Pirating Content

[Poison_Ivy21]

No judgments, just curious about statistics.

 

[JerryBoBerry]

My own thoughts on piracy are best paraphrased from a [now deceased] publisher of Science Fiction books. Jim Baen, of Baen books, he use to have discussions on a forum for his publishing website. He started selling his books in electronic format before any other publisher that I know of. His theory on selling his E-Books was to never encrypt them. This resulted in his books being out there for download on sites pretty much the day they went on sale. So this naturally led to many discussions on the topic.

He always said (paraphrasing from many posts here) he'd rather have stuff unencrypted so it made it easier to steal. Some people that will steal his stuff would never have been his customers anyway. So there is no business loss there. For the people who do buy his books he'd rather not treat them like criminals and encrypt everything. Automatically assuming your paying customers will steal it if you don't encrypt is really bad for trust and business.

And then there's a third category. People who are honest, but just can't afford it right now due to hard times. And there were many people like this he said. These people he was always especially happy they stole his books. Because those are the ones who, when they get back on their feet, are his future customers.

Think about it. The books they could get the easiest were his, and they liked them well enough they'd steal them and maybe even discover more authors they liked. When they did have money and started actually buying again who do you think they'd spend it on? The books that were encrypted and they never read, or the author they pirated eight of his series and the 9th is just coming out when they happen to have money to spare again?

So it was all very simple to him. One, you have people who would have never been paying customers, no loss there. Two, you have people who already pay, no loss there. And three, you have people who will potentially pay in the future. It's a no-brainer situation.

Pretty much summed up the whole thing for me right there. I'm okay with people pirating stuff.

The people downloading movies from PirateBay, does anyone honestly think those people would have ever in their lives bought those movies anyway? Ooh, here's a piece of shit movie in French starring no one I've ever heard of. Well NOW I don't have to spend $30 on that import! The world doesn't work that way.

As a side note. There was also several other authors who put sales records of their books up for public display. They showed their pirated books actually made them more money than they were making prior. They could track when older books were put out in electronic edition, sales of their new books increased. Pirating actually helped increase their sales.

Author Eric Flint did many articles on the subject relating to them putting books on their own website for free to anyone and the increase in sales that followed.

http://www.baen.com/library/prime_palaver.asp
#6 is especially interesting into the actual financials of piracy.
http://www.baen.com/library/prime_palaver6.asp

I read your reply in another thread to someone who mentioned they pirated stuff so I know where your thinking is already on the matter. I pretty much summed up mine in a post over a year ago. So i'll just quote it again here.

 

[Shaun__]

Sometimes I will get stuff if I cannot buy it digitally, but I would much rather go to an online store and legally download it or go to a website to legally watch it.

 

[LuckySmiles]

I still have ipods, and ripped cd's full of music originally downloaded from napster.. and what was the other one... Limewire! a few other programs... Dusts off cane.
no guilt. I didn't have the money in high school and college to pay for all them there fancy pants cds. And radio at the time had already began the decline in NYC of with most stations being bought up by clearchannel which is iheartradio now. lame.

Those years would have been a lot suckier without quality tunes.

Now I never pay for music or pirate it. I just don't care that much. Being old and all.
Might pay for an itune here or there but rarely. I'll pay for reasonable concert tickets once in awhile.
Mostly use pandora on my phone at the gym and car until I get bored of it. Don't like XM radio either. Even more repetitive.
I prefer detroit's regular radio stations though. They're actually way better than new york's. Still a few less sell-out'y one's on there.

when I was 12 I recorded songs off of the radio with blank tapes just like everyone else.
Didn't ruin music. Or VCR recordings off of the television before you had DVR's (fuck me I'm dating myself)

But music is supposed to be freely out there... it's just that radio started sucking so hard at what they would play. Now there are artists now who wouldn't even have gotten to the point of mainstream play without putting there stuff out there for free on youtube or even myspace a few years ago

I think it's kind of the same idea for everything. it's all still changing and evolving in the way it's distributed and hasn't quite settled down yet. Or maybe it's always been this way.

debating getting a record player and some vinyl records when I have more disposable income and becoming THAT person. haha. Vinyl sales actually have been going back up recently a little bit for the first time in 20 years or however long since they were still the thing. Weird.

 

[Sevrin]

Meh. I pay for some, and don't pay for others. How many models pay royalties on the recorded music they play in their rooms, or else restrict their playlists to music with a CC license that permits commercial use? I'm not interested in a fight here, but I just want to make it the point that no one's hands are clean when it comes to infringing intellectual property rights.

 

[Gen]

I torrent I download a few movies here and there (maybe one a month?), rip music off of Youtube (had a friend get mad at me for this, not because of the stealing, but because of the terrible quality ), and I download quite a few comics.

With the comics - I only have a limited budget for comics every week, so I prioritize what I buy. For single issues, the majority of my pull list is indie comics because I feel that my monthly support makes a bigger difference to them than it does to DC or Marvel. (I do have a few DC books on my list, mostly the ones I am really rooting for.) A lot of the comics I download, I end up buying in trades eventually anyways. So they do still get my money but not as much, and not right away. There have been many series that I've downloaded and then immediately gone out to buy because I loved them. So, while I don't try to justify my torrenting as anything but stealing, it has helped me to discover some new series that I would have otherwise not found, and helped me to find creators who I then proceed to throw money at.

Having said all of that - I now have paid subscriptions to Netflix, Marvel Unlimited, and Spotify. I haven't downloaded any music since I got Spotify, and frankly I am fine to wait six months for Marvel Unlimited to catch up on newer comics. It makes me super happy to be able to read an unlimited amount of books without having to torrent them. If I had a DC equivalent I'd be so fucking happy. Hopefully one day. Streaming services have definitely reduced my thieving ways. (Also I got a notice from my internet provider because I downloaded Iron Man 3, which did scare me a little.)

Definitely don't think I'm doing a good thing, but do I get points for honesty?!

 

[Ann_Sulu]

My rules are, I do it if I can't seem get it anywhere else, or if it looks like a crap movie, then I'll watch it online. If the movie turns out to be good, I'll buy it. I have Netflix, so I get a good chunk of them through there. My mom's a writer, who instilled in me the realization of how bad it is to screw over the person who makes the content, I hate the idea of something for nothing. At the same time however, some things feel just too good to pass up.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

I pay for cable and a few subscriptions and download the rest. Don't think I've ever paid for normal porn. Don't really even watch mainstream porn but once in a while I'll download a scene or two. Have no guilt about downloading music I already paid for at a younger age. Download movies I plan on buying all the time. Mad Max 1080p rip leaked a few days ago, will buy the blu ray when it comes out but I don't feel like waiting until then to watch it. Don't dl games but mostly because I don't game much on PC. Will sometimes dl comics I'm not sure if I'm interested in or if I buy a sweet variant cover and I don't want it touched too much. Have to download some foreign mma/wrasslin because I can't watch it any other way. Have to download some old shows that haven't been released for purchase. Sometimes dl keygens or craks or whatever to make sure a program will do exactly what I need it to do before buying. No saint but not as bad as some I know.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Porn on occasion, the occasional album if it's not on Spotify and I'm not overly familiar with the band, and that's it really. Between Spotify, Netflix (all regions), Sky TV, WWE Network, PlayStation Plus, etc. I have most of my entertainment needs sorted, so find it harder to justify downloading things for free rather than supporting the artist and paying for them.

 

[JickyJuly]

*stands in the torrent corner with Gen and is pretty happy to be there with her*

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

Meh. I pay for some, and don't pay for others. How many models pay royalties on the recorded music they play in their rooms, or else restrict their playlists to music with a CC license that permits commercial use? I'm not interested in a fight here, but I just want to make it the point that no one's hands are clean when it comes to infringing intellectual property rights.

First off, I stated that I'm not hear to make any judgements about what anyone does. I have no control over what anyone else chooses to do with their internet connection, so to each their own. Personally, I choose to pay for all my media content, doesn't make me better than anyone else. I'm still guilty of doing plenty of shitty things. We are all flawed humans, no big deal. I was just interested to see what everyone, particularly other models, had to say on this subject.

Now, I use Spotify premium and thats what I play music from in my cam room. Artists are compensated based on the amount of plays their songs get. So thanks to the wonderful way Spotify is set up, I am "paying my royalties" for the music I play in my cam room. I have read their terms and conditions, and I am not violating them. Their policies on commercial use would be violated if I made and sold videos with Spotify music playing in the background, but I don't make videos so that is not an issue. Live cam shows are a different story because the artist is getting compensated every single time a play a song. Unless people record my shows, but thats them breaking the law, not me.

I put forth as much effort as possible avoid violating copyright laws because it's something I personally care about. Some people's hands are actually clean here, assumptions never do any good.

Like my daddy has always told me, "Assume, makes an ass out of you & me."

 

[Sevrin]

Now, I use Spotify premium and thats what I play music from in my cam room. Artists are compensated based on the amount of plays their songs get. So thanks to the wonderful way Spotify is set up, I am "paying my royalties" for the music I play in my cam room. I have read their terms and conditions, and I am not violating them. Their policies on commercial use would be violated if I made and sold videos with Spotify music playing in the background, but I don't make videos so that is not an issue. Live cam shows are a different story because the artist is getting compensated every single time a play a song. Unless people record my shows, but thats them breaking the law, not me.

I put forth as much effort as possible avoid violating copyright laws because it's something I personally care about. Some people's hands are actually clean here, assumptions never do any good.

Like my daddy has always told me, "Assume, makes an ass out of you & me."

Your Spotify subscription allows for personal, non-commercial use only. By playing your Spotifiy on cam, you are violating your agreement with them. It's the same with the music you'd hear in a bar or a store or whatever. The songwriters and publishers are entitled to royalties (not the performer, unless they're also the songwriter).

 

[KylieJacobs]

I used bit torrent for some things several years ago until I got a horrible virus/worm/etc that made it impossible to do anything on my computer. I ended up having to completely wipe my computer and reinstall windows. Haven't touched a torrent site ever since!

 

[zippypinhead]

This isn't a simple black and white issue. "Piracy" is not just torrenting or streaming media through nefarious means. In fact, I don't think it's actually possible to use the internet as a normal user does on a daily basis without committing acts of piracy all the time, largely without even awareness of the transgression. If we're considering piracy the act of accessing media without paying people who produced or published that media, then I'm sorry to say, the internet is a system that has been set up (through an organic evolution of how content is produced, displayed, and consumed electronically over the last few decades) in a way that actively promotes free distribution -- in essence, for the most part, piracy. People don't think of it that way, when they hit the "like" or "share" button on that video they saw on their Facebook feed, but nine times out of ten, they've just helped disseminate a piece of media without the expressed consent of the producer, and without the producer profiting from it. Yarr. I suppose it be fittin' thet thar Facebook be havin' a "English (Pirate)" settin' in its language options.

The point is, no matter how conscientious you are, you're going to accidentally commit copyright infringement all the time on the internet. Copyright laws pretty much as we know them were written before the internet was really a thing, and they simply do not address the way the internet works in a realistic fashion. The DMCA, which is still what people use to try to govern works published on the internet was enacted nearly 20 years ago, with no clear picture of what digital media and internet culture would become. Infamous "internet killer" bills that have been introduced over the last few years, like SOPA, would have "killed" the internet because they sought to update the law for the internet, and enact ways to enforce copyright, thus stifling the free distribution model that the internet represents today. So, what you and any reasonable person would consider to be simple, harmless personal consumption, the law would generally consider to be infringement, and since the internet is a form of mass communication, that makes you complicit in piracy, so, y'know... walk der plank er be keel hauled, yar filthy swashbucklin' pirate lot o' ye!

There's no way I could answer anything but "yes" to all of the given options, and I doubt very much that any one of us could make a different claim. It doesn't matter that I don't torrent, and I try to stay away from the seedier corners of the Wide Wide World of Web these days. It doesn't matter that I subscribe to no less than half a dozen reputable streaming services of various media. Because, the thing is, there's a double whammy at play here. It isn't just the attitude and function of the internet that makes us all pirates. It's also the attitude and function of those laws, especially when they cross international borders, that often ties the hands of media producers and publishers from actually allowing people to get to their material legally due to regional restrictions. Not all IP laws line up from nation to nation, and not all material is covered for international consumption. Restrictions apply. Regions get locked. And, yo ho ho, it can get really odd at times.

For example: I love me some British panel shows. As far as I know, there is no legal way for me to actually watch British panel shows (except for QI, which just came to Hulu! woo-hoo!) without a convoluted use of dummy postal codes and vpn services and all sorts of espionage shenanigans. It's easier and less creepy for me to just watch streams of Would I Lie to You? posted on Youtube, so that's what I do. I'd be willing to pay for the BBC iPlayer, but that shit ain't happening in the U.S., thanks to American cable providers. So... arr matey.

TL;DR -- Arr, da best we all might be hopin' fer, is to be payin' fer what we can, an be havin' an awareness of how da internet be workin' agin the laws in ways that be makin' us all filthy scallywag, media-stealin', rum-drinkin', wench-appreciatin' PIRATES, sailin' da high virtual seas, lookin' at misbegotten booty. Yarr harr, fiddle-dee-dee!

 

[zippypinhead]

Also, there should be an option for games in the survey. Plenty of games get pirated.

 

[weirdbr]

I used to pirate a ton of stuff when I was young/broke and even ended up becoming an admin on a forum dedicated to that (which is long gone). But these days I buy all I want and pirate only music (in specific cases) and tv shows/movies.

For music, there's two possible situations where I do it:
- (99.9% of the time) I already ordered the physical copy online and cant wait for it to arrive to listen to it: I always preorder content from bands I like as soon as I hear they have something new coming out, but most record labels and stores I buy from have the habit of shipping the order after/on the release date, which means I get it a week or two after that (thanks to customs taking a bit too long). I get why they do it (to prevent pre-release leaks) , but is stupid - the majority of rips that end up online come from insider leaks and people who got it early (stores that started selling it too early, maybe amazon shipped it before the release and someone got it a day or two earlier, etc).
- it's a band I am checking out for the first time to see if it's worth buying their content; if I like it, I buy the CDs/DVDs I liked and if not, I just delete the files.

For TV shows and movies, I have no reservations and download as much as I want. Thanks to my work I hear a lot about the supposed limitations that prevent easy worldwide distribution, but the reality that no one wants to say out loud is that if the content producers/distributors wanted, they could fix this: they are the ones signing exclusivity deals with regional/national companies that then limit access to the content while online services keep trying (in private negotiations) to have this changed. So until they make it easy for me to give them money in exchange for access to their content, I'll keep downloading.

 

[fandango]

I'm from the UK and I download a lot of American TV shows because over here they often arent shown for weeks or even months after they originally aired and sometimes not at all. If they were available here at the same time then I wouldnt have to bother. Big movies I like to see at the cinema and sometimes I download a movie if its something I really want to watch but not that often, I normally just wait for them to come to Sky movies. I used to download lots of music when I was a teenager but now I just have a Spotify premium account and haven't illegally downloaded any music for ages.

So to sum up I only download what I can't find legitimately and used to download a lot more when I coulnt afford it. Now I'm older, not a student anymore and earn decent money I can just afford to buy whatever I want to see.

Overall I have no problem with piracy and if my circumstances changed then I would do it again.

 

[Phoebe]

I download everything for free. If I like it, I'll pay for it later. If I don't, I'll forget it anyways

 

[Snowie1969]

I want to pay for the entertainment I see and hear so I buy DVD's and CD's or MP3 files whenever I can, however, it's estimated that only 17% of the music put on records has been digitised to CD and MP3 formats... The music industry has been lacking a bit in that respect. Also, I think it's ridiculous that they still want top prize for music and video that's 30 years old. $25 for a new album (as is normal here in Holland) sure.. 25 for an album 30 years old.. sorry