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Should mental health be tracked by cam sites?

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Oct 5, 2016
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This probably a very difficult topic but it's long overdue to be discussed. Thinking about the article that was discussed in this post, while it doesn't say the model had mental health issues, the inability to say no to the point were it goes again self-preservation doesn't sound normal at all. If members can face legal issues because they are unknowingly dealing with models that might mental condition where that make them unable to be legal responsible for themselves, should sites need to record this? Sites operate off fantasy and wish fulfillment when a model has some condition were fantasy and reality can be too grey should something be done?

For models this would add a new hurdle and also hurt the work of models that do have diagnosed conditions that they properly manage but if members can take legal blame for a model not using reason on their limits sites need a way to cover the liability. Can we no longer trust the word of the model when it comes to if they have the mental authority to consent or not consent and leave it to a 3rd party to evaluate?

TL;DR Should sites require a psych exam or other proof a model doesn't have a mental issue that would normal not allow her to make legal decisions for herself? Should psych exams be a normal requirement after certain periods of camming due to the mental stress that are place on models over long periods of time? Should a failing psych exam prevent models from further working on sites?
 

AlexaCrush

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Fuck no. That would be incredibly invasive for a site to do that, and would create a huge barrier for many models looking to get into the industry. They don't need to to know my mental health status. Who's to say what the threshold is for camming? Is anyone with bipolar disorder out? What if you've been diagnosed with depression in the past but have since dealt with it? What happens if that information leaks or becomes compramised in some way?
On top of that, there are people in every other industry who take advantage of people who are naive/gullible/desperate/trusting/mentally ill. Should we be submitting every cashier at the grocery store to a mental health exam on the off chance their boss is going to abuse their power?
People who abuse others have an incredible way of getting into their victims heads; there are hundreds of stories of women getting beaten by their boyfriends and bystanders going to help them, only for the woman to freak out the person helping her because they don't want their boyfriend to get arrested or hurt. It completely goes against all logic but it happens anyways because the abuser is so into their heads and has twisted everything around. You don't have to have a mental health disorder for this to happen.

I think the bigger problem is a) women get socialized to always be nice and caring and never rude, and so often lack the ability to stand up for themselves when they're boundaries get pushed, b) mental health is still very stigmatized, and for many people just the idea of talking to a therapist is like admitting they're a loony failure at life, and c) abusers often target vulnerable people, and sex workers are vulnerable in that a huge part of the population simply doesn't give a fuck about us (just look at the comments in that article). Making sex workers take mental health assessments isn't going to help them.

The impression I get from that article is that the man who was watching her cam has been doing so for a while, and had probably used abusive techniques to get into her head and get her to the point where she did something dangerous like that. On top of that, he did absolutely nothing to help her when it was apparent something was wrong, which to me says a lot more about his mental health than hers. This article made me think of a story I read a few years ago; a man was drowning and some teenage boys filmed it. They didn't call the police, they didn't try to save him or get help, they just watched as he died. Could they have saved him if they'd gone for help? Maybe. Maybe not. But the fact that they didn't do a damn thing says a hell of a lot about them. That's a hell of lot less 'normal' to me than being a desperate, naive woman trying to make some money.
 
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I would disagree about how to help in that situation. One thing concerning the article is we don't know if this was through a site or some other arrangement. It's one thing to have it on site and try to contact support as quick as they can react (which probably would never be fast enough to save a life unfortunately) vs maybe a skype call where you might not even know the town the person lives in.

Models can be men and women and anyone can be equally manipulated especially if they already compromised mental health. That youtube streamer that just died was MALE and I don't know being on youtube trying to get clicks was helping his mental condition. Gender doesn't make you immune to depression or other mental illnesses. Entertainment industry is very lucrative but extremely stressful because fantasy standards are often at odd with reality. Members are not psychic and can't be held to understand the actual mental state of the model they're interacting with if it's never disclosed.

There's a reason child entertainers have laws governing how they can work in entertainment. SW is also entertainment based industry but if you're going to place all blame on the VIEWER then you need a way for that viewer to know if the model has the mental status to make consent.
 

JickyJuly

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Nope. Getting age verifying documents and tax info for independent contractors is enough. Folks who have trouble saying no or are too desperate for money to say no are in danger everywhere, not just on sex sites. Would you feel the need to protect the performer if she were a he? Really the only people who need psych exams to qualify for their jobs are those who will take the lives of others into their hands. Using a camsite properly definitely doesn't meet that standard. There's no reason to pretend this situation is the norm or that either party is the norm.

Edit to add: If she was taking money off site, whatever payment processors or sites she used could probably be held liable as well now with the Sesta/Fosta stuff too. Is that right? Or am I misunderstanding the extent of things?

but if you're going to place all blame on the VIEWER then you need a way for that viewer to know if the model has the mental status to make consent.
What makes you feel that all the blame is being put on the viewer? There are many things and many ways that an internet performer could be held legally liable for damage to a client.
 
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What makes you feel that all the blame is being put on the viewer? There are many things and many ways that an internet performer could be held legally liable for damage to a client.

Did you read that article? They are taking the viewer to court for her death even though as if he killed her himself.
 

JickyJuly

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Did you read that article? They are taking the viewer to court for her death even though as if he killed her himself.
I read. He's being charged with manslaughter in her death because he was a part of her action and didn't respond when that action took her life. The same thing happens when people do drugs together and fail to get someone who's overdosed help. They don't want to get in trouble, or they're too high to figure it out or too ashamed. Just because she consented to something risky doesn't mean there's not enough blame to go around for her death to get on her audience.
 
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From what I've read about the awful situation, it happened off site.

Also, all cam sites require performers to read what is and isnt allowed. When it comes to fetish/bdsm etc, they are very specific. On nf, you cant even talk about having 4 limbs bound, on sm you cant put anything around your neck to choke yourself, etc. There are limitation on toys size, permissions needed for fuckmachines, no fisting etc. I've reached out to support for permission before doing bondage shows or things that could "appear" risky to the viewer, but in reality I have experience and I'm being safe. With all that, accidents can happen. Autoerotic asphyxiation is a thing.

It seems that the "viewer" in this case has been charged with having "extreme" pornography on his computer, along with potential snuff type stuff. I dont know how UK laws work, or what constitutes extreme material, but it doesnt seem like he is just an innocent bystander. He could have done something to get her help, even just reporting it to authorities, but he didn't. How long did he sit and watch what happened, did he record it etc.

This may have nothing at all to do with her mental health. This may have nothing at all to do with her being desperate for money and not being able to say no. I know that I am in a shit state with my mental health- yet I am fully able to consent to acts, say no, create boundaries etc. Many people choose this industry because their mental health makes it hard for them to function in a normal 9-5 structured life. Hell, this job- and my hard work, has made me be able to afford really great healthcare, so that I can make my mental health a priority. This industry has given me the tools to really flourish away from a typical job, and the ability to take time off if I need it. All prescreening or psych evaluations would do is add more stigma to people who are already choosing a career that is not mainstream.
 
Absolutely not.

There is already SO much stigma against mentally ill people. Being forced to take a psych test to perform on cam would keep a lot of people who rely on cam as their sole income due to not being able to work vanilla jobs because of a mental illness. It would be impossible to evaluate every single model and find some level to accept/deny them. I.E I have self harm tendencies and take medication--would that rule me out?Or would I have to somehow prove/explain I'm able to consent? It's just too complicated. It would just be too difficult and time consuming for anyone to evaluate people's mental health and somehow determine that they're able to consent on a case by case basis.
 

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Should we require all members to pass psych evaluations before they are allowed to book a show with a model, to ensure they are stable enough to interact with a model in a healthy manner?
 

AlexaCrush

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I would disagree about how to help in that situation. One thing concerning the article is we don't know if this was through a site or some other arrangement. It's one thing to have it on site and try to contact support as quick as they can react (which probably would never be fast enough to save a life unfortunately) vs maybe a skype call where you might not even know the town the person lives in.

Models can be men and women and anyone can be equally manipulated especially if they already compromised mental health. That youtube streamer that just died was MALE and I don't know being on youtube trying to get clicks was helping his mental condition. Gender doesn't make you immune to depression or other mental illnesses. Entertainment industry is very lucrative but extremely stressful because fantasy standards are often at odd with reality. Members are not psychic and can't be held to understand the actual mental state of the model they're interacting with if it's never disclosed.

There's a reason child entertainers have laws governing how they can work in entertainment. SW is also entertainment based industry but if you're going to place all blame on the VIEWER then you need a way for that viewer to know if the model has the mental status to make consent.
Okay cool. Take away my point about women being conditioned to be nice and the message is still the same. There are loads of studies that show how easily people can be maneuvered to behave a certain way if they're under the right kind of pressure, mental illness or not. Making people take a screening before working isn't going to help anyone.
The viewer and the company someone works for have no right to know what someones mental health status is if the model doesn't want them to know. It would probably be a HIPAA violation anyway.

I don't think you really understand how painfully naive and trusting many new models are, how common mental illnesses of all kinds are, and how costly it would be to screen every single cam model on a regular basis to arbitrarily determine if they're mentally fit to work.
 
May 8, 2012
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Should a failing psych exam prevent models from further working on sites?

Is there anything in the article that suggests this incident could have been avoided by a psych exam?

We don't know how risky the activity was.
Nor do we know if the model & client under stood the risks.

Could it have been prevent with supervision? Or maybe some safety training? Or maybe a spotter?
We really don't know.
 

alibaba

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In a perfect world, yeah, definitely. The adult entertainment industry is riddled with mental health issues. Would be such a logistics nightmare that I'm not sure it could really be done. How would you differentiate those that are a danger from those that are simply different? The girls here are clearly learning disabled but I don't think they would be classified as mentally ill. A very complex situation that seems impossible to regulate fairly.
 

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In a perfect world, yeah,
In a perfect world, we'd also get some kind of assistance with health insurance as independent contractors. But I think this mental health thing falls in line with that. If a cam site is held to judge a contractor's mental state, they should also be helping with medical insurance to help cover any needs that come with getting mental health in line.

So long as the sites are just a platform, NOT AN EMPLOYER, there's only so much they should be involved with OR responsible for.
 

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JickyJuly

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In a perfect world, we'd also get some kind of assistance with health insurance as independent contractors. But I think this mental health thing falls in line with that. If a cam site is held to judge a contractor's mental state, they should also be helping with medical insurance to help cover any needs that come with getting mental health in line.

So long as the sites are just a platform, NOT AN EMPLOYER, there's only so much they should be involved with OR responsible for.
This is such a great point! Gah. I tried to poke through the marketplace (obamacare) insurance to see if there was anything I could afford. The lowest one (just for me. my kids/husband have their own) was like $800 per month with a $6,000 deductible. Who has it like that?
 
Oct 5, 2016
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Is there anything in the article that suggests this incident could have been avoided by a psych exam?

We don't know how risky the activity was.
Nor do we know if the model & client under stood the risks.

Could it have been prevent with supervision? Or maybe some safety training? Or maybe a spotter?
We really don't know.

The article didn't say anything about her mental health and we don't even know how these charges will hold up in court. So all of this is speculation. To me from what is there it sounds like a terrible accident while live and IF the viewer had any sense of real information about her to know where to begin to give her help.

But it made me start to think about the Michelle Carter case and how she was sent to jail for egging on her boyfriend to kill himself with completely understand the seriousness of his mental state. Then I was thinking about Britney Spears and how she is under legal guardianship and isn't allowed to make business decisions for herself legally.

It started to ask myself legally could Britney Spear's cam and if something happened to affect her mental state while camming who's to blame?
Then I asked. If a member is requesting a fantasy that unknowing to them has psychological impact on the model but that model is agreeing to it is she victimizing herself or is the unknowing member responsible.
Then I was thinking about reasons why the victim narrative around models keeps renewing and how much situations like this factor into that. 'All members are evil and abuse me even though I at no point said no or set limits'.

I simplied the thing and combines all these things which is blame. If models have control of their cam environment why are members constantly blamed for things? If it ever came to members being libel for a model's actions what would that mean for the sites. So I brought up the discussion.

The odd part about this so far is that from the responses hiding your illness if more important that getting help or making sure it's diagnosed correctly which was mind blowing to me. I went to a therapist for many years to work through my depression and other quirks and problems and by other realms of healthcare didn't cost all that much. I just see too much people in general diagnosing themselves with serious mental issues and feeling like it's something 'special' or positive. Maybe I'll reading too much twitter where saying you have a serious problem and people want to hand out trophies.

To me the only way that youtube streamer Etika would had been alive today is if his family could had involuntary committed him but they couldn't because they could never get him professionally diagnosed. It's heartbreaking to think taking someone's freedom away might had been the only way to save him.
 

JickyJuly

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I simplied the thing and combines all these things which is blame. If models have control of their cam environment why are members constantly blamed for things? If it ever came to members being libel for a model's actions what would that mean for the sites. So I brought up the discussion.
I think it's a pretty interesting discussion, and I'm glad you brought it up. I think there's a disconnect happening when you talk about members being blamed though. Maybe because you don't see all of the rules behind the camsite? If the roles were reversed, a model could totally be held to the same standard. Camsites and even clip sites have tons of rules to cover their own business and move legal liability to us. There are plenty of ways a camgirl could land herself behind bars just like this dude. I'm not sure either that anyone has suggested hiding mental illness is important. It's just important that people have healthcare privacy whenever it won't hurt others.

Etika's family likely wouldn't need a diagnosis to have him held. I'm not sure what the law is for his state, but here, if someone is threatening self harm, you can get them transported to the ER and if they deem it reasonable, they'll have the person held for 3 days.
 
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I think it's a pretty interesting discussion, and I'm glad you brought it up. I think there's a disconnect happening when you talk about members being blamed though. Maybe because you don't see all of the rules behind the camsite? If the roles were reversed, a model could totally be held to the same standard. Camsites and even clip sites have tons of rules to cover their own business and move legal liability to us. There are plenty of ways a camgirl could land herself behind bars just like this dude. I'm not sure either that anyone has suggested hiding mental illness is important. It's just important that people have healthcare privacy whenever it won't hurt others.

Etika's family likely wouldn't need a diagnosis to have him held. I'm not sure what the law is for his state, but here, if someone is threatening self harm, you can get them transported to the ER and if they deem it reasonable, they'll have the person held for 3 days.

He was in New York and he didn't threaten self harm. He made very odd statements and behavior like yelling and confronting police on a wellness check to the point they broke his door down. He then regressed himself and disconnected from his family. Whatever happened was very rapid deterioration of his mental state but his family knew he had other issues but due to his youtube income he could evade their interventions.
 
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Marceline

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The article didn't say anything about her mental health and we don't even know how these charges will hold up in court.

We do now how the charges will hold up in court.... they won't. There's not going to be any court proceedings because the guy was found dead in his jail cell.

Detective Inspector John Quilty said: “The death of Dangar ultimately prevented prosecutors from charging him in connection with Hope’s death as a result of sexually-related role play.

That's why the parents are now attacking the online adult industry, saying that since it is "unregulated" all it does allow men to perpetrate violence against women. Which is untrue, in my opinion,the industry is regulated, just take a peek at camsite's or clip site's rules. However, the parents are grieving the loss of their daughter and when people suddenly lose a loved one a lot of the times they want to place the blame on someone, and since the guy is dead they are shifting that blame over to the industry.

This has more to do with the member's mental health than hers. There's no way he could actually know what was going to happen, but judging from the fact that he had a collection of snuff porn and then didn't try to do anything to help her or alert someone, I'm sure he was at the very least hoping it would happen. More than likely, as has already been said here, he slowly manipulated her over time into doing progressively more dangerous acts and she needed the money and had a false sense of security throughout the situation so she agreed. Then, when the accident happened, she didn't have any safety measures in place because she didn't really know what she was doing and the dude more than likely wanted it to happen.

Either way, most of this is just speculation after the fact. The only two people who knows what truly happened died. This was a super tragic accident that is now going to shed more negative light on the adult industry.

And as far as the whole cam sites doing mental health screenings on models, I agree with everyone else who said that that would be ridiculous and also not at all feasibly possible.
 

paige_orion

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The article didn't say anything about her mental health and we don't even know how these charges will hold up in court. So all of this is speculation. To me from what is there it sounds like a terrible accident while live and IF the viewer had any sense of real information about her to know where to begin to give her help.

But it made me start to think about the Michelle Carter case and how she was sent to jail for egging on her boyfriend to kill himself with completely understand the seriousness of his mental state. Then I was thinking about Britney Spears and how she is under legal guardianship and isn't allowed to make business decisions for herself legally.

It started to ask myself legally could Britney Spear's cam and if something happened to affect her mental state while camming who's to blame?
Then I asked. If a member is requesting a fantasy that unknowing to them has psychological impact on the model but that model is agreeing to it is she victimizing herself or is the unknowing member responsible.
Then I was thinking about reasons why the victim narrative around models keeps renewing and how much situations like this factor into that. 'All members are evil and abuse me even though I at no point said no or set limits'.

I simplied the thing and combines all these things which is blame. If models have control of their cam environment why are members constantly blamed for things? If it ever came to members being libel for a model's actions what would that mean for the sites. So I brought up the discussion.

The odd part about this so far is that from the responses hiding your illness if more important that getting help or making sure it's diagnosed correctly which was mind blowing to me. I went to a therapist for many years to work through my depression and other quirks and problems and by other realms of healthcare didn't cost all that much. I just see too much people in general diagnosing themselves with serious mental issues and feeling like it's something 'special' or positive. Maybe I'll reading too much twitter where saying you have a serious problem and people want to hand out trophies.

To me the only way that youtube streamer Etika would had been alive today is if his family could had involuntary committed him but they couldn't because they could never get him professionally diagnosed. It's heartbreaking to think taking someone's freedom away might had been the only way to save him.

Honestly... It is legit way way WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY harder to have someone declared incapable of making their own legal decisions than you might imagine. Believe me. I spent years watching a close family member commit slow suicide in the worst possible way and although they were clearly VERY, VERY, VERY mentally unwell, they were still a legal adult. It didn't matter what lawyers I went to or the doctors I visited - they refused to help. And my family member died because of it. So.... It's a LOT harder than you'd think to take away someone's legal/medical rights over themselves, even when it could save their lives!

Britney Spears probably would still have legal rights over herself if she wasn't a multi-millionaire. When you have money and power, and when your Power of Attorney is fueled by greed and has thousands of dollars to throw at it, then yeah. It's a lot easier to take away someone's legal rights to make their own decisions. But for everyone else... I dunno. I've seen with my own eyes, someone very mentally unwell and very mentally unstable commit a slow suicide. And I WANTED them to lose the power to take care of themselves. And I tried, but it ain't that easy. Not for every day folk like us.

So I think it's pretty safe to assume that if a cam person is modelling, they have all legal rights over their own decisions and can legally consent or not consent. But not everyone consents to the fantasies that are dropped on us out of no where. And not everyone realizes the risks that some of these fantasies make involve, even the seemingly innocent ones (like the banana peel guy who wants girls to REALLY slip on banana peels in high heels - I'm convinced he's actually waiting for some girl to break her ankle, but that's another story).

But if we're worried about mental health - I'm still curious about your feelings on having members take that hypothetical psych evaluation test as well. You specifically state that, "If a member requesting a fantasy that unknowing to them has psychological impact on the model," - I mean... There are a handful of fantasies that I can think of that can be pretty traumatic. If you're worried about the model being mentally healthy enough to consent - are you also worried about the mental health of the people who might be jerking off to those potentially-psychologically damaging fantasies? I mean, you brought up the Michelle Carter case and her egging on her boyfriend. Clearly, he wasn't mentally well because he was suicidal. But she was clearly ALSO mentally unwell because.... she is probably a legit straight up sociopath.

So if we're worried about the mental health of models being unable to handle the potentially dark cam-fantasies, shouldn't we be just as worried about the members with those said fantasies? I mean, sure. If a model gets asked to act out a strangulation scenario in which she pretends to strangle herself and then falls limp and pretends to be dead for an additional ten minutes, as realistically as possible... Yeah, she has the power to block the person who asked. But shouldn't we ALSO be concerned about the member who jerks off to this fantasy of a beautiful dead girl, dying a violent fantasy death before his eyes? Because... I've received that fantasy request before. But I don't see anyone really asking to psych-evaluate the members. Most of them are pretty normal, with very healthy fantasies, but more than a few come to us with some pretty dark and twisted and very, very illegal fantasies.

I guess, I'd rather someone be less concerned about my battles with anxiety and more concerned with the members who want me to pretend to be ten (and not in a Little space type of way) or members who want me to scream and cry and beg to be released or the ones who want me to pretend to be dead or the ones who want me to act like I am being kidnapped and tied up in their closet and about to be violently assaulted or the ones who ask if I have a dog to perform with or the ones who send me pictures of crushed gold-fish and kittens, asking if I can do the same to other defenseless animals or the ones who want all of the details about any past traumatic assaults or the ones who tell about the dark fantasies they want to do to the young, vulnerable people around them.

Like... I've had more than my fair share of mental illness battles since I was fifteen, with various different diagnoses. If Mental Illness were a Bingo card, I've sure got a Bingo! But that doesn't mean I am not capable of making my own decisions. That doesn't mean I need someone to protect me from myself or decide that I do not have the right to work at a job that I love, a job that actually allows people with mental illnesses to thrive in ways they may not be able to if they were trying to hold down a 9-5. It doesn't matter how sad or depressed I get - working makes me feel better in every way. But do you know what would REAAAAAALLLLY help my mental health? Not having to interact with predators and sick jerkfaces. Because even with the block button, you can't erase the words from your head or the images they send or the sound of their voice as they relish in the thought of hurting others. The block isn't quick enough for that. And those are the moments that haunt me, and I would give anything to NOT know about the true darkness that lies within some people.

I am not trying to say that all members are evil because that couldn't be further from the truth. There are tens of thousands of amazing members out there. I have met such wonderful people through the digital adult world. I have met such kind souls, generous to a fault (and I don't mean money-wise) and I have met men with such compassion and such intelligence, I have met men who have made me laugh with their wit until my belly hurt and tears streamed from my eyes. I have met men who carried such strength, who always treated every with incredible respect. Heck, one of my regulars was a beautiful girl whose creativity never failed to inspire me to try new things and reach for new heights. I have met COUNTLESS members who have enriched my life in many, many ways and I shall always, ALWAYS be grateful for that.

But that doesn't change the fact that there are some super frightening people out there, and if we're going to be concerned with policing the mental health of adults on the internet to determine whether they can engage in adult activity... I'd really love to start there. Instead of saying, "Hey models, let's give you psych evaluations to make sure you're stable enough to handle the occasional traumatic encounter you'll have in camland", why don't we go to the members and say, "Hey, members! Let's give you psych evaluations to make sure you're not a pedophile or a rapist or a psychopath or a sociopath, and if we can determine that you WON'T traumatize models, THEN you can play!"

I mean, either way, the situation is pretty impossible to actually implement and is never going to happen, and frankly, adults are adults and deserve to make their own decisions. But if we're really going to argue about the safety of the models in regards to their mental health, and mandatory psych evaluations for the models, I think it's fair to argue for psych-tests for members tooooo. Or is the idea of members taking psych-tests more or less or equally absurd as the idea of models taking said tests?
 
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So if we're worried about the mental health of models being unable to handle the potentially dark cam-fantasies, shouldn't we be just as worried about the members with those said fantasies? I mean, sure. If a model gets asked to act out a strangulation scenario in which she pretends to strangle herself and then falls limp and pretends to be dead for an additional ten minutes, as realistically as possible... Yeah, she has the power to block the person who asked. But shouldn't we ALSO be concerned about the member who jerks off to this fantasy of a beautiful dead girl, dying a violent fantasy death before his eyes? Because... I've received that fantasy request before. But I don't see anyone really asking to psych-evaluate the members. Most of them are pretty normal, with very healthy fantasies, but more than a few come to us with some pretty dark and twisted and very, very illegal fantasies.

I guess, I'd rather someone be less concerned about my battles with anxiety and more concerned with the members who want me to pretend to be ten (and not in a Little space type of way) or members who want me to scream and cry and beg to be released or the ones who want me to pretend to be dead or the ones who want me to act like I am being kidnapped and tied up in their closet and about to be violently assaulted or the ones who ask if I have a dog to perform with or the ones who send me pictures of crushed gold-fish and kittens, asking if I can do the same to other defenseless animals or the ones who want all of the details about any past traumatic assaults or the ones who tell about the dark fantasies they want to do to the young, vulnerable people around them.

I wouldn't care if members had to take a test it would be the models ultimately having to deal with the lesser member pool. Member's are there for fun and entertainment they have no NEED to spend money on camming. The member base exist on a voluntary basis. Also even if that did happen and you only got normal or stable member it wouldn't mean models wouldn't still want to keep themselves as anonymous as possible.

Equating every fantasy and kink to reality I don't think is anything more than kink shaming. You can't speak for what aspects of their request is really compelling them unless you have ESP. It's like saying people that like horror movies wish to be serial kills themselves. This is the video games makes teaches violence argument that holds no water. This is entertainment and spectical for most members no matter how odd things get. There are plenty people that watch 80's slasher films for the campy lines or over the top blood explosions. Sometimes it can be members wanting setups for their porn because not everyone is content with gonzo. Just because I don't get foot fetish doesn't mean I'm going to vilify people
 
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I think it would be great to require people to see a psych, especially when I was referred to one 5x over the course of a few months and never once heard back! I'd LOVE to have to rely on the public health system to get the a-okay to work a job that I already do because I can't work a regular job due to my mental health!

/sarcasm
 
Apr 17, 2018
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This is such a great point! Gah. I tried to poke through the marketplace (obamacare) insurance to see if there was anything I could afford. The lowest one (just for me. my kids/husband have their own) was like $800 per month with a $6,000 deductible. Who has it like that?
For me and my husband its 800 per month, more than our mortgage. This is less than we were paying through his employer subsidized healthcare, and a better overall package. We both have health issues that need maintenance, so for us, 800 seemed really reasonable. We are average earners, like lower middle class, so I know that thought process comes from a place of priveledge, but I honestly thought 800 a month was a steal for what we get. Sigh. There really needs to be a change.
 
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AlexaCrush

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Jul 14, 2017
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Let's be honest, you don't really care about cammodels' mental well being. You're concerned that you, as a member, could be held liable for a models death like in that article, despite the evidence that suggests that wasn't some accident and may have been a planned event. If you actually gave a shit about our mental health you'd be posting links to Pineapple Support, Cupcake Girls, and other organizations that actually try to help us while brainstorming ways to help give new model's the info they need to stay safe and other things that would actually help us (and, you know, listen to what we're fucking saying). Instead you're just suggesting ways to protect yourself with zero regard for how your suggestions would actually effect us. You're transparent as fuck, dude.
You sound like the kind of guy who says 'not all men'.
 
Oct 5, 2016
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Let's be honest, you don't really care about cammodels' mental well being. You're concerned that you, as a member, could be held liable for a models death like in that article, despite the evidence that suggests that wasn't some accident and may have been a planned event. If you actually gave a shit about our mental health you'd be posting links to Pineapple Support, Cupcake Girls, and other organizations that actually try to help us while brainstorming ways to help give new model's the info they need to stay safe and other things that would actually help us (and, you know, listen to what we're fucking saying). Instead you're just suggesting ways to protect yourself with zero regard for how your suggestions would actually effect us. You're transparent as fuck, dude.
You sound like the kind of guy who says 'not all men'.

Who said I wasn't concerned about my own interests I don't believe I've been hiding anything here. This is a discussion of some potential issues that could affect the industry. Mental health is real problem and while there are many forms of mental illness that don't impair consent there are many that do and with consent being the core that makes the industry work, anyone that's interested in operating within that industry shouldn't want people that cannot give legal consent have access to it.

I'm not a model so links to places that help models are best done by a model. But if I did I wouldn't promote organization that close their doors to cis/gay/trans men. If they're going to say they want to help the industry they should be doing it equally.

It's not unusual to require exams like this in other industries especially high stress ones. Again there are plenty of mental issues that don't impair consent at all however there are also illnesses that require real management and care and mental deterioration can happen so rapidly if nothing is done. But in general KNOWING what you have from a professional can get you better help than when you self diagnose.

The major point of the thread discussion isn't about what I think. It's about if something like that would be necessary with the changing legal climate. Many people said no and made rational points. I don't think anyone thinks it wouldn't be invasive and in many cases a large expense to absorb for the average cam model.

Sometimes when an industry does not voluntarily change it forces others to take action. UK Ban, Sesta/Fosta are reactionary steps that are overreaching because people felt there wasn't enough movement in the industry. Mental Illness is hitting a political head. If the industry doesn't consider passing some rules a political will and nobody will like that rule.
 
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