AmberCutie's Forum
An adult community for cam models and members to discuss all the things!

Models using stolen artwork?

  • ** WARNING - ACF CONTAINS ADULT CONTENT **
    Only persons aged 18 or over may read or post to the forums, without regard to whether an adult actually owns the registration or parental/guardian permission. AmberCutie's Forum (ACF) is for use by adults only and contains adult content. By continuing to use this site you are confirming that you are at least 18 years of age.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Kinky_Casey

Deactivated Account
Oct 12, 2015
83
137
33
Hey gals, I'm pretty new so bear with me here. I've searched the site for this but haven't found any topics on it. Basically I see a LOT of models using artwork that belongs to small, independent artists. This is artwork that is usually taken from a place like DeviantArt, and then the model either uses it to advertise on her page or incorporates it into her page design.

I'd like to know your thoughts on this. To me, it seems that using an artist's work without permission is probably against some sort of copyright laws. Now if you were using it just for your personal use, like having it as a desktop background or your phone screen, that's fine. But when you use an artist's work on your MFC page, wouldn't that be using another person's art to advertise and profit?

As an artist, if I found my work being used on another model's page, I would absolutely send a takedown notice and get serious with the legal side of things. I am not talking about using Disney characters or Van Gogh's almond blossoms. I mean the work by living, present day, working artists that make a living selling what they create.

I recently saw some Halo artwork that was from a very popular DeviantArt. I've also seen a lot of Game of Thrones fanart used in page design. None of these models have permission from the artist to use their work. I understand that no one is doing this intentionally, but I feel that it is still stealing.

What is your opinion on this? Would you be okay seeing your art as the background on a tip menu without your permission? Is this something that has been discussed before? Would love to know your thoughts!

I understand that this thread may be divisive but I think it's an issue that needs to be discussed. Thank you all in advance for your thoughts, opinions, personal stories, and research.
 
Honestly I dont care if it's a current artist or Van Gogh, it's theft. Its a copyright violation for sure. If I saw my art being used without permission in any way i'd surely be sending DMCAs fast as possible. No people may not have ill intent but as content creators who dont want our stuff stolen you would think girls would think twice before doing it to someone else. Its not even hard to ask the artist in a lot of cases to use their work as long as credit is given but I never see that happen on profiles. Like is it so hard to contact an artist and ask for something you love? No. Its just not. And if they refuse just find something else, make it yourself, use copyright free stuff instead. It's not a hard concept to grasp I dont think. But I see a ton of models using pics or graphics all the time they have zero rights to without so much as a credit to where it came from. They just google and steal. Not very cool IMHO.
 
Honestly I dont care if it's a current artist or Van Gogh it's theft. Its a copyright violation for sure. If I saw my art being used without permission n any way i'd surely be sending DMCAs fast as possible. No people may not have ill intent but as content creators who dont want our stuff stolen you would think girls would think twice before doing it to someone else. Its not even hard to ask the artist in a lot of cases to use their work as long as credit is given but I never see that happen on profiles. Like is it so hard to contact an artist and ask for something you love? No. Its just not. And if they refuse just find something else, make it yourself, use copyright free stuff instead. It's not a hard concept to grasp I dont think. But I see a ton of models using pics or graphics all the time they have zero rights to without so much as a credit to where it came from. They just google and steal. Not very cool IMHO.
Have you ever DMCA'd stuff?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Guy
Are we working under the assumption that this is art being used without permission, then? After all, how would a passive observer really know whether the model has obtained permission to use someone else's artwork or not?

Anyway, assuming that the work has indeed been "stolen", it's still often not a binary issue, at least as far rights are concerned. Decades of corporate meddling, the rise of the international marketplace, and the internet have made intellectual property law murky realm. Judging who possesses what protections, under what law, and under whose jurisdiction can all quickly become hard to discern, and knowledge of the law becomes pretty important, as well as a willingness to judge the situation on a case-by-case basis.

I'll use a couple of situations brought up in this thread as examples.

I recently saw some Halo artwork that was from a very popular DeviantArt. I've also seen a lot of Game of Thrones fanart used in page design. None of these models have permission from the artist to use their work. I understand that no one is doing this intentionally, but I feel that it is still stealing.

Fanart is a complex issue, since it is so prolifically published on the internet. However, when it comes to intellectual property, the rights issued to fanart are a great way to show that putting in the work does not automatically award an artist with rights. Fanart, by its nature, is derivative, and control over the rights to derivative works generally goes to the original property owner. So, when it comes to Halo or GoT, the artists who made the fanart have no legal recourse to keep others from using that work, because Microsoft owns Halo and George RR Martin owns GoT (and HBO has the TV rights to it, which -- to my knowledge -- would cover the likenesses most often used in GoT fanart these days, so that just further complicates issues of who gets say over a property... like I said, murky.) If the artist wanted to stop unsolicited use of the work they've done, they would have to get Microsoft or GRRM (possible HBO) involved.

Fanart is such a gray area. It's generally tolerated by IP owners, if not actively promoted by them. It's often seen as a positive aspect of content creation, and a way to build good will within a fan community. Often, IP owners don't even mind if fanart is used to make a bit of money for the artists who make it. However -- I will repeat this because it can't be stated enough -- fanart is inherently derivative, and the rights to control derivative works are owned by the original IP owner, not the artist of the derivative piece. In the case of fanart, permission to make it and publish it is often implicitly given, but it isn't usually actively expressed. And there are rights holders out there who just lock that shit down. Anne McCaffrey has been (in)famously controlling of her property, as has Anne Rice. Something about the name Anne, I guess.

Anyway, the bottom line is this: you can't have "stolen" what you don't own. Despite all the hard work and good will that goes into making fanart, ultimately, the fanartist has no legal control over its use. I know that flies in the face of common sense, but hey, that's IP law.

Murky murky murky.

...Van Gogh... Its a copyright violation for sure....

No. No, it's not.

The public domain is a thing that exists. Copyright protections can and do expire. Generally speaking, any works published before 1923 fall within the public domain, leaving most of human expression free to exploit. Of course, regarding anything published after 1923, judging whether something might be in the public domain grows ever murkier. However, you, I, and everybody else can do anything they see fit with the image of a Van Gogh painting, and that includes posting it on a model's profile. This is pretty cut and dry.

Right now, there are three different versions of Sherlock Holmes present in popular media because Sherlock Holmes exists in the public domain. Same with the land of Oz and its inhabitants, which has spawned works like Wicked, both the book by Gregory Maguire and the Broadway musical adaptation. To make things complicated, if I made art that looked like Sherlock Cumberbatch, that would be fanart, and subject to copyright law -- the same goes for Maguire's version of the Wicked Witch of the West, Elphaba. Keep the characters based upon or riffing off of Baum's or Doyle's original descriptions of the characters, I'd be home free. If I wanted to write and illustrate a pornographic crossover, where Holmes ends up in Oz, and receives a handy from tWWotW, that would be perfectly legal. That... that actually sounds kind of awesome. I might just do that.

Hell, I could even reference recent works if I wanted to, since fair use under parody is also a thing that exists. Also, if anyone wants to try to get to The Wonderful Wicked Witch of the West and the Holmes Handjob before I do, you can, since ideas and titles can't be copyrighted. Only expressions (creative works) can be copyrighted.

Murky.

I've been a working artist for the better part of twenty years. I actually love publishing, and I (obviously) am fascinated by intellectual property law. On a personal level, I tend to believe that given the the ease of information exchange that is part of our current cultural makeup, publishing your work, especially on the internet, is essentially giving it to the world. If I'm going to err in my interpretation of intellectual property law, I'd rather err on the side of its spirit -- which is to incentivize creators to continue creating, while fostering free communication through the use of creative works. you can't do that if you're utterly paranoid about your rights, and ready to send takedown notices if you find your art on someone else's web page. Obviously, being asked permission is the best thing, but unless I'm actually being financially harmed by a misappropriation, I figure it's going to be alright.

TL;DR: I don't own that picture of Master Chief finger-banging Cersei Lannister, so I guess it's fair game. I do, however, own that picture of Dr. Watson living out his automaton fantasies with the Tin Man of Oz, but you can use it anyway. Unless you make a movie out of it and try to cut me out of the deal. Then I will SUE YOU!

EDITED ADDENDUM: I wanted to link a couple of other pages, because I think they're interesting.

Here's some case law on image rights, to show just how deep this stuff goes.
Here's a page on how Australia treats fanart, because it's important to be aware that copyright law is not internationally universal. There are about a dozen treaties that try to bring things generally in line with each other, but not all member nations are the same. Misappropriation might be well-defined in your country, but it may well not be elsewhere in the world and on the internet.

Murky!
 
Last edited:
If someone takes a pic the artist uploaded on DeviantArt without their permission then it's stolen. And again as models we should not be stealing from other content creators. Even if that art is fan art or the person who drew/painted/etc doesnt own the original rights or it's in public domain you are still taking something someone else created and using it for your own gain without the simple act of ASKING THEM OR GIVING CREDIT. Its shitty and fucked up as a camgirl to do.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CherryChu and Guy
I've used random clip art and images found online for random graphics and such.

But one thing I was very adamant about was not selling physical swag with anything but my original artwork on it. I had a friend design my "Cooties" for me so that I wasn't outright selling items with images/art/etc that isn't my own. I think taking a Disney image or otherwise well known character/cartoon/image and printing it on swag is probably the worst form of "stealing" for own profit there is in cam land. And I've seen it happen, even by cam girls who are held in high acclaim.
 
Are we working under the assumption that this is art being used without permission, then? After all, how would a passive observer really know whether the model has obtained permission to use someone else's artwork or not?

Very true! I'm just an observer, I have no idea if the model asked for permission or not. Your whole post is amazing and EXACTLY what I was looking for. I completely forgot about how murky it gets with fan art! Most of the art I find on model's pages is fan art. Of course it isn't cool, but it also isn't downright illegal.

I think one of the only copyrights still in effect that was created prior to 1923 is Peter Pan, right? The copyright that never grows up! Well, in certain countries. For a few more years at least.

If I wanted to write and illustrate a pornographic crossover, where Holmes ends up in Oz, and receives a handy from tWWotW, that would be perfectly legal. That... that actually sounds kind of awesome. I might just do that.

If you do write and illustrate that....I uhhh...I know...uh..my friend, um, would want a copy...

o___o
 
  • Like
Reactions: zippypinhead
I think one of the only copyrights still in effect that was created prior to 1923 is Peter Pan, right? The copyright that never grows up! Well, in certain countries. For a few more years at least.

Yeah, speaking of murky. Interestingly, though, since I'm in the U.S., I might have the legal grounds to finally start work on what will likely prove to be my opus: The Erotic Adventures of Captain Hook and the Mermaids.

@Teagan I don't disagree with you that content creators should have a minimum of respect for other content creators, and that the least a person could do is seek permission for use. However, I wrote 1,200 words above in an attempt to instill the fact that there are a lot of legal ambiguities in the realm of intellectual property. As is the case with law, there is no "for sure." There are similar moral ambiguities that arise in this issue, as well, which is why things like fair use doctrines exist.

I could write a whole lot more, but I won't.

Models, be nice. Ask permission. Indeed, maybe even offer payment or trade for use. Quid pro quo is what makes our free market go 'round.
 
Oh I understand. Im not discounting the laws or anything you posted about or that things do get murky when it comes to a lot of materials. Sorry if it came off that way. You are right in that it's always not copyright infringement when it comes to certain things and I should have clarified I was speaking directly on actual current created art and not something like fan art which is different.
 
The thing about models using independent artists' work and us not knowing whether they have permission or not is that they almost certainly don't because an independent artist would want to be credited, even in smallprint at the bottom of the page or something. As camgirls we ought to know what it's like... I've seen camgirls on Tumblr reblogging pictures of themselves that someone else had uploaded without credit, adding a caption asking them not to steal or re-upload or to at least credit them. It's pretty much the same thing. There are a lot of places you can go to for free art so we really ought to be using them, doing our own art, or just asking and crediting.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Guy
The thing about models using independent artists' work and us not knowing whether they have permission or not is that they almost certainly don't because an independent artist would want to be credited, even in smallprint at the bottom of the page or something.

I think that's also not so absolute. Personally, I don't care about attribution, for the same reasons I'd stated at the end of my long post above. Once I put something online, I just expect that it's become part of the ether of the internet. Some artists are like me, some artists try to be really tight about controlling how and where their work appears on the internet, and most artists fall on a spectrum in-between.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gen
Wanted to add that I've used art on my profile before that was made by a friend, who gave permission to use it but didn't want a link back because his art is linked to his real name. So if someone saw it, they may have thought it was stolen or uncredited, but it was all kosher. Different situations for different folks but just wanted to give an example of what might appear to be uncredited but isn't!
 
Wanted to add that I've used art on my profile before that was made by a friend, who gave permission to use it but didn't want a link back because his art is linked to his real name. So if someone saw it, they may have thought it was stolen or uncredited, but it was all kosher. Different situations for different folks but just wanted to give an example of what might appear to be uncredited but isn't!

I'm glad you brought that up. I was tempted to do so, but I didn't want to come off as callous. This may sound strange, but an artist's work and an artist's name are different assets in the market. I've run up against this sort of thing, as well. There are definitely situations where I would allow my work to be used but do so without signing my name.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gen
Hello. Vanilla-world artist here. If I saw someone using my art for their profile, I'd definitely demand compensation of some kind. To put it in perspective, as a fine arts painter, each of my paintings takes 20+ hours to finish, so yes, even if I'm not selling it, it still takes a great deal of time and you owe me for that. People who don't want to pay artists for their work? Are the same people who are okay with pornhub sharing their porn without compensation.
 
Speaking as an artist and a sex worker, this is something very close to my heart - just as I wouldn't want my photosets or my videos posted without permission, I wouldn't want my artwork posted in a similar fashion. Personally this is because I'm trying to make a living off of any content I create, including my art; a lot of it is available as prints and on merchandise, and stealing images that I'm trying to sell limits potential revenue if people who see it can't find a way back to where it's being sold. Same as sw content, really. Like Zippy said this isn't applicable to everyone, but I think that because this is applicable to so many artists on the internet it's a good idea to be respectful first and foremost, instead of assuming any image you find is free to use (which unfortunately I feel a lot of people do these days).

If you actually look around on on DeviantArt for images to use in your graphics, these days a lot of them will let you know in the image description whether or not they're with others using their artwork. If they don't, it never hurts to ask. And hey, if you're not sure, crediting them is always nice, even if it's unnecessary/they don't require you to. I know that I wouldn't care if some of my old, old art was being used, but it's always nice to have some extra traffic heading over to my art blog or what have you.

Seeing as we're on the topic of borrowing artwork though, thought I might throw out here that CreativeMarket has free goods for download every week. They're royalty free and often you can find things that are available for download that you can include in content that you plan to sell - super useful for sex work content and artwork alike.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.