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Animated child pornography = yes or no?

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BlueViolet said:
There's plenty of fetishes that haven't grown out of control for me. I can still fantasize to a nice pair of boobs and a woman's lady parts on mine without anything else. I can also fantasize about a lady raping a man with a strap-on, and I've had that fantasy for years and years. Still feel no urge to go rape a real man with a strap-on.
Yes and you're right, but also consider that you are (hopefully) more in control of your urges and mental stability than your average rapist. It's not the people like you that anyone is worried about pushing over an edge, it's the crazy, ego-maniacal, broken and fucked-up people who may already have little or no regard for others.

HiGirlsRHot said:
The authors reach the same conclusion that I do, child porn provides a substitute for molesting and virtual child porn may provide a substitute for real child porn.

Then if that's the case you would expect to see a marked decrease in child sexual abuse in Japan since they have had a culture of pedophilic manga etc for decades.

Harm minimisation is all well and good, so long as you can prove the minimisation.
 
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JickyJuly said:
I guess I just feel like we ALL have things in our beings that we didn't and wouldn't choose. It's just our job to carry things and live the best we can. So, perhaps that makes me less sympathetic? I think anyone with a mental illness has the responsibility to keep themselves in check. For instance, I was anorexic for a decade. I purposely avoid talking about food, dieting, calorie counting etc. as much as possible because it sets me in a bad direction. In my mind, a pedophile sitting around wanking to virtual babies is being irresponsible with their issue.

I totally see where you are coming from with that, I just feel like all mental illnesses are treated and kept under control in different ways. A pedophile that truly doesn't want to hurt children would feel that they are being more responsible by taking control of the situation with virtual or simulated scenarios and directing it towards that instead of focusing on real children. Fantasies can even take the form of a cartoon, I know most of my fantasies are in anime style rather than real people.

Jupiter551 said:
Yes and you're right, but also consider that you are (hopefully) more in control of your urges and mental stability than your average rapist. It's not the people like you that anyone is worried about pushing over an edge, it's the crazy, ego-maniacal, broken and fucked-up people who may already have little or no regard for others.

Yes, but I would imagine there are many people just like me that have the same fantasies but can control them. Just like the average pedophile isn't a child molester, but the average child molester has very poor self control obviously. Regardless, there are rape videos whether hentai, virtually simulated, or consensual but acted out to be rape that might be bad for those crazy, ego-maniacal, broken and fucked-up people but those videos are still legal and accessible to anyone over 18. If we ban one thing, we have to ban it all.
 
Jupiter551 said:
HiGirlsRHot said:
The authors reach the same conclusion that I do, child porn provides a substitute for molesting and virtual child porn may provide a substitute for real child porn.

Then if that's the case you would expect to see a marked decrease in child sexual abuse in Japan since they have had a culture of pedophilic manga etc for decades.

Harm minimisation is all well and good, so long as you can prove the minimisation.

From the study..

And most significantly, the incidence of child sex abuse has fallen considerably since 1989, when child pornography became readily accessible – a phenomenon also seen in Denmark and Japan.
 
HiGirlsRHot said:
Jupiter551 said:
HiGirlsRHot said:
The authors reach the same conclusion that I do, child porn provides a substitute for molesting and virtual child porn may provide a substitute for real child porn.

Then if that's the case you would expect to see a marked decrease in child sexual abuse in Japan since they have had a culture of pedophilic manga etc for decades.

Harm minimisation is all well and good, so long as you can prove the minimisation.

From the study..

And most significantly, the incidence of child sex abuse has fallen considerably since 1989, when child pornography became readily accessible – a phenomenon also seen in Denmark and Japan.
I remain unconvinced, you'd be risking the emotional health, lives, very happiness of future children on scant evidence and for what??! So that pedophiles who don't want to hurt kids can jack off over the most realistic images possible as opposed to some kid's fashion magazine or something??

What if your kid, or niece, nephew etc's teacher was found with a legal but unmistakeably pornographic comic of children or something? Would you feel okay with that and just give him the benefit of the doubt that he can control his instincts? Pfft.

It's a disease, like an STD that spreads through abuser to victim in repeating cycle, and it doesn't deserve to be tolerated or pandered to, just fucking stamped out, imo.
 
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Jupiter551 said:
What if your kid, or niece, nephew etc's teacher was found with a legal but unmistakeably pornographic comic of children or something? Would you feel okay with that and just give him the benefit of the doubt that he can control his instincts? Pfft.

He would get fired for breaching his employment contract. You need to pass qualifications to be allowed in any of those roles which include not being a pedophile.
 
Red7227 said:
Jupiter551 said:
What if your kid, or niece, nephew etc's teacher was found with a legal but unmistakeably pornographic comic of children or something? Would you feel okay with that and just give him the benefit of the doubt that he can control his instincts? Pfft.

He would get fired for breaching his employment contract. You need to pass qualifications to be allowed in any of those roles which include not being a pedophile.
yeah but I'm saying in a hypothetical society where comics of such things are legal - it would be no different than a hustler, legally speaking. Anyway I'm asking those who propose legalised simulated child porn how THEY would feel about it in such a situation, not whether he would be fired.
 
Red7227 said:
Jupiter551 said:
What if your kid, or niece, nephew etc's teacher was found with a legal but unmistakeably pornographic comic of children or something? Would you feel okay with that and just give him the benefit of the doubt that he can control his instincts? Pfft.

He would get fired for breaching his employment contract. You need to pass qualifications to be allowed in any of those roles which include not being a pedophile.

Even things that are legal, a lot of times there are moral contracts such as licensed massage therapists aren't allowed to work in anything related to the adult industry, even as customer service for an adult company. So the teacher would be fired for that. Some schools don't even allow teachers to go out to clubs.

But no, I would not exactly feel comfortable with my child or nephew's teacher or babysitter or whatever having simulated child pornography, but in the same way that I wouldn't want to be alone with a man who also has rape fantasies or is into some other creepy fetishes. I have them, too, but I just typically don't trust anyone but myself. But just because I don't like it doesn't mean I think it should be illegal.
 
Jupiter551 said:
I remain unconvinced, you'd be risking the emotional health, lives, very happiness of future children on scant evidence and for what??! So that pedophiles who don't want to hurt kids can jack off over the most realistic images possible as opposed to some kid's fashion magazine or something??

What if your kid, or niece, nephew etc's teacher was found with a legal but unmistakeably pornographic comic of children or something? Would you feel okay with that and just give him the benefit of the doubt that he can control his instincts? Pfft.

It's a disease, like an STD that spreads through abuser to victim in repeating cycle, and it doesn't deserve to be tolerated or pandered to, just fucking stamped out, imo.

The world would be better place if real and virtual child porn, and pedophiles all disappeared , they won't.
If some of you want to pretend with that can we stamp this out just like we have done so successfully with porn, prostitution, drugs, sex traffic etc. You are welcome to your delusions. It is all well and nice to say that pedophiles should take responsibility for their actions, so should crack addicts.

40 years ago people thought homosexuality was a mental illness, they were wrong, but having been alive back then I can tell you their arguments sound very similar to the ones on this thread. "It is an illness we can treat it" I am no shrink and don't even play one on the internet, but I wouldn't be surprised to see pedophilia be reclassified into something else in my lifetime. What would shock me is psychiatry changing and deciding that sex between adults and children isn't harmful. The one thing we can all agree is want to minimize the harm to real living kids.

Anyway back to OP point I can't see how keeping Aussie from buying Saints Row 4 is going to keep kids from being harmed. And regardless how you feel about virtual child porn, this kinda of BS is the unintended consequence of these laws.

Anyway I am done with the thread, interesting discussion.
 
Red7227 said:
Most significantly, they found that the number of reported cases of child sex abuse dropped markedly immediately after the ban on sexually explicit materials was lifted in 1989. In both Denmark and Japan, the situation is similar: Child sex abuse was much lower than it was when availability of child pornography was restricted.
Immediately? Whoa Child molesters were like naw dude don't feel like molesting anymore just gonna legally watch other dudes do it. I wonder what the correlation between it becoming legal to view and the amount of times it gets reported is?
Interestingly, whereas the number of sex-related crimes fell significantly after 1989, the number of other societal crimes – murder, assault, and robbery – rose significantly.

I can cherry pick too. Strange how all other crimes rose when one became looked at as less of a crime.
 
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Jupiter551 said:
Red7227 said:
Jupiter551 said:
What if your kid, or niece, nephew etc's teacher was found with a legal but unmistakeably pornographic comic of children or something? Would you feel okay with that and just give him the benefit of the doubt that he can control his instincts? Pfft.

He would get fired for breaching his employment contract. You need to pass qualifications to be allowed in any of those roles which include not being a pedophile.
yeah but I'm saying in a hypothetical society where comics of such things are legal - it would be no different than a hustler, legally speaking. Anyway I'm asking those who propose legalised simulated child porn how THEY would feel about it in such a situation, not whether he would be fired.

What has that got to do with anything? Doesn't matter if porn is legal, pedophilia still won't be. Current laws about employment will still apply.
 
JickyJuly said:
Being gay isn't a fetish. It's an innate sexual preference that occurs naturally in most species. Pedophilia isn't a fetish. It's a mental illness which often leads to criminal behavior. Offering someone with a mental illness an "outlet" instead of help is exploitative and will lead to more crimes.

Pedophilia is a fetish. Pedophiles have a mental illness.

What's the difference? Pedophilia is finding children sexually attractive. Thus, pedophilia is a fetish. Pedophiles are people who have actually attempted to initiate sexual contact with children. They have failed to keep their pedophilia in the realm of fantasy.

If you read my earlier post, you might understand why I am adamant about this.
 
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LadyLuna said:
JickyJuly said:
Being gay isn't a fetish. It's an innate sexual preference that occurs naturally in most species. Pedophilia isn't a fetish. It's a mental illness which often leads to criminal behavior. Offering someone with a mental illness an "outlet" instead of help is exploitative and will lead to more crimes.

Pedophilia is a fetish. Pedophiles have a mental illness.

What's the difference? Pedophilia is finding children sexually attractive. Thus, pedophilia is a fetish. Pedophiles are people who have actually attempted to initiate sexual contact with children. They have failed to keep their pedophilia in the realm of fantasy.

If you read my earlier post, you might understand why I am adamant about this.

Child molesters are people who have attempted sexual contact with children. Pedophiles are individuals who find children sexually attractive. Big difference. Child molesters have failed to keep it in fantasy, pedophiles have not acted on anything.
 
PunkInDrublic said:
Never understood the "seeing something acted out in a video game or movie will make the person less likely to do it" line of thought. Been proven untrue in so many cases. Almost always acts as an enabler.
When I play Tiger Woods golf it makes me want to go play real golf. When I watch anal porn I want to fuck butts. I don't want to shoot people in real life when I play COD though. Weird.

It's interesting though, people do get encouraged by what they see on screen. In my experience I've never seen anyone who plays war like video games or watches war films become more likely to go out and be violent. Maybe more likely to want to play war like games, like paintballing, and become very serious about it, but maybe this is because when you play a computer game you are actively going around shooting people, on screen perhaps, but it's something you can get interactive with. It's also clearly a fantasy and in a war like situation. If anyone were to want to get into that situation from that then they'd join the army. There is the opportunity to go around and shoot a bunch of people/make that a reality.

Television is different. For example, everyone who I know who watches angry soaps, and things like jeremy Kyle (englands Springer), where there are loads of upsetting arguments, are generally much angrier, argumentative, and depressive people than people I know who avoid that sort of thing. I notice when I watch things like that I become an angrier person. Watching it doesn't release inner angry urges, it lets the anger and upset leak onto me. Todays society keeps getting angrier and nastier because it's common for people to watch tv where everyone is nasty to each other. No one can deny that on a small scale people follow what they see on television.

Porn is another example. Most men I've slept with, especially those who watch lots of porn will try and act out scenes they've seen. They will want to do things that I really doubt they'd be that interested in without porn. In fact, porn means that it becomes harder for them to be turned on by little things so they crave more explicit things to get their release. Anal is one of these things. As I'm only 22 I don't know how common anal sex was say, 20-50 years ago, but I have a big feeling it is on the rise. Nowadays most men my age have, or at least want to partake in anal sex. Most men I know who haven't it's because they haven't found a partner who's willing, and a few simply don't like the idea of it. I know quite a few guys who seem to want to fuck a girls bum much more than her pussy. Now I'm all for anal sex, but there is definitely something a bit weird about not being interested in the place that's actually supposed to be fucked, and only wanting somewhere that is made for a very not sexy reason.
I know anal sex did happen before anal porn became such a big thing, but was it on such a large scale where most girls have at least tried it, and usually not because they've thought up the idea?

I know that porn has definitely made it harder for me to find things in my imagination sexy, and now I need more extreme things to turn me on when I masturbate than I needed when I was younger, and I don't even watch much porn! Maybe like once/twice every month/two months I'll watch it. People are saying as an argument for allowing pedophiles to watch animated child porn that it might help subdue the urges, which sounds great and all, but I have a feeling it'd do the opposite. For BlueViolet, or Luna, watching these cartoon porn images would release an inner fantasy and it'd be done with there. For a pedophile these images could excite them at first, but the more images they get the more they'll need more graphic things to get off. Once the cartoon images lose their excitement I think they'd be more likely to find other ways to get that thrill. Sex is a drug, the more you get exposed to it the more addictive it becomes. Being a sex addict I know this from first hand experience. Feeding it just makes you want more.
HiGirlsRHot said:
You know what else sometimes works methadone treatments. Methadone isn't good for you it is just a hell of a lot better than heroin

Actually Methadone is a LOT worse for you than heroin. It's success rates are poor. It is a very poor substitute to heroin that they use to ween people off heroin. What it actually does is make the people even more ill while they're trying to get off the original drug. What does work is weening people off heroin with heroin. But this wouldn't work in the case of sex. If you were a sex addict you couldn't start giving people smaller doses of sex until they're no longer a sex addict, it just doesn't work that way. And the same with pedophilia. Except for you couldn't actually give the pedophile smaller doses of sex.

Pedophilia, unlike being gay is often teemed with a bunch of other mental problems and histories in being abused. It often gets formed from exposure of these things happening. Mostly their mental disorders go far beyond fancying small children.

I don't believe all pedophiles are evil, I feel sorry for a lot of them. The ones who hate who they are and literally cannot help it, and who make sure they never go through with it. Even ones who may slip up once, not actually molesting a child, but getting close to a child in an inappropriate way but don't do anything that harms the child. I can feel sorry for them. It's horrible how they are and they cannot help it. I still think that they shouldn't be allowed in society and it'd be kinder to lock them up, not a dark prison necessarily, but somewhere nice where they cannot ever get out, but can live away from the rest of the world.
Out of pedophiles though, there are many who simply are evil. The ones who go through with their thoughts and molest children. My boyfriends sister was going out with someone who turned out to be a pedophile, he was part of a circle of other pedophiles who would find and target children and would encourage each other. Those people... they just deserve to be shot. Those people I think are the ones who would be more likely to look for child pornography, even if cartoon animated.
 
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