#WomenAgainstFeminism

[PlayboyMegan]

What do rape statistics have to do with feminism or anti-feminists?

I'm not going to say I'm for either or, I'm just going to say back before the feminists movement. It seems like families were more put together then they are today. Does that mean there were no fathers that beat there wives or packed there bags and left? Nf course there was, there are pieces of shit in every generation. It just seems the divorce rate has gone WAY up since then maybe its because in marriages today people feel like they should be independent not dependent on one another and get all power tripped, kids get into drugs and partying WAY younger now,since it is typical for both parents to work in modern society and kids are not being watched. My dad told me when he was young, there were hardly any broken homes, now today you can hardly find someone whose parents are still married. There just seems to have been a dramatic shift in a negative way in family values ever since the movement. But in the end we should all be equal, it just seems whenever anyone gets rights in this country there's a 5-10% positive outcome and then the rest is just negative.

I hate that because you divorce it's considered a "broken home." What about calling it "two different better homes" instead? Most people save divorce for extreme circumstances. I think most children are much happier in a split home with two happy parents, than living in an abusive chaotic house with two people who hate each other. Sure, I've been a witness to selfish divorces where one parent had a mid-life crisis and decided they wanted to party and date again for fun. But that's usually not the case.
I don't think both parents working have much to do with kids doing drugs at a young age. I read an article a long time ago explaining that kids dabble in drugs usually out if boredom. As a teen that did drugs, I can agree with that. I honestly think the best way to prevent drug use amongst teens is to have them be involved in after school things, like sports. My bf had NEVER tried drugs as a teen and when I asked him why he told me it was because he was so focused on basketball that he didn't have time for drugs, and they drug tested him routinely.

 

[KudosKids]

What do rape statistics have to do with feminism or anti-feminists?

I'm not going to say I'm for either or, I'm just going to say back before the feminists movement. It seems like families were more put together then they are today. Does that mean there were no fathers that beat there wives or packed there bags and left? Nf course there was, there are pieces of shit in every generation. It just seems the divorce rate has gone WAY up since then maybe its because in marriages today people feel like they should be independent not dependent on one another and get all power tripped, kids get into drugs and partying WAY younger now,since it is typical for both parents to work in modern society and kids are not being watched. My dad told me when he was young, there were hardly any broken homes, now today you can hardly find someone whose parents are still married. There just seems to have been a dramatic shift in a negative way in family values ever since the movement. But in the end we should all be equal, it just seems whenever anyone gets rights in this country there's a 5-10% positive outcome and then the rest is just negative.

I hate that because you divorce it's considered a "broken home." What about calling it "two different better homes" instead? Most people save divorce for extreme circumstances. I think most children are much happier in a split home with two happy parents, than living in an abusive chaotic house with two people who hate each other. Sure, I've been a witness to selfish divorces where one parent had a mid-life crisis and decided they wanted to party and date again for fun. But that's usually not the case.
I don't think both parents working have much to do with kids doing drugs at a young age. I read an article a long time ago explaining that kids dabble in drugs usually out if boredom. As a teen that did drugs, I can agree with that. I honestly think the best way to prevent drug use amongst teens is to have them be involved in after school things, like sports. My bf had NEVER tried drugs as a teen and when I asked him why he told me it was because he was so focused on basketball that he didn't have time for drugs, and they drug tested him routinely.

Maybe its because I grew up in a old school house. So that is why I use that term, as growing up that is what my elders used which has now become part of my lingo. I honestly don't have any members in my family that have been divorced. And all the marriages in my family are extremely happy and all of them are 25 years plus and going strong. Like I said previously in this post, people have there opinions on this subject based off there own life experiences. And this is mine.

 

[Nordling]

Maybe think outside the box? I mean, it's great that you were lucky enough to be born into an infinite Ozzie & Harriet extended family, but very few people are, and their lives and experiences are just as valid as yours.

 

[PlayboyMegan]

What do rape statistics have to do with feminism or anti-feminists?

I'm not going to say I'm for either or, I'm just going to say back before the feminists movement. It seems like families were more put together then they are today. Does that mean there were no fathers that beat there wives or packed there bags and left? Nf course there was, there are pieces of shit in every generation. It just seems the divorce rate has gone WAY up since then maybe its because in marriages today people feel like they should be independent not dependent on one another and get all power tripped, kids get into drugs and partying WAY younger now,since it is typical for both parents to work in modern society and kids are not being watched. My dad told me when he was young, there were hardly any broken homes, now today you can hardly find someone whose parents are still married. There just seems to have been a dramatic shift in a negative way in family values ever since the movement. But in the end we should all be equal, it just seems whenever anyone gets rights in this country there's a 5-10% positive outcome and then the rest is just negative.

I hate that because you divorce it's considered a "broken home." What about calling it "two different better homes" instead? Most people save divorce for extreme circumstances. I think most children are much happier in a split home with two happy parents, than living in an abusive chaotic house with two people who hate each other. Sure, I've been a witness to selfish divorces where one parent had a mid-life crisis and decided they wanted to party and date again for fun. But that's usually not the case.
I don't think both parents working have much to do with kids doing drugs at a young age. I read an article a long time ago explaining that kids dabble in drugs usually out if boredom. As a teen that did drugs, I can agree with that. I honestly think the best way to prevent drug use amongst teens is to have them be involved in after school things, like sports. My bf had NEVER tried drugs as a teen and when I asked him why he told me it was because he was so focused on basketball that he didn't have time for drugs, and they drug tested him routinely.

Maybe its because I grew up in a old school house. So that is why I use that term, as growing up that is what my elders used which has now become part of my lingo. I honestly don't have any members in my family that have been divorced. And all the marriages in my family are extremely happy and all of them are 25 years plus and going strong. Like I said previously in this post, people have there opinions on this subject based off there own life experiences. And this is mine.

That's fine but please try to look at it from a different view before judging people and their decisions.
My aunt and uncle were married for over 20 years and had a great relationship most of the time. But after he got cancer and went through chemo, he drastically changed. He was so mentally abusive, every single day. I couldn't stand to be around him and his nastiness. She put up with it for a few more years and exhausted all options (counseling and medication) before she wanted a divorce. It just wasn't a healthy relationship any more and her kids did not enjoy seeing her suffer. People change, circumstances change, and what was once a good relationship can turn into a living nightmare. I'm so happy most of society has accepted this and people aren't forced to be in an abusive relationship any more.

 

[KudosKids]

What do rape statistics have to do with feminism or anti-feminists?

I'm not going to say I'm for either or, I'm just going to say back before the feminists movement. It seems like families were more put together then they are today. Does that mean there were no fathers that beat there wives or packed there bags and left? Nf course there was, there are pieces of shit in every generation. It just seems the divorce rate has gone WAY up since then maybe its because in marriages today people feel like they should be independent not dependent on one another and get all power tripped, kids get into drugs and partying WAY younger now,since it is typical for both parents to work in modern society and kids are not being watched. My dad told me when he was young, there were hardly any broken homes, now today you can hardly find someone whose parents are still married. There just seems to have been a dramatic shift in a negative way in family values ever since the movement. But in the end we should all be equal, it just seems whenever anyone gets rights in this country there's a 5-10% positive outcome and then the rest is just negative.

I hate that because you divorce it's considered a "broken home." What about calling it "two different better homes" instead? Most people save divorce for extreme circumstances. I think most children are much happier in a split home with two happy parents, than living in an abusive chaotic house with two people who hate each other. Sure, I've been a witness to selfish divorces where one parent had a mid-life crisis and decided they wanted to party and date again for fun. But that's usually not the case.
I don't think both parents working have much to do with kids doing drugs at a young age. I read an article a long time ago explaining that kids dabble in drugs usually out if boredom. As a teen that did drugs, I can agree with that. I honestly think the best way to prevent drug use amongst teens is to have them be involved in after school things, like sports. My bf had NEVER tried drugs as a teen and when I asked him why he told me it was because he was so focused on basketball that he didn't have time for drugs, and they drug tested him routinely.

Maybe its because I grew up in a old school house. So that is why I use that term, as growing up that is what my elders used which has now become part of my lingo. I honestly don't have any members in my family that have been divorced. And all the marriages in my family are extremely happy and all of them are 25 years plus and going strong. Like I said previously in this post, people have there opinions on this subject based off there own life experiences. And this is mine.

That's fine but please try to look at it from a different view before judging people and their decisions.
My aunt and uncle were married for over 20 years and had a great relationship most of the time. But after he got cancer and went through chemo, he drastically changed. He was so mentally abusive, every single day. I couldn't stand to be around him and his nastiness. She put up with it for a few more years and exhausted all options (counseling and medication) before she wanted a divorce. It just wasn't a healthy relationship any more and her kids did not enjoy seeing her suffer. People change, circumstances change, and what was once a good relationship can turn into a living nightmare. I'm so happy most of society has accepted this and people aren't forced to be in an abusive relationship any more.

Oh no I totally understand my family is very rare and I am very fortunate that I got to grow up the way I did. Its not like I've been a loner, I have seen all my friends parents go through divorces while I was in high school. But because I did grow up this way. Divorce is just not something I believe in. Which is why I have personally not gotten married yet, because I want to make sure I can spend the rest of my days with this women. I'm sorry about your aunt&uncle. That is very sad to have to throw away all that time spent. Must have been a very hard decision for her.

 

[GweenBlack]

Maybe think outside the box? I mean, it's great that you were lucky enough to be born into an infinite Ozzie & Harriet extended family, but very few people are, and their lives and experiences are just as valid as yours.

I notice that Kudos is extremely about "what i lived is what is true". His vision about the world in all the topics/posts he wrote until now is about how he lived something and assumed that is true.

Just pointing here something about the rape, in most countries to a rape violence be considered in the police files as RAPE, you have to take the victim right after the rape was made, so she/him (in brazil rape is for all the sex, not only penis-vagina) must take the exam and collect DNA samples on the sperm/saliva/sweat of the aggressor.

If you don't fill this, they cant do a formal record of rape in case you get pregnant so you can abort (the only way to legally abort in brazil or if the woman is in extremely sensitive health condition). Which is not the same statistic as the interview method, where rape, even the marital one (S.O. forces other S.O. for sex), is counted.

There is so much about rape culture to be discussed, but denying it is not a feminist fight and blaming it on broken homes is being innocent.

here are some forms of rape that you can get arrested in Brazil, just for curiosity of rape data.

- penis-vagina
- penis-anus
- vagina-vagina
- marital rape ( S.O. - S.O., male or female)
- forced kiss (it is rape)
- Drunk person, even if she/he says yes.
- younger than 14 year old, (even if she/he says yes)
- mentally disabled/physically disabled (by gov exams) even if she/he says yes.

anyways, my point is, don't assume things because in your small world your view is perfect. My parents are divorced, live in the same house and we are all three of us best friends about everything (really, we talk about everything). I would say my parents marriage stop being monogamist and being in an open relationship without married rings are much better and healthier than most marriages i've seen in my family. It is OK if you act like your world is perfect, but closing your eyes that people that doesn't live in your way are unfortunate is rude.

 

[JerryBoBerry]

And all the marriages in my family are extremely happy and all of them are 25 years plus and going strong. Like I said previously in this post, people have there opinions on this subject based off there own life experiences. And this is mine.

Betting that's an illusion. My parents were married 43 years before my mom died. To everyone else outside the family they were happy and it was a rock solid marriage. Privately, to me, she admitted she wished she hadn't married my dad. And if she could do it all over again she wouldn't have. People put on public faces all the time to avoid outside people's questions.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence till you hop over and land in the dung piles.

 

[MintyFlowers]

And all the marriages in my family are extremely happy and all of them are 25 years plus and going strong. Like I said previously in this post, people have there opinions on this subject based off there own life experiences. And this is mine.

Betting that's an illusion. My parents were married 43 years before my mom died. To everyone else outside the family they were happy and it was a rock solid marriage. Privately, to me, she admitted she wished she hadn't married my dad. And if she could do it all over again she wouldn't have. People put on public faces all the time to avoid outside people's questions.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence till you hop over and land in the dung piles.

I'm really sorry to hear that and thank you for sharing your experience because it probably isn't an easy thing to share.

KudosKids: I get what you're trying to say. In a perfect world, we would have happily married couples (in my utopia, EVERYONE, including gay, bi, lesbian, trans, non-binary and etc would get their preferred pronoun and be married as such, and poly relationships are totally okay), because yes, families raised with at least two parent figures with stable income, and time to dedicate to their children produce children who are generally going to fair better in school, on standardized tests, and be healthier. But that's not reality. Reality is that domestic abuse (both men and women experience this), in relationships are a serious problem, people change, people can be unhappy, and it can/does negatively impact children.

http://www.drphil.com/articles/article/37
(Not a perfect academic article, but he cites some sources).

"Here is what I've gleaned from the many good studies I've read on the subject: It is the quality of parents' relationships with each other, rather than whether they are married or single, that matters most for kids' well-being. Parental conflict isn't good for children's happiness, whether or not you are married.
"Studies of two-parent families have consistently found that when a couple's relationship is characterized by unresolved conflict and unhappiness, their children tend to have more acting out aggressive behavior problems, more shy withdrawn behavior, and fewer social and academic skills," write UC Berkeley researchers Phil and Carolyn Cowan."
http://greatergood.berkeley.edu/raising ... r_the_kids
References also at the bottom.

Nobody likes divorce, and not very many people get into marriages planning to divorce, but it's better than people staying in unhealthy marriages that will affect their lives, and the lives of their children.

Here's some general information as to why people get divorced:
http://www.divorce.usu.edu/files/uploads/lesson3.pdf

For the people who do try to do the noble thing, and try to stay together for their kids? They should be commended, and praised, but if they fight often, in front of their children, then they should consider other means of getting help, like counseling (if they have the means), and it isn't a shame to call it quits.

Gween: I'm so happy to hear that Brazil has such a set, and thorough definition for rape!

 

[KudosKids]

I can see what you ladies are saying. Just because I do not believe in divorce, doesn't mean I shun people who get divorced. I've seen ugly married couples. I've seen the dad get wasted come home and yell about how much he hates his family for hours. I've seen the unappreciative mother who takes her whole family for granted and does nothing but lie around on the couch high off pills and when sober is abusive and psychotic. Just because I grew up in a non abusive home, does not mean I was blind to abusive homes. I had to fight a few dads in my day. And I've kicked ass to pretty much all my sisters boyfriends. I understand in times like this, you should probably step away from that person for your own sanity. But I have also seen many many marriages fall apart because one person decided they thought they could do better for themselves for there own selfish reasons, not out of any type of abuse. Reasons like that I do not condone, you made a promise to that person you would love and cherish them through every struggle til death do us part. Don't stand there and say the words if your not going to do it. Honestly in my opinion, I feel marriage feels like a trap for most people eventually. At first it seems candy and flowers and unicorns are shooting out from the sky every time your with that person. And then you get married and people feel now they are forced to be with this person instead of doing it willingly and that can suck a relationship dry and end in divorce. I will never get legally married for this reason. I've seen to many divorces get ugly, to do that, and its fair to say I like to keep my stuff and if your going to walk out on me I sure as hell am not going to give you a monthly check. But I will spiritually marry someone, I will buy the ring and have the service and stand before god and tell him I am marrying this woman. I don't need a certificate to prove my love to someone.

 

[Leon_Omega]

Are you seriously suggesting that most divorces are a result of abuse? Do you know any actual human beings? In nearly every case I've personally witnessed, the two people involved "got sick of each other", one or both of them cheated, and they got divorced. But divorce isn't even the main point. The big trend today is children born completely out of wedlock. Marriage isn't even happening in the first place for there to be a divorce. The number is now close to 40%, and those children are at a massive disadvantage.

Abuse in this context does not necessarily have to mean physical abuse, I'm betting that there are a lot more divorces because of the emotional abuse generated by two people being in a relationship with the wrong person. I don't see a high divorce rate as an inherently bad thing because that also means that there is a high percentage of unhealthy marriages to begin with. Given that fact, I'd rather see the people involved being able to resolve that problem rather than being stuck in a situation they may simply not have thought through enough beforehand. Also consider that a factor in the higher divorce rate is the fact that there is less of a social stigma to being divorced than there was back in the 50s. As it became more socially acceptable, more people chose to get divorced rather than stay with a partner that wasn't right for them.

I should also point out that I don't think being married is a requirement for a healthy relationship. Of course there is a symbolic value to entering a bond with your significant other, but if my partner would not feel she needed to marry me, then I'd be perfectly happy "merely" living together with her.

 

[Joeternal]

I'm not interested in spending a lot of time digging up links to "prove" things to people, but here's a pretty good summary of the effect of divorce on children:

http://fatherhood.about.com/od/fathersr ... merica.htm

Long story short, they're at a greater risk for every bad thing that can happen to a person, and the effects carry on through their entire lives. Children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes (usually the mother), with little or no relationship with the father are at even greater risk. Those are facts.

So anyone who is married and has kids, and gets divorced for any reason other than extreme circumstances, is acting selfishly. By definition. Throughout the entire boom of divorce and decline of marriage, the rationalization has been put forth that "children are better off if their parents do what makes them happy". That's a lie.

 

[SexySteph]

I'm not interested in spending a lot of time digging up links to "prove" things to people, but here's a pretty good summary of the effect of divorce on children:

http://fatherhood.about.com/od/fathersr ... merica.htm

Long story short, they're at a greater risk for every bad thing that can happen to a person, and the effects carry on through their entire lives. Children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes (usually the mother), with little or no relationship with the father are at even greater risk. Those are facts.

So anyone who is married and has kids, and gets divorced for any reason other than extreme circumstances, is acting selfishly. By definition. Throughout the entire boom of divorce and decline of marriage, the rationalization has been put forth that "children are better off if their parents do what makes them happy". That's a lie.

Correlation is not causation. Perhaps those children are at risk because living with parents the hate each other created a negative environment and they'd have issues whether or not the divorce happend? Maybe kids being raised by single mothers are at risk because many of them are living below or near the poverty line due to being in a single income household?

 

[Joeternal]

I'm not interested in spending a lot of time digging up links to "prove" things to people, but here's a pretty good summary of the effect of divorce on children:

http://fatherhood.about.com/od/fathersr ... merica.htm

Long story short, they're at a greater risk for every bad thing that can happen to a person, and the effects carry on through their entire lives. Children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes (usually the mother), with little or no relationship with the father are at even greater risk. Those are facts.

So anyone who is married and has kids, and gets divorced for any reason other than extreme circumstances, is acting selfishly. By definition. Throughout the entire boom of divorce and decline of marriage, the rationalization has been put forth that "children are better off if their parents do what makes them happy". That's a lie.

Correlation is not causation. Perhaps those children are at risk because living with parents the hate each other created a negative environment and they'd have issues whether or not the divorce happend? Maybe kids being raised by single mothers are at risk because many of them are living below or near the poverty line due to being in a single income household?

The economic aspect is a big part of it. The gap in lifetime earnings is large. That's included in the studies. The correlation is extremely strong, and there is no other valid causation. It is as close to a proven fact as anything can be in sociological studies.

 

[Leon_Omega]

I'm not interested in spending a lot of time digging up links to "prove" things to people, but here's a pretty good summary of the effect of divorce on children:

http://fatherhood.about.com/od/fathersr ... merica.htm

Long story short, they're at a greater risk for every bad thing that can happen to a person, and the effects carry on through their entire lives. Children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes (usually the mother), with little or no relationship with the father are at even greater risk. Those are facts.

So anyone who is married and has kids, and gets divorced for any reason other than extreme circumstances, is acting selfishly. By definition. Throughout the entire boom of divorce and decline of marriage, the rationalization has been put forth that "children are better off if their parents do what makes them happy". That's a lie.

Correlation is not causation. Perhaps those children are at risk because living with parents the hate each other created a negative environment and they'd have issues whether or not the divorce happend? Maybe kids being raised by single mothers are at risk because many of them are living below or near the poverty line due to being in a single income household?

Exactly, there are a large number of factors that contribute to this problem and parental influence is one of many. There's no denying that single-parent homes have it very rough due to the cost of living and the necessity of working long shifts to compensate that, which in turn means that less time and effort can go into parenting.

However, I would posit that if a household is bad enough to consider a divorce, the children will be fucked no matter what happens. Sorry to have to be blunt about this, but two people who know each other intimately can make very dirty fighters when going up against one another, a divorce can prevent a far more harmful situation for a child (think one or both parents becoming physically abusive over time or using the child against the other).

Also, what would be a reason for divorce that doesn't count as "extreme circumstances"? Because I don't think that one parent who is cheating on the other because they aren't satisfied would set a healthy example for their child.

 

[KudosKids]

Why do you assume that because people are getting divorced that they must have damaged the child before the divorce happened and thats why the statistics are that way? There is tons of marriages where they announced there divorce to there kids and they were completely shocked and do not understand what is going on or why this is happening to there family. There are plenty of parents that even though they may not love each other anymore, they love there kids enough to not fight around them or show angst towards each other around them because they know it is not healthy for there child. Those statistics are as real as the rape ones several people were discussing. There are many factors.

 

[MintyFlowers]

I'm not interested in spending a lot of time digging up links to "prove" things to people, but here's a pretty good summary of the effect of divorce on children:

http://fatherhood.about.com/od/fathersr ... merica.htm

Long story short, they're at a greater risk for every bad thing that can happen to a person, and the effects carry on through their entire lives. Children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes (usually the mother), with little or no relationship with the father are at even greater risk. Those are facts.

So anyone who is married and has kids, and gets divorced for any reason other than extreme circumstances, is acting selfishly. By definition. Throughout the entire boom of divorce and decline of marriage, the rationalization has been put forth that "children are better off if their parents do what makes them happy". That's a lie.

Correlation is not causation. Perhaps those children are at risk because living with parents the hate each other created a negative environment and they'd have issues whether or not the divorce happend? Maybe kids being raised by single mothers are at risk because many of them are living below or near the poverty line due to being in a single income household?

The economic aspect is a big part of it. The gap in lifetime earnings is large. That's included in the studies. The correlation is extremely strong, and there is no other valid causation. It is as close to a proven fact as anything can be in sociological studies.

When we're looking at single-mothers, do you really think their problem is going to be solved just by marrying someone?

I'm going to reiterate my copypasta:
" It is the quality of parents' relationships with each other, rather than whether they are married or single, that matters most for kids' well-being. Parental conflict isn't good for children's happiness, whether or not you are married.
"Studies of two-parent families have consistently found that when a couple's relationship is characterized by unresolved conflict and unhappiness, their children tend to have more acting out aggressive behavior problems, more shy withdrawn behavior, and fewer social and academic skills," write UC Berkeley researchers Phil and Carolyn Cowan."
http://greatergood.berkeley.edu/raising ... r_the_kids
Cowan, P.A., and C.P. Cowan. "Strengthening Couples to Improve Children's Well-Being: What We Know Now." Poverty Research News 6, no. 3 (2002): 18-21.
There are other references in the article.

Definitely, higher income usually means you're able to take time off work without severe repercussions, you can spend more time with your children, afford to feed them much healthier foods, send them to nicer schools, and etc.
(Although we know this isn't always true, because a higher-income single parent may have to work at the office all day due to the nature of the job they have.)

If it's the children to be concerned, we as a collective society, should invest in single parents, help support them with their endeavors so that in turn, they have more time to invest in their children, better the lives of their children, and better the quality of our youth in general.

However, I would posit that if a household is bad enough to consider a divorce, the children will be fucked no matter what happens.

You make many excellent points and I agree with the majority of your posts so far, but please let me offer this statistic.

"More than 75 percent of children with divorced parents end up as happy and well adjusted as their counterparts with intact families. In a study of more than 1,400 families, it was found that, "the other 20 percent developed some kind of psychological, emotional, or academic problem, compared to 10 percent of the non-divorced group."
From "For Better or Worse: Divorce Reconsidered" by E. Mavis Hetherington, Ph.D., and John Kelly.

 

[HiGirlsRHot]

I'm not interested in spending a lot of time digging up links to "prove" things to people, but here's a pretty good summary of the effect of divorce on children:

http://fatherhood.about.com/od/fathersr ... merica.htm

Long story short, they're at a greater risk for every bad thing that can happen to a person, and the effects carry on through their entire lives. Children born out of wedlock and raised in single parent homes (usually the mother), with little or no relationship with the father are at even greater risk. Those are facts.

So anyone who is married and has kids, and gets divorced for any reason other than extreme circumstances, is acting selfishly. By definition. Throughout the entire boom of divorce and decline of marriage, the rationalization has been put forth that "children are better off if their parents do what makes them happy". That's a lie.

Correlation is not causation. Perhaps those children are at risk because living with parents the hate each other created a negative environment and they'd have issues whether or not the divorce happend? Maybe kids being raised by single mothers are at risk because many of them are living below or near the poverty line due to being in a single income household?

The about.com article is a pretty good summary and if you noticed it had links in practically every paragraph. It is one of those inconvenient truths that isn't popular in our "every lifestyle and every culture is equally valid" mythology. I am surprised that a woman studies major wouldn't have run across this to be honest. There have been so many studies over the decades that have been able to do things like control for income levels and still found problems. So they have proven a causality between divorcee and increased risk for kids have problems latter in life.

That said it is important to keep things in perspective. Most kids grow up just fine, regardless if they come from stable families or are children of divorcee.

This Scientific American article puts it nicely. http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-divorce-bad-for-children/?page=1

Most children of divorce also do well in the longer term. In a quantitative review of the literature in 2001, sociologist Paul R. Amato, then at Pennsylvania State University, examined the possible effects on children several years after a divorce. The studies compared children of married parents with those who experienced divorce at different ages. The investigators followed these kids into later childhood, adolescence or the teenage years, assessing their academic achievement, emotional and behavior problems, delinquency, self-concept and social relationships. On average, the studies found only very small differences on all these measures between children of divorced parents and those from intact families, suggesting that the vast majority of children endure divorce well.

So for example about 25% kids who's parents divorcee have mental health issues as opposed about 10% for 2 parents households. While the difference is significant the more important take way for me is that 75% of kids who's parents have been divorced don't have long term problems. Hell some children of divorce even grow up to become President of the United States.

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

 

[Leon_Omega]

You make many excellent points and I agree with the majority of your posts so far, but please let me offer this statistic.

"More than 75 percent of children with divorced parents end up as happy and well adjusted as their counterparts with intact families. In a study of more than 1,400 families, it was found that, "the other 20 percent developed some kind of psychological, emotional, or academic problem, compared to 10 percent of the non-divorced group."
From "For Better or Worse: Divorce Reconsidered" by E. Mavis Hetherington, Ph.D., and John Kelly.

This statistic makes me pretty damn happy. On reflection I guess I should have seen that having a good example of what not to do also plays a large part in someone's development.

Upon further reflection I really should have known this better since my best friend is a single mother of three (from two different fathers) and so far all of them have proven to be incredibly well-adjusted, especially considering that they're all still in their teens.

 

[SexySteph]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

 

[Joeternal]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

The real problem is that people have bought into, and allowed themselves to be brainwashed by, the entire Baby Boomer, 1960s and 70s, hippies and disco mindset, hook, line and sinker, without ever questioning it. On the one hand it is self-evident that they are a worthless generation, and their entire "leadership" of society has been botched, and has left us all with a worse future. We now know for a fact that we will all be worse off in the long run than they were. They're a bunch of drunks who ran up a huge tab on a lifelong bender, and they left us the bill.

And yet so many of us continue to lap up everything they've told us like obedient dogs, and defend them using their own convoluted rationalizations. At some point, somebody's got to rebel against them and break the cycle, or we are all finished.

That's what I like about #WomenAgainstFeminism. They are true rebels, with true courage.

/end rant

 

[Nordling]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

The real problem is that people have bought into, and allowed themselves to be brainwashed by, the entire Baby Boomer, 1960s and 70s, hippies and disco mindset, hook, line and sinker, without ever questioning it. On the one hand it is self-evident that they are a worthless generation, and their entire "leadership" of society has been botched, and has left us all with a worse future. We now know for a fact that we will all be worse off in the long run than they were. They're a bunch of drunks who ran up a huge tab on a lifelong bender, and they left us the bill.

And yet so many of us continue to lap up everything they've told us like obedient dogs, and defend them using their own convoluted rationalizations. At some point, somebody's got to rebel against them and break the cycle, or we are all finished.

That's what I like about #WomenAgainstFeminism. They are true rebels, with true courage.

/end rant

Hippies AND disco. Mindset. Worthless. Lap up. Obedient dogs.

You're showing your complete ignorance of humans from different generations.

 

[Joeternal]

If it's the children to be concerned, we as a collective society, should invest in single parents, help support them with their endeavors so that in turn, they have more time to invest in their children, better the lives of their children, and better the quality of our youth in general.

I'm not someone who believes the government should do nothing to help people who are in need. But you have to understand that as these trends increase, you are going to have a poorer, less educated, less employable society, with a higher prevalence of all kinds of pathologies. As the number of households that fall into this category grows, the government payments will have to grow, taking money out of productive enterprise and putting it into welfare payments. That will drag down the entire economy, which will only serve to perpetuate and reinforce the social pathologies that produce dependency.

It's a societal death spiral. Unless the root causes are addressed - which in this case is children being born out of wedlock and raised by single parents - the whole thing is going to collapse. That's not an exaggeration, either. It's already happening.

 

[KudosKids]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

The real problem is that people have bought into, and allowed themselves to be brainwashed by, the entire Baby Boomer, 1960s and 70s, hippies and disco mindset, hook, line and sinker, without ever questioning it. On the one hand it is self-evident that they are a worthless generation, and their entire "leadership" of society has been botched, and has left us all with a worse future. We now know for a fact that we will all be worse off in the long run than they were. They're a bunch of drunks who ran up a huge tab on a lifelong bender, and they left us the bill.

And yet so many of us continue to lap up everything they've told us like obedient dogs, and defend them using their own convoluted rationalizations. At some point, somebody's got to rebel against them and break the cycle, or we are all finished.

That's what I like about #WomenAgainstFeminism. They are true rebels, with true courage.

/end rant

I wouldn't say they were worthless generation. They fought for equality. And they got what they wanted, which was there rights. Yes indeed, the baby boomers did a lot more negative to our society then they did positive. But I wouldn't take back the rights that people fought long and hard for. I would like to add though, because of our past people take advantage of there rights.You have plenty of african americans going around saying "Oh its because I'm black" when in reality its because you just don't know how to act obviously and use that as a defense mechanism. You have psycho women calling the cops for getting raped and beat when in reality they were not. Your past generations fought so hard to give you your freedom, and your going to spit on it like that? It is times like those, where I shake my head and look down and think to myself, and you deserve your rights because? I believe racism and anti-feminism wouldn't be as alive as it still is today if people like this would not take advantage of what there past generation fought for.

 

[Joeternal]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

The real problem is that people have bought into, and allowed themselves to be brainwashed by, the entire Baby Boomer, 1960s and 70s, hippies and disco mindset, hook, line and sinker, without ever questioning it. On the one hand it is self-evident that they are a worthless generation, and their entire "leadership" of society has been botched, and has left us all with a worse future. We now know for a fact that we will all be worse off in the long run than they were. They're a bunch of drunks who ran up a huge tab on a lifelong bender, and they left us the bill.

And yet so many of us continue to lap up everything they've told us like obedient dogs, and defend them using their own convoluted rationalizations. At some point, somebody's got to rebel against them and break the cycle, or we are all finished.

That's what I like about #WomenAgainstFeminism. They are true rebels, with true courage.

/end rant

Hippies AND disco. Mindset. Worthless. Lap up. Obedient dogs.

You're showing your complete ignorance of humans from different generations.

I'm going to guess, given your overall hostility to my points, that you're a Baby Boomer. I have no illusions that they will ever accept responsibility for the damage they've done, or admit flat out what we all know is true, which is that they never gave a damn about their kids, or anyone else besides themselves. They got theirs, and they couldn't care less what happens to the rest of us after they're gone. They've made all of that absolutely clear.

Maybe once they're gone, we can regain some sanity and rebuild something from the ashes they left us. But it's going to be ugly.

 

[SexySteph]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

The real problem is that people have bought into, and allowed themselves to be brainwashed by, the entire Baby Boomer, 1960s and 70s, hippies and disco mindset, hook, line and sinker, without ever questioning it. On the one hand it is self-evident that they are a worthless generation, and their entire "leadership" of society has been botched, and has left us all with a worse future. We now know for a fact that we will all be worse off in the long run than they were. They're a bunch of drunks who ran up a huge tab on a lifelong bender, and they left us the bill.

And yet so many of us continue to lap up everything they've told us like obedient dogs, and defend them using their own convoluted rationalizations. At some point, somebody's got to rebel against them and break the cycle, or we are all finished.

That's what I like about #WomenAgainstFeminism. They are true rebels, with true courage.

/end rant

Hippies AND disco. Mindset. Worthless. Lap up. Obedient dogs.

You're showing your complete ignorance of humans from different generations.

I'm going to guess, given your overall hostility to my points, that you're a Baby Boomer. I have no illusions that they will ever accept responsibility for the damage they've done, or admit flat out what we all know is true, which is that they never gave a damn about their kids, or anyone else besides themselves. They got theirs, and they couldn't care less what happens to the rest of us after they're gone. They've made all of that absolutely clear.

Maybe once they're gone, we can regain some sanity and rebuild something from the ashes they left us. But it's going to be ugly.

I agree that the baby boomer generation has created some issues (the economy is fucked, college cost is at an all time high but they can't figure out why we take out loans)

BUT I don't think that we can blame them for divorce rate or single parent families, I don't we can blame the divorce rate or single parent families for societies issues.

You are so off topic I don't even know where you are.

 

[Nordling]

I'm also puzzled what this has to do with feminism.

KudosKid and JoeEternal are suggesting that feminism has created these issues by making the divorce rate rise.

The real problem is that people have bought into, and allowed themselves to be brainwashed by, the entire Baby Boomer, 1960s and 70s, hippies and disco mindset, hook, line and sinker, without ever questioning it. On the one hand it is self-evident that they are a worthless generation, and their entire "leadership" of society has been botched, and has left us all with a worse future. We now know for a fact that we will all be worse off in the long run than they were. They're a bunch of drunks who ran up a huge tab on a lifelong bender, and they left us the bill.

And yet so many of us continue to lap up everything they've told us like obedient dogs, and defend them using their own convoluted rationalizations. At some point, somebody's got to rebel against them and break the cycle, or we are all finished.

That's what I like about #WomenAgainstFeminism. They are true rebels, with true courage.

/end rant

Hippies AND disco. Mindset. Worthless. Lap up. Obedient dogs.

You're showing your complete ignorance of humans from different generations.

I'm going to guess, given your overall hostility to my points, that you're a Baby Boomer. I have no illusions that they will ever accept responsibility for the damage they've done, or admit flat out what we all know is true, which is that they never gave a damn about their kids, or anyone else besides themselves. They got theirs, and they couldn't care less what happens to the rest of us after they're gone. They've made all of that absolutely clear.

Maybe once they're gone, we can regain some sanity and rebuild something from the ashes they left us. But it's going to be ugly.

It is you who is guessing. No, I'm not a Baby Boomer. And it is you who is showing hostility--to an entire generation of fellow humans. And yeah, I feel anger whenever someone shows bigotry toward a group...whether it be race, ethnicity, gender, religion or GENERATION.

 

[Joeternal]

I wouldn't say they were worthless generation. They fought for equality. And they got what they wanted, which was there rights.

That's the story they tell you about themselves. But it's phony. The Civil Rights movement came before them, when the Baby Boomers were still minors. Martin Luther King, Jr. and people of that period were not Baby Boomers. They were older.

Woodstock was the Baby Boomers. And later Disco. I can sympathize with their opposition to the draft, but you can't deny that that too was a selfish "movement". "Sex, drugs and rock and roll", "the me generation", that's the Baby Boomers. The Beastie Boys put it right: "You gotta fight for your right to party". That's what they were always about.

Same thing with feminism. The important movement, particularly the right to vote, was way before them. The Baby Boomer feminists are the ones we're discussing here, the ones who are extreme, anti-male and anti-child, the ones #WomenAgainstFeminism are against.

 

[SexySteph]

Same things with feminism. The important movement, particularly the right to vote, was way before them. The Baby Boomer feminists are the ones we're discussing here, the ones who are extreme, anti-male and anti-child, the ones #WomenAgainstFeminism are against.

Feminism is not anti-male or anti-child... Feminists were fighting for important things still in that generation. Gaining the right to vote wasn't the only hurdle in women's way. Should we have stopped there?

 

[JerryBoBerry]

“Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers.”
~ paraphrase from Clouds by Aristophanes.

Generations. People been bitching about ones other than their own for 2400 years now.

 

[Joeternal]

I agree that the baby boomer generation has created some issues (the economy is fucked, college cost is at an all time high but they can't figure out why we take out loans)

BUT I don't think that we can blame them for divorce rate or single parent families,

We definitely can. They're the ones who created this trend.

I don't we can blame the divorce rate or single parent families for societies issues.

Not all issues, but many of them.

You are so off topic I don't even know where you are.

It's all related. It's the big picture context for the specific things being discussed in this thread.