Shooting Outside the Empire State Building

[AllisonWilder]

These shootings just never end.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...empirestatebre87n0m2-20120824,0,4180453.story

 

[Bocefish]

Meanwhile in Chicago...

19 people shot in overnight shootings across Chicago http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... 9779.story

 

[Shaun__]

Meanwhile in Chicago...

19 people shot in overnight shootings across Chicago http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... 9779.story

We were talking about this at work, and trying to decide what makes certain killings worth nonstop coverage. We all assumed people had been killed all over the city in the last few day.

 

[Bocefish]

It's a daily occurrence in Chicago, so it's not exactly breaking news. What does make news is when nobody is shot. We had one day so far this year where nobody was shot and one day last year IIRC. Oh, and BTW, Chicago has the strictest gun control laws in the country so that proves how effective stricter laws are.

 

[Jupiter551]

It's a daily occurrence in Chicago, so it's not exactly breaking news. What does make news is when nobody is shot. We had one day so far this year where nobody was shot and one day last year IIRC. Oh, and BTW, Chicago has the strictest gun control laws in the country so that proves how effective stricter laws are.

Not really, if anything I'd guess it proves it's unrealistic to have a gun-controlled area surrounded on every side by non-controlled neighbours without border control. It's no different than if you had a drug-free city surrounded by neighbours where drugs were legal and socially acceptable - it proves that context is important.

Or are you saying that the shootings in Chicago are all (or even mostly) done by legally-purchased Chicago firearms?

 

[Bocefish]

It's a daily occurrence in Chicago, so it's not exactly breaking news. What does make news is when nobody is shot. We had one day so far this year where nobody was shot and one day last year IIRC. Oh, and BTW, Chicago has the strictest gun control laws in the country so that proves how effective stricter laws are.

Not really, if anything I'd guess it proves it's unrealistic to have a gun-controlled area surrounded on every side by non-controlled neighbours without border control. It's no different than if you had a drug-free city surrounded by neighbours where drugs were legal and socially acceptable - it proves that context is important.

Yeah right, just like all the illegal drugs the Mexican cartels bring in to distribute. It's a wee bit more complicated than that.

 

[Jupiter551]

Yeah right, just like all the illegal drugs the Mexican cartels bring in to distribute. It's a wee bit more complicated than that.

I'm sure it is but you're the one who simplified things by saying there's shootings in chicago therefore gun control obviously doesn't work.

 

[Bocefish]

That's because it doesn't. The vast majority of shootings are gang/drug related.

Mexican drug cartels are having turf battles in Chicago. As it stands now, at least three major Mexican cartels are battling over control of billions of dollars of marijuana, cocaine and -- increasingly -- heroin in Chicago. That includes the ultra-violent Zetas and the powerful Sinaloa cartel, run by its shadowy leader Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-5 ... n-chicago/

 

[bawksy]

The shooting in NYC was not another mass shooting. It was a complete non-event until the cops got involved. A guy shoots another guy in the head. Happens all the time. Then the guy runs past some cops who decide to pump him full of lead and hit 9 innocent bystanders too. Hope it was worth it, dumbasses. The only reason it made the news was because 1) it happened at a famous building and 2) the cops shot so many people.

 

[Jupiter551]

That's because it doesn't. The vast majority of shootings are gang/drug related.

Mexican drug cartels are having turf battles in Chicago. As it stands now, at least three major Mexican cartels are battling over control of billions of dollars of marijuana, cocaine and -- increasingly -- heroin in Chicago. That includes the ultra-violent Zetas and the powerful Sinaloa cartel, run by its shadowy leader Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-5 ... n-chicago/

Well then, obviously that's the fault of gun control? England has significantly less gun homocides per year than US states 1/10th of its size. Homocides by other means don't fill the statistical gaps either.

 

[Bocefish]

Seeing as how you know so much about the situation.... by all means, feel free to call CPD's gang unit commander and tell him how to fix things. :lol:

 

[Shaun__]

I wonder if he ever tried picking lottery numbers with his precognition ?

Police identified the slain co-worker as Steven Ercolino, 41, who had apparently filed a prior complaint against his assailant, claiming that he thought Johnson would eventually try to kill him.

 

[Bocefish]

I wonder if he ever tried picking lottery numbers with his precognition ?

Police identified the slain co-worker as Steven Ercolino, 41, who had apparently filed a prior complaint against his assailant, claiming that he thought Johnson would eventually try to kill him.

That would be a perfect example of why people sometimes need to arm themselves and file for a concealed weapons permit.

I also heard all of the injured bystanders were shot by police. :roll:

 

[Jupiter551]

Seeing as how you know so much about the situation.... by all means, feel free to call CPD's gang unit commander and tell him how to fix things. :lol:

Wut? Are the police all calling for free guns for citizens? What's that got to do with gun laws?

 

[Bocefish]

What does England have to do with Chicago gun laws, gang bangers and the Mexican Cartel??

Am I supposed to give a shit what gun laws England has?

 

[Jupiter551]

What does England have to do with Chicago gun laws, gang bangers and the Mexican Cartel??

Am I supposed to give a shit what gun laws England has?

Not at all, but earlier you said Chicago was "proof that gun control doesn't work" - would it not make sense to look at crime figures from gun-controlled societies before you make that assumption? I suspect it's not all that hard to buy a gun outside Chicago and drive there - and if that's the case then no, gun control will never work in an area surrounded by uncontrolled areas.

 

[Bocefish]

What does England have to do with Chicago gun laws, gang bangers and the Mexican Cartel??

Am I supposed to give a shit what gun laws England has?

Not at all, but earlier you said Chicago was "proof that gun control doesn't work" - would it not make sense to look at crime figures from gun-controlled societies before you make that assumption? I suspect it's not all that hard to buy a gun outside Chicago and drive there - and if that's the case then no, gun control will never work in an area surrounded by uncontrolled areas.

So... as the freest nation in the world, we should all turn in our guns for destruction like Australia did because we wouldn't want any part of our country with road, rail, water, or aircraft access to Chicago to have a legal, constitutional right to bear arms?

 

[Nordling]

:crybaby:

 

[Bocefish]

:crybaby:

What are the tears for?

 

[Nordling]

For all the potential mass murderers that had their BASIC freedoms denied in Australia.

Seriously, a gun is not a "natural" object. People going almost nuts screaming about their "god-given" rights taken away when all that's really being suggested is intelligent regulations and controls. All this while you can go to prison for growing a plant that has been growing freely since before humans existed.

Let's compromise. Let's allow strict interpretation of the Constitution. Allow firearms, but restrict them to single-loading muskets.

 

[Bocefish]

For all the potential mass murderers that had their BASIC freedoms denied in Australia.

Seriously, a gun is not a "natural" object. People going almost nuts screaming about their "god-given" rights taken away when all that's really being suggested is intelligent regulations and controls.

Is a computer a natural object? In certain hands it can cause mass chaos, death and destruction.

Maybe we should take away that potential mass murdering capability as well?

Still waiting for something meaningful and positive Nord.

 

[Nordling]

For all the potential mass murderers that had their BASIC freedoms denied in Australia.

Seriously, a gun is not a "natural" object. People going almost nuts screaming about their "god-given" rights taken away when all that's really being suggested is intelligent regulations and controls.

Is a computer a natural object? In certain hands it can cause mass chaos, death and destruction.

Maybe we should take away that potential mass murdering capability as well?

Still waiting for something meaningful and positive Nord.

I did. I offered muskets, which were the most advanced private arms available at the time the founders wrote the Constitution. The second Amendment didn't say you have the right to every possible weapon that exists or ever will exist. Not to even mention that the second amendment isn't that clear on what it means about well-regulated militias in the same sentence where it proclaims the "right" to bear arms. But that's another endless argument.

 

[Bocefish]

Here is a link you can argue all you want with your archaic ideas...

http://constitution.hillsdale.edu/201/C ... rce=JDH001

 

[Nordling]

Here is a link you can argue all you want with your archaic ideas...

http://constitution.hillsdale.edu/201/C ... rce=JDH001

Ha ha! You really are serious aren't you? :lol: Gee, think you could have found a site with more bias? Perhaps Stormfront? The very opening statement is a strawdog. As far as "archaic ideas," that's not just a hallmark, but virtually the definition of "conservatism."

 

[Bocefish]

Here is a link you can argue all you want with your archaic ideas...

http://constitution.hillsdale.edu/201/C ... rce=JDH001

Ha ha! You really are serious aren't you? :lol: Gee, think you could have found a site with more bias? Perhaps Stormfront? The very opening statement is a strawdog. As far as "archaic ideas," that's not just a hallmark, but virtually the definition of "conservatism."

You love to argue and bring up shit that is so out of date that it's almost laughable, so why not join that and argue with them. Who knows... you might teach them something.

 

[Nordling]

Here is a link you can argue all you want with your archaic ideas...

http://constitution.hillsdale.edu/201/C ... rce=JDH001

Ha ha! You really are serious aren't you? :lol: Gee, think you could have found a site with more bias? Perhaps Stormfront? The very opening statement is a strawdog. As far as "archaic ideas," that's not just a hallmark, but virtually the definition of "conservatism."

You love to argue and bring up shit that is so out of date that it's almost laughable, so why not join that and argue with them. Who knows... you might teach them something.

Sir, I have in the past and still assume you are a sane human...quite likely a nice human. I would not argue with you if I thought otherwise. Nutty sites like the one you linked I have no interest in.

 

[Bocefish]

your loss and don't call me sir.

 

[SweepTheLeg]

Reason why this is a story is because of the 9 by standers who got injured by the cops opening fire. If any of the 9 by standers had a concealed weapon certificate, does this mean they could have returned fire? No one shoots me and gets away with it.

 

[Nordling]

Reason why this is a story is because of the 9 by standers who got injured by the cops opening fire. If any of the 9 by standers had a concealed weapon certificate, does this mean they could have returned fire? No one shoots me and gets away with it.

Yeah, we could have had 50 or 100 people injured instead of 9...and maybe many deaths. What I got from the story is that handguns are not very accurate during a gunfight and that if more UNTRAINED (to the degree cops are) people carried weapons, we'd have even more idiotic casualties.

 

[Poker_Babe]