intend to explore if it comes to that, is modding people I owe my success to, so they never have to worry about missing out on shows, and giving them access to any vids/sets they want (I wish there was a middle option between the scam of 'fanclub' and the modding red). If they get more money in the future and want to tip for tipsake in the future, great. To me it's like the music piracy thing, I don't lose anything by having their support, and maybe if they gain enough from me I'll gain something, too (be it lols or compliments or traffic or tks or whatever).

 

[uncoveredmanhole]

I've seen about a million "I don't like freeloaders" rants in my 5 years camming and nearly every single one mentions that small tips when you can are appreciated.

definitely.
hell, I appreciate the compliments, too. it's really only constant grey dirty talk that's more of a negative than a positive for me. tip-text dirty talk is fine.
if someone tips 1tk or 2tks, hey, for all I know he could only afford 100tks this week or this month... that he's willing to give some of that to me says a lot more than words do. A rich guy dropping 25s or 100s like they're nothing isn't inherently more flattering, it's just literally more valuable for my time. Hell, considering the big picture, a guy who visits often and drops a few tks every time means more to me, really, than someone who spends up big for half an hour and who I never ever see again. I have no idea what the random guy was thinking, whereas there's kind of an inherent compliment to someone returning to hang out time and again. same reason 2-night stands are better for the ego than one-night-stands

I kind of get the feeling that a lot of guys are grouping themselves in with the category of freeloaders who shouldn't be because they're self-conscious about their tipping habits. But I don't really see how that's the model's fault?

as a chronically offensive person, I have to say this: if we're communicating with people, we have to take responsibility for our language.

everyone who has ever tipped you know what a 'grey' is (or whatever the equivalent of no-tks members are on the other sites). it's very easy to say every token is a token of your affection that warms my heart, you don't have to be a touchy-feely poet to let people know they're helping. It's very easy to say 'sick of having 2500 anons in my room every day freeloading' so members know it's not about them, or 'fuckin demanding greys suck, I don't demand your money, why d'you demand my body?', so that non-greys who are non-demanding don't feel at all associated with your target.

If you choose to advertise yourself as someone unhappy and selfish, always complaining and focusing on getting money from people, that's on you. Some people might worry it concerns them if you're not clear about the boundaries of what you expect to get from people and how much or how infrequently is something you're ungrateful for. That's on you, too.

 

[Phoenix4987]

I dunno, 'it's nothing personal, I only seemed to like you because you had money' seems inherently personal, since it's a bit like saying 'you personally are nothing to me, money was your only redeeming quality'.

I get your point, but do you go to a strip club and sit at the stage without having something to tip the girl with? Even if I just tip-bombed a girl the day, week before, it doesn't make sense to me to hold that over someone's head and demand constant attention if I don't have tokens the following day or week.

If I don't have, I don't show up. It keeps up the expectations on her part, that if I show up I'm going to spend on her. And it keeps things in perspective for me that I show up, I'm getting a service and not trying to hang around more than I need to and try to make things more than what they are.

I'm sure maybe some would appreciate having some emotional support on slow nights or whatever, but I just prefer to keep my image one that's in line with someone who isn't desperate or a fanatical fanboy that needs to spend every night with someone when they login.

There's enough people that do that and I don't need to be that guy.

 

[uncoveredmanhole]

I get your point, but do you go to a strip club and sit at the stage without having something to tip the girl with?

only strip club I've been to wasn't designed like that, so I can't say. it was more of a work-the-room environment. 'sitting at the stage' would be more the equivalent of being a loud grey making demands. I don't think merely being in her room silently counts as coming to the stage with no money.

Even if I just tip-bombed a girl the day, week before, it doesn't make sense to me to hold that over someone's head and demand constant attention if I don't have tokens the following day or week.

some people models have to deal with aren't sensible.
I'm still currently feeling out a couple fruitless one-sided interactions, unsure whether or not to pull the trigger on some selfish shit. I've found a hard line can be a good choice, but I think at this point it would be a bit more of a pulling the rug out / changing the rules rather than being merely forthright and having no emotional cost for the member involved.

If I don't have, I don't show up. It keeps up the expectations on her part, that if I show up I'm going to spend on her.

...you could always just have a backup grey account. enjoy things quietly when you can, repay her with your gratitude when you can.

I'm sure maybe some would appreciate having some emotional support on slow nights or whatever, but I just prefer to keep my image one that's in line with someone who isn't desperate or a fanatical fanboy that needs to spend every night with someone when they login.

as I think you're suggesting, that could be as much about you as about them, though. (how you wish to be esteemed, rather than necessarily a selfless favor you're doing for them). that's neither here nor there, though, since it's a positive for everyone involved. I'm aware that I prefer to be known as a fellow model who just likes to share the love a little, than imagined to be someone who just has a lifestyle of paying for porn/sex/etc.

 

[swagger]

I think the battle is more internal than external. When I am avoiding going on MFC because I've had to shift my budget, I simply perceive things that aren't there, or at least weren't leveled at me. If one of my favorite models tweets "Slow night tonight, thanks to everyone who participated!" In my head, I hear, "Thanks a lot for not showing up and helping Swag!"

She didn't say or mean that at all, and yet at times I'll lean towards that perception to varying degrees. I'm not sure if this is at all similar to Dilligaf0's situation, but it sure is mine sometimes.

 

[Tilly]

It's sad that as a camgirl everything we say, do, type, etc is scrutinized, and like swagger said just now, not only that, but it's apparently being completely misconstrued into something else entirely too. I might as well just tweet "ya'll suck. thanks for nothing!" next time I have a slow night making nowhere near minimum wage per hour. Sorry, but not everything is all about reading btwn the lines and finding some hidden meaning. That sort of behavior is quite narcisstic to jump to the conclusion that everything is all about you, or that a camgirl's good and bad days revolve solely around YOU tipping. I mean that very well might be the case but damn, try to cool it for a sec and not take camgirls (which is supposed to be a fun form of entertainment) so seriously. Let me break it down real quick. This is not an exaggeration: There's hundreds if not thousands of people who follow your favorite camgirl. Maybe even tens of thousands. Some girls have over one hundred thousand followers! I am certain that many of you cannot fathom how much interaction that can amount to on a daily basis. Ever heard of a social media manager? Some camgirls probably need one, honestly, to keep up with the exessive amount of mail and shit they have to sift through daily. Some of it is nice, happy messages but there is a ton of negative, disgusting comments for every nice one. I'm sure any girl here could agree on that. If a camgirl wanted to say something directly to you specifically (perhaps to express her displeasure in you not visiting/tipping her) she could do so easily in a direct message platform. Many girls actually do PM and pester their regulars and tell them to come tip them. I know this because I've cammed alongside girls who do this religiously. Love it or hate it, everyone has their own hustle. But I digress. I think the membersconfess twitter has me and so many other models realizing even more than ever that we're under a god damn microscope 24/7. It makes me not even want to tweet. It makes me even more self conscious than ever before about what I say on camera. My attempts at communication obviously isn't conveying the message(s) I intend to put out into the world. I never really sat and thought about how much each word I say, tweet I send out, etc has a direct affect on someone, but even if a girl is trying to be nice and say thank you regardless of a slow night, it seems like it's easily received as a mixed message when to me it's pretty straightforward. I have had a lot of viewers over time who tweet passive aggressive stuff throughout the day but I try my best not to read into it or take it to heart. How can I know if they're doing it because of me or not? I don't unless they take it up with me personally. I honestly don't really see many camgirls being passive aggressive on twitter but I do see them venting and expressing dissatisfaction with slow shifts just as much as they boast screenshots of biggole tips. I hope that makes sense. Just my take on this situation, or at least the last few posts.

 

[JoleneBrody]

If only there was a right way and wrong, but unfortunately there isn't and the variables are endless!
This thread alone could convince a new girl that she needs to keep making custom videos for a guy who stopped tipping just because he is asking for it and tipped in the past... as most of us veterans know THAT guy is not her friend and this will not end well. Is she a bitch? The relationship the model normally has with any member can vary so much and many give extra off cam perks to tippers that would be insane to expect to continue.
Whereas models like myself who don't give extra perks off cam and run their rooms a certain social way would def be rude to stop being friendly with a tipper just because he started tipping less than before, as long as his demeanor didn't change.
It's just real quick to judge and jump sides when we don't know what the details are.

But this isn't what OP was saying anyway so meh!
Models beware of blanket statements, it could hurt the people you least want to hurt. We ALL do it (members love talking about models as a whole too) but we could give eachother slack when it's not the norm for that person especially after a bad stint of luck, eh?

 

[RogueWarrior]

Reading through this thread, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, and here's what I have gleaned:

The OP is bent out of shape about Tweets that were imperceptibly misconstrued as a referendum on his tipping habits though there was never any indication anything was directed towards him and now models are defending themselves and consoling him at the same time. Did I miss anything? That's high-level self-importance, narcissism, hypersensitivity and overestimation right there.

Personally, I don't follow any models on any form of social media. Tried it for a bit, was useless for me. Cool, you're online right now. I'm at work or at the bar or whatever. Not rushing to log in, I've got stuff to do.

I've had lean times. We all do. During those times, I tip less. But if I can't tip at all, I stay away. Anytime I was tipping less, I never, ever got the feeling that the model resented me or expected more. Hell, we're all human beings, we have our ups and downs.

This probably wasn't very helpful, but it started off as rant, may as well throw in my $0.02.