Fear of demanding

[Beawaresweety]

I came up with conclusion that I've had a problem during all these years in camming.

I've never accepted any pvt invitations without discussing the details of it first (and I'm a pvt based model so my main income comes from privates). My pvt shows are mostly vanilla and catering to innocent fetishes. I'm not into hardcore and I always think that hardcore is what those strangers are gonna demand during the show, at some point.

Also, I'm so grateful for all the unexpected big tips from strangers but I've been rejecting and fearing it on an unconscious level because I think "what if that dude starts demanding something I don't do? I'm not ready for that. I don't want to disappoint people who pay but I've got my limits and I won't do anything I don't want to do, for any amount of tips".
But anyway, other people's expectations just leave bad taste in mouth and ruin my mood and general vibe of my streams.
No problem with freeloaders so far. They don't pay me and I don't pay attention to them. The problem comes with people that are more than happy to pay.

I prefer everything to be made clear and discussed. So no unpleasant surprises for both of us.

I've got my audience and I've been doing pretty well. But new users are a huge opportunity too. And I get tired of this fear and this need to explain my rules every time someone new wants to have a deal with me.
Also, I feel like I overcomplicate things but I can't stop because this fear of dealing with unexpected and upsetting consequences haunts me.

I want to know if someone has the same problem. Any advice is appreciated because it's more of a mental issue rather than a practical one.

 

[NotYou]

I am no model but as a user/viewer, I prefer to discuss with the model before (even if it's just a "do you [know how to] do this?") before taking her. However, most times I will look at the model's tags (although, sadly they are not always a good indicator as people just use the most popular) or her tip menu or bio. So with that, make sure you have the things you do and/or don't do (especially commonly sort after ones: if you don't do anal, say so; if you do, say so etc) then you can 1) Point them to it, or 2) if they start the PVT you can accept and then if they try to demand something you don't do, you can tell them they should have checked your room title, tags, bio, menu etc. So then it's more THEIR fault rather than yours, so you have nothing to feel bad about.

 

[Beawaresweety]

I am no model but as a user/viewer, I prefer to discuss with the model before (even if it's just a "do you [know how to] do this?") before taking her. However, most times I will look at the model's tags (although, sadly they are not always a good indicator as people just use the most popular) or her tip menu or bio. So with that, make sure you have the things you do and/or don't do (especially commonly sort after ones: if you don't do anal, say so; if you do, say so etc) then you can 1) Point them to it, or 2) if they start the PVT you can accept and then if they try to demand something you don't do, you can tell them they should have checked your room title, tags, bio, menu etc. So then it's more THEIR fault rather than yours, so you have nothing to feel bad about.

When I just started in 2016, I've tried this method for a couple of days.
The result: 60% of people got mad at me and said things like "I'll report you if you don't do it right now", "Dumb whore, I wish you died", "I'm paying, you're obligated to do", "I come here to jerk off and I don't have to read your bio, stupid cunt" (most of those people thumbed down me), 30% just left a private show as soon as I said that I don't do *that* and *that*, and 10% were understanding and they said like "Oh, my bad for not reading/not asking beforehand", "Okay, no worries, just do your thing".
I've never ever done a single private show without prior discussion since then.

So thank you for your advice but it's pretty much useless and I can understand why: 1. You're a member so you don't see and read all the things that models do on a daily basics. 2. You're a sane member so you don't get mad at model if she doesn't do something, you read bios and etc.

I find bios unhelpful in most cases. Sure, I've got one and I send users to read it. But very few people do it on their own.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Nothing wrong with your philosophy here. I'm one who doesn't like demands placed on me, nor do I want to give the impression of my having demands either. I think discussing privates before going into them is very beneficial. Especially when it's a new person whom you haven't done one with previously. It also helps to eliminate any negative feelings and helps with a more positive experience both for you and the member as it sets the tone regarding limits and what they're looking for.

I have always been a member who won't ask a model to do a private unless her and I have had some level of interaction for a while prior to asking. It helps ensure we're compatible, like the same things, and has a bit more of a connection rather than just the quick few minutes the private is. I'm also one who prefers to let things happen naturally over the course of the private. No demands, as it should be about both enjoying instead of just one. Also, very vanilla.

Unfortunately, I know there's a lot of people out there who are very demanding and dominant. Have also heard some pretty bad stories of how some members are when it comes to what they expect and demand a model to do. Don't be afraid to stop the privates if they get that way. Also, if you're comfortable with how you're doing privates now, is it bad to keep doing so if it's been good for you? I know members come and go. But, it sounds like you may have good enough traffic that if they are returning multiple times, some level of interaction is building?

Seeing your comment above about bios, I'd tend to agree that most don't read them. I've also found that few read topics, etc. I know MFC the models have both the topic, and the whiteboard to help put info in. But, again, if people don't read, useless. Profiles and MFCShare are more for those inquisitive enough to look for content or want to really know more and actually read.

If anything, I think it comes down to what kind and level of relationship you have with your members. Those who typically are regulars know you well enough to not demand. Whereas new people are more the ones who do. Not sure which site you cam on primarily, and I can really only speak of my experiences and interactions with models on MFC. Hopefully you can find a way to reduce your fear a little, and you won't have negative interactions which make you regain it again.

 

[Beawaresweety]

P.S. Yes, I know it was their fault for wasting their own time and money on me without reading and asking any questions before inviting but the truth is... this knowledge didn't make me feel any better and wasn't helpful in general. It's still unpleasant and exhausting to deal with this type of people.

 

[Beawaresweety]

Also, if you're comfortable with how you're doing privates now, is it bad to keep doing so if it's been good for you? I know members come and go. But, it sounds like you may have good enough traffic that if they are returning multiple times, some level of interaction is building?

Yes, I'm pretty comfortable. People adore my private shows even if it's pretty vanilla because I do my best and they say that "it's worth every cent". And these people surely do come back over and over again. But that's just a bad business strategy to rely on regulars because one day they may disappear like nothing has happened. So I'd love to attract some new people too.

Not sure which site you cam on primarily, and I can really only speak of my experiences and interactions with models on MFC.

I'm on CB and I frequently get people that tip some amount and think that's a solid reason for me to go to pvt with them without any kind of discussion. There are some that will thumb model down if she ignored their pvt invitation. You only have to tip 25 tokens to like or dislike a model on CB, and it's a low amount so some users tip to just thumb down for declining an invitation and etc.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Yes, I'm pretty comfortable. People adore my private shows even if it's pretty vanilla because I do my best and they say that "it's worth every cent". And these people surely do come back over and over again. But that's just a bad business strategy to rely on regulars because one day they may disappear like nothing has happened. So I'd love to attract some new people too.

Yep, always the eternal struggle of comfort zone and needing to expand to new people for growth and continued business. Hopefully you continue to attract the right people to your room.

I'm on CB and I frequently get people that tip some amount and think that's a solid reason for me to go to pvt with them without any kind of discussion. There are some that will thumb model down if she ignored their pvt invitation. You only have to tip 25 tokens to like or dislike a model on CB, and it's a low amount so some users tip to just thumb down for declining an invitation and etc.

Thanks for saying which site and additional info. It unfortunate that people will react that way because of declining a request. There's many other models for them to go to if you say no, or ignore. Can't understand why people do what they do at times. It's been a long time since I've been on CB, had forgot about the 25 token thing for rating.

 

[Danigirl]

I have privates set at a high rate and with a time minimum so it’s guaranteed I make at least X amount if I take a private. I make most of my money in free chat and content sales and rarely take privates. Mostly because I hate feeling like I “owe” anyone anything and I got anal requested a lot and I don’t do that live. It says it on my topic, on my scrolling feed in obs and in detail on my bio. So if I do take the private and shut down the other sites (split cam) I usually know the person doing it and they know my boundaries or I will sit there and stare at them while the time runs down if they try to ignore my rules or bully me. I’ve also emailed support to let them know the issue in case they try to report.

 

[Beawaresweety]

I think the main problem is that many users feel entitled even if they tipped only one token.
Like, you know, my bio states that I don't do *that* and *that* and then they tip 30 tokens and think that I HAVE TO DO IT NOW because they tipped (Man, who asked you to tip me and then get all mad because I don't offer that? Well, maybe you should go and spend 2 minutes on reading my bio, it actually makes you a favor so that you don't waste your time and money any further). And that's just a public chat. It gets much worse during a private show because they pay per minute and now I REALLY, REALLY have to do everything they demand.
And it really happens quite often (I think most models would agree on that) if pvts aren't being discussed.

 

[Danigirl]

I think the main problem is that many users feel entitled even if they tipped only one token.
Like, you know, my bio states that I don't do *that* and *that* and then they tip 30 tokens and think that I HAVE TO DO IT NOW because they tipped (Man, who asked you to tip me and then get all mad because I don't offer that? Well, maybe you should go and spend 2 minutes on reading my bio, it actually makes you a favor so that you don't waste your time and money any further). And that's just a public chat. It gets much worse during a private show because they pay per minute and now I REALLY, REALLY have to do everything they demand.
And it really happens (I think most model would agree on that) if pvts aren't being discussed.

Lol nope. Not your fault if they can’t read. You are not obligated to do ANYTHING you don’t want to and it’s important for your moral that you keep to what you’re comfortable with during privates. You’ll burn out if you do that.

 

[Beawaresweety]

Lol nope. Not your fault if they can’t read. You are not obligated to do ANYTHING you don’t want to and it’s important for your moral that you keep to what you’re comfortable with during privates. You’ll burn out if you do that.

Yeah, I know. I wasn't talking about me. I was talking about the way some members tend to think.
I've got a pretty strict boundaries so I don't buy this shit. But my rules don't change the fact. They think that way.

 

[Beawaresweety]

I have privates set at a high rate and with a time minimum so it’s guaranteed I make at least X amount if I take a private. I make most of my money in free chat and content sales and rarely take privates. Mostly because I hate feeling like I “owe” anyone anything and I got anal requested a lot and I don’t do that live. It says it on my topic, on my scrolling feed in obs and in detail on my bio. So if I do take the private and shut down the other sites (split cam) I usually know the person doing it and they know my boundaries or I will sit there and stare at them while the time runs down if they try to ignore my rules or bully me. I’ve also emailed support to let them know the issue in case they try to report.

I understand and I'm really glad it works for you! I don't feel comfortable doing public shows and I ADORE doing private shows with "the right" people (my current audience). And I'm not that popular (mostly because I'm a private based model, people can't see anything interesting going on during my public show so they leave and that's perfectly fine, we all have our own ways of doing the shows).

 

[Deleted member 37064]

I think the main problem is that many users feel entitled even if they tipped only one token.

this is the problem with so many people in general. Everyone feels entitled to something, and is far from correct.

I understand and I'm really glad it works for you! I don't feel comfortable doing public shows and I ADORE doing private shows with "the right" people (my current audience). And I'm not that popular (mostly because I'm a private based model, people can't see anything interesting going on during my public show so they leave and that's perfectly fine, we all have our own ways of doing the shows).

Out of curiosity, have you tried camming on MFC or another site to see how would do there? Only asking as I think it's commonly understood that MFC is more social based. though, there is that pesky camscore that I know models don't like.

 

[Beawaresweety]

I will sit there and stare at them while the time runs down if they try to ignore my rules or bully me. I’ve also emailed support to let them know the issue in case they try to report.

I feel really bad for wasting people's money and time even if they're being dicks.
And it ruins my mood.
Like, I don't want to waste my own time and I don't want to waste other people's time and money.
Like, if your expectations weren't met, please just leave me alone and find a model that fits.
And I feel down mentally when all this bullying starts. I'd prefer them to just leave a show, I don't need money earned THAT way (it would cost me my mental health, I'm not so emotionally stable).
But I'm really amazed by your calmness!

 

[Beawaresweety]

Out of curiosity, have you tried camming on MFC or another site to see how would do there? Only asking as I think it's commonly understood that MFC is more social based. though, there is that pesky camscore that I know models don't like.

I've tried, everything was good, camscore isn't the best feature but it is what it is. But not as good as on CB. Like, nobody knew me there and I came up with conclusion that it'd be too hard for me to start over like a brand-new cam-girl so I gave it up and decided to concentrate on CB since people know me there, wait for me. I realized that I can't have it both ways. I had to choose and my choice was obvious (CB because it's the place where I can be trusted as an experienced cam-girl by my audience).

 

[Deleted member 37064]

I've tried, everything was good, camscore isn't the best feature but it is what it is. But not as good as on CB. Like, nobody knew me there and I came up with conclusion that it'd be too hard for me to start over like a brand-new cam-girl so I gave it up and decided to concentrate on CB since people know me there, wait for me. I realized that I can't have it both ways. I had to choose and my choice was obvious (CB because it's the place where I can be trusted as an experienced cam-girl by my audience).

Okay, makes sense. Was just thinking it'd give you an additional venue for income if you hadn't tried it.

 

[Danigirl]

Ok I’m done here. Tried to relate with the private situations but feel I’m getting some shade here. I let the money drain out of the one guy who was being an giant dick. It costs me time, opportunity and loss of room building when I take a private so it has to be worth it for me. I usually have 150+ in my room and depending on the day it can be hard to build it back again in a decent time frame and I only am able to cam certain hours during the week. I don’t consider it wrong to do exactly what my profile says I will do the guy said he read my rules that state the minimum time frame and what I do/don’t do. Maybe he will think again before he tries it with another model who doesn’t have as much thick skin. He was asking for really offensive raceplay and extreme anal to the point it would have been very painful. He left the private but the settings make it that he has to pay for the full 10 min if he leaves early. I keep the settings because it lowers the amounts of demanding asshats. You do you, just was trying to give an option for the advice you asked for.

 

[Lelo1]

What's the worst thing that can happen?

Some one doesn't like the show, They ask for a refund and get it.
That's really it.

"Dumb whore, I wish you died"
"I come here to jerk off and I don't have to read your bio, stupid cunt"

Being a bully, and that's against the TOS. You can report people for this.
You don't have to put up with anyone talking to you like this.

"I'll report you if you don't do it right now"
"I'm paying, you're obligated to do"

First off, They don't own you. They have no right to your body.
It's your body, you don't have to do anything. Only do what is right for you.

Also what's a mod going to do?
They're going to look at the chat log / video, long as you didn't promise to do x. the mod is most likely going to take your side.
again worst thing that can happen is they get a refund.

I prefer everything to be made clear and discussed.

Honestly this is a good practice for models and customers.
That way both parties get what they want, no fuss.

 

[Beawaresweety]

Ok I’m done here. Tried to relate with the private situations but feel I’m getting some shade here. I let the money drain out of the one guy who was being an giant dick. It costs me time, opportunity and loss of room building when I take a private so it has to be worth it for me. I usually have 150+ in my room and depending on the day it can be hard to build it back again in a decent time frame and I only am able to cam certain hours during the week. I don’t consider it wrong to do exactly what my profile says I will do the guy said he read my rules that state the minimum time frame and what I do/don’t do. Maybe he will think again before he tries it with another model who doesn’t have as much thick skin. He was asking for really offensive raceplay and extreme anal to the point it would have been very painful. He left the private but the settings make it that he has to pay for the full 10 min if he leaves early. I keep the settings because it lowers the amounts of demanding asshats. You do you, just was trying to give an option for the advice you asked for.

There was no judgment or sarcasm in my reply.
I'm really amazed by the fact that some feel strong enough to punish members like that guy. And you did it right. He should have read your bio and acknowledge your rules.
But I can't do the same. I don't feel strong enough to punish someone for their inappropriate behavior. I just want to disappear at the moment or that bad person to disappear.
I thought it was clear from my first post that I try to avoid any kind of negativity. That's pretty much the reason of my fear. And I try to avoid not because I'm a pleaser by nature/I don't have my boundaries set but because it destroys my mental health. I don't want to get money from problematic people even if they deserve to get punished financially for being dicks. I don't think you did anything wrong. I just said it'd be bad for my mental health because I can't handle it. Money won't buy me a new one.
But I didn't try to put any blame on you for your behavior and I'm sorry if it sounded bad or wrong on my part (I'm not a native English speaker so there may be some misunderstanding).

 

[Beawaresweety]

I think many people got my point totally wrong. I don't have a fear of getting in trouble with some bad guy because I think I won't prove that I'm right and not a scammer or something. I'm sure as hell if there is any problem, CB support will be on my side because I don't do anything wrong or illegal. And I know that's an user's fault for being a dick or not reading my bio.
As I said, that's more of a mental issue. It makes me feel mentally bad, that's pretty much it.
And I've received a practical recommendations (thank you a lot for it, maybe it'll be helpful for other models). But it wasn't the problem. I know about my rights and my responsibilities.
I feel safe in this meaning.
I was trying to bring up an emotional/mental part of all that stuff.

 

[MarieElise]

Idk if I am understanding you correctly either, but I think I can relate to part of it. I could be getting it wrong though. I know, in past times, I have gotten very down after shows where the person was uncalled for rude, and over the top mean, and also perhaps demanding. It kind of used to get me down on the world, as a whole, but I have since worked through that (mostly).

This totally might not be what you are meaning though. I also have a really big problem with perfectionism, and if my day (in general) even off cam, doesn't go perfectly, I have to fight the tendency to get upset about it. So therefor when a show doesn't go super positive, like if it was just meh, or outright negative, I used to get upset about it. I have worked through a lot of these things, in the years since though. Although I would say, that I don't particularly enjoy conflict, or negative interactions, and I am still a strong idealist that wishes we all lived in a perfect world, (where we could all get along and be respectful to each other - it's very cheesy of me, but true). But this could also be totally different from what you are talking about.

As a general rule, if I am feeling fragile emotionally (or mentally), I don't do live camming. But I also frequently stare at people, or put the blame on them (where it belongs) if they take me for a private asking for things, which I make clear I don't do. I often try to word it nice, but also in a way that puts the blame on them, like "Sorry, this is super awkward, that is why I always make it clear in my bio etc what my limits are, and hope that people read that. This isn't fun for either of us." Sometimes I end the show, other times I just sit and stare, depending on what I have planned for after the show, and how much time I have. I feel strong staring though, they can end it whenever they want. Sometimes if I am in a really goofy mood, and they have been asked something, which I consider really off the wall, I tell them I want them to put their cam on (C2C), and see them do whatever action it was they requested. I act like I am serious about it, just because I have a twisted sense of humor, and it makes me crack up afterwards to think how shocked, and freaked out they probably got hehe.

EDIT to add; I have to admit though, I always feel a small flame of anger when someone takes me PVT asking me to do the things, which I am clear on, that I don't do. I feel they have wasted my time, and taken me away from a productive chat, where I could have had a fun show instead. If they apologize, I am fine with it, but if they are rude, I do get slightly angry and irritated, and I don't feel bad letting them knw, or making things awkward for them.

 

[melanieoncam]

I was like this when I was very new but then I realized I was taking it way too seriously.

I treat my respectful regulars very well with fun roleplay privates and I send them videos and spoil them right back when they spoil me. I never promise anything that I don't do and I'm very clear at what I do not offer.

If someone tips me without asking thats his own fault if he asks for something I don't do. I offer an alternative. If they get disrespectful I either ignore or ban them, problem solved.

There are plenty of fun respectful members out there. Focus on them and ban or ignore the rest. No reason to give attention to rude assholes.

 

[Beawaresweety]

Idk if I am understanding you correctly either, but I think I can relate to part of it. I could be getting it wrong though. I know, in past times, I have gotten very down after shows where the person was uncalled for rude, and over the top mean, and also perhaps demanding. It kind of used to get me down on the world, as a whole, but I have since worked through that (mostly).

Yes, that's what I meant. I haven't worked through that and that was my point. So you got it absolutely right.
I think I don't want to disappoint anyone because disappointing other people makes me disappointed too. Not like I genuinely care about them. I don't even know them. But it just makes ME feel bad about myself. That's the problem. And that's why it's a mental question and topic and not a financial/practical one.

 

[MarieElise]

Yes, that's what I meant. I haven't worked through that and that was my point. So you got it absolutely right.
I think I don't want to disappoint anyone because disappointing other people makes me disappointed too. Not like I genuinely care about them. I don't even know them. But it just makes ME feel bad about myself. That's the problem. And that's why it's a mental question and topic and not a financial/practical one.

That makes sense, I used to have a big issue with that too, but it's possible to work through. Hugs.
EDIT to add; I am glad that you are very clear about keeping your set boundaries, regardless though.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Sometimes if I am in a really goofy mood, and they have been asked something, which I consider really off the wall, I tell them I want them to put their cam on (C2C), and see them do whatever action it was they requested. I act like I am serious about it, just because I have a twisted sense of humor, and it makes me crack up afterwards to think how shocked, and freaked out they probably got hehe.

Have you ever had anyone turn their cam on and do this?

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Yes, that's what I meant. I haven't worked through that and that was my point. So you got it absolutely right.
I think I don't want to disappoint anyone because disappointing other people makes me disappointed too. Not like I genuinely care about them. I don't even know them. But it just makes ME feel bad about myself. That's the problem. And that's why it's a mental question and topic and not a financial/practical one.

I can relate to this, and it's why I try to make sure the model enjoys her time with me as well. While I do have my limits, I'm overall a people pleaser and don't like to disappoint others as I feel as if I've failed in some way. While this is true, I also will not compromise my values and beliefs.

 

[MarieElise]

Have you ever had anyone turn their cam on and do this?

Surprisingly enough yes. In one particular area, which I do not do, and which many cam models do not do. However surprisingly often they have been very willing to do this action to themselves, and have definitely had a good time while doing so. In these instances, the action itself has not turned me on to watch, but the result has. So in those cases, it has gone beyond the joke factor, and I have ended up being a bit, pleasantly shocked, myself. Trying not to say too much, as I know there are 2 very distinct camps of men, when it comes to this action, and I don't want to upset you, or gross you out, if you happen to be in the camp adverse to this action.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Surprisingly enough yes. In one particular area, which I do not do, and which many cam models do not do. However surprisingly often they have been very willing to do this action to themselves, and have definitely had a good time while doing so. In these instances, the action itself has not turned me on to watch, but the result has. So in those cases, it has gone beyond the joke factor, and I have ended up being a bit, pleasantly shocked, myself. Trying not to say too much, as I know there are 2 very distinct camps of men, when it comes to this action, and I don't want to upset you, or gross you out, if you happen to be in the camp adverse to this action.

Interesting, I wonder if they did it as a way to demonstrate it to you (or other models) without deliberately asking you to watch? As to what it is/was, I can think of a couple of things it might have been. While it's difficult to upset or gross me out, there are things I'm better off not thinking about since it doesn't interest me. As to them doing it, if it's what turns them on and you don't have a problem watching it, then so be it. They aren't harming me by doing it in the privacy of their home.

 

[MarieElise]

Interesting, I wonder if they did it as a way to demonstrate it to you (or other models) without deliberately asking you to watch?

Yeah, it's not something I never do, just not in a live camming context. They may assume it's something I never do though. They definitely seem to enjoy the me watching factor, so it may be less about the action, and more about exhibitionism, or some kind of mixture of both, to varying degrees (plus a power shift/ BDSM element). Many of the men I am friends with, and my BF, do not like to even hear of other men being into this practice (although it's very common, legal, and not against any site rules). So I won't say more. I have had different boyfriends in the past, that are way into it though, so I know every person is individual in their tastes. The reactions seem to range from giggling to being offended, which always interests me too, psychologically speaking.

 

[Beawaresweety]

I can relate to this, and it's why I try to make sure the model enjoys her time with me as well. While I do have my limits, I'm overall a people pleaser and don't like to disappoint others as I feel as if I've failed in some way. While this is true, I also will not compromise my values and beliefs.

Yes, I understand what you're talking about.
I may have chosen the wrong words for describing my problem. I think I really did because so few people got what I actually meant.

Ignore, ban and report (optionally) are practical recommendations on the topic "how to deal with rude and abusive members". But the point was not that I don't know how to solve the problem technically but that I don't know how to solve the problem mentally.
I can click all those buttons to get rid of a trashy user during my stream. But I can't find a button in my head to get rid of an unpleasant experience easily and quickly. And all the previous unpleasant experiences just add to the whole picture so I try to avoid everything that may turn into an unpleasant experience as much as I can while fearing it because I know I won't be able to get it out of my head afterwards.