#WomenAgainstFeminism

[Joeternal]

“Our youth now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for their elders and love chatter in place of exercise; they no longer rise when elders enter the room; they contradict their parents, chatter before company; gobble up their food and tyrannize their teachers.”
~ paraphrase from Clouds by Aristophanes.

Generations. People been bitching about ones other than their own for 2400 years now.

Many "great" and powerful civilizations throughout history have also collapsed and disappeared, including Ancient Greece. Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

 

[KudosKids]

The baby boomers was the largest generation and it went from 1946-1964. This is what they fought for.

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Women's Rights Movement in the U.S.
Timeline of Key Events in the American Women's Rights Movement
1921–1979
by Ann-Marie Imbornoni

Discover the key events of the women's rights movement in the United States. This timeline covers the years of 1921 to 1979, which includes the formation of the Planned Parenthood Federation of America and the first lesbian organization in the U.S., plus the FDA approval of birth control pills and the establishment of legal abortion.



1955
The Daughters of Bilitis (DOB), the first lesbian organization in the United States, is founded. Although DOB originated as a social group, it later developed into a political organization to win basic acceptance for lesbians in the United States.

Top
1960
The Food and Drug Administration approves birth control pills.

1961
President John Kennedy establishes the President's Commission on the Status of Women and appoints Eleanor Roosevelt as chairwoman. The report issued by the Commission in 1963 documents substantial discrimination against women in the workplace and makes specific recommendations for improvement, including fair hiring practices, paid maternity leave, and affordable child care.

1963
Betty Friedan publishes her highly influential book The Feminine Mystique, which describes the dissatisfaction felt by middle-class American housewives with the narrow role imposed on them by society. The book becomes a best-seller and galvanizes the modern women's rights movement.

June 10
Congress passes the Equal Pay Act, making it illegal for employers to pay a woman less than what a man would receive for the same job.

1964
Title VII of the Civil Rights Act bars discrimination in employment on the basis of race and sex. At the same time it establishes the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) to investigate complaints and impose penalties.



Read more: Women's Rights Movement in the U.S.: Timeline of Events (1921-1979) | Infoplease.com http://www.infoplease.com/spot/womensti ... z3BFfEO2Tg


Just so we all understand exactly the impact they made on society.

 

[SexySteph]

@Kudos: Those are all good things. I'm not sure which side you're on now.

 

[KudosKids]

The baby boomers was the largest generation and it went from 1946-1964. This is what they fought for.

Share on printShare on emailShare on twitterShare on facebook|More Sharing ServicesShare

Women's Rights Movement in the U.S.
Timeline of Key Events in the American Women's Rights Movement
1921–1979
by Ann-Marie Imbornoni

Discover the key events of the women's rights movement in the United States. This timeline covers the years of 1921 to 1979, which includes the formation of the Planned Parenthood Federation of America and the first lesbian organization in the U.S., plus the FDA approval of birth control pills and the establishment of legal abortion.



1955
The Daughters of Bilitis (DOB), the first lesbian organization in the United States, is founded. Although DOB originated as a social group, it later developed into a political organization to win basic acceptance for lesbians in the United States.

Top
1960
The Food and Drug Administration approves birth control pills.

1961
President John Kennedy establishes the President's Commission on the Status of Women and appoints Eleanor Roosevelt as chairwoman. The report issued by the Commission in 1963 documents substantial discrimination against women in the workplace and makes specific recommendations for improvement, including fair hiring practices, paid maternity leave, and affordable child care.

1963
Betty Friedan publishes her highly influential book The Feminine Mystique, which describes the dissatisfaction felt by middle-class American housewives with the narrow role imposed on them by society. The book becomes a best-seller and galvanizes the modern women's rights movement.

June 10
Congress passes the Equal Pay Act, making it illegal for employers to pay a woman less than what a man would receive for the same job.

1964
Title VII of the Civil Rights Act bars discrimination in employment on the basis of race and sex. At the same time it establishes the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) to investigate complaints and impose penalties.



Read more: Women's Rights Movement in the U.S.: Timeline of Events (1921-1979) | Infoplease.com http://www.infoplease.com/spot/womensti ... z3BFfEO2Tg


Just so we all understand exactly the impact they made on society.

Woops! there is supposed to be more then this. Gah! I need to stop trusting copy&paste lol. But the link is there and you can see what the womens suffrage movement fought for from the beginning it started til now.

 

[GweenBlack]

What you don't understand is that feminism changes with society. Today's feminism is different then it was, so is everything else from last century or even last week. Things changes, fights change, but you seem to be stuck in the past with your "but this is not real feminism".

Marriage changed, nowadays less and less people want to get involved in a marital relationship. Is this bad or good? No! It is just different.

We have families with single parents, married, divorced, friends and same sex.

Things change. Stop justifying 2014 issues with 1960's stuff.

 

[KudosKids]

@Kudos: Those are all good things. I'm not sure which side you're on now.

I'm not on anyones side. I have said that before, and I will say it again. You know that quote "don't judge someone before you walk in there shoes" I live by that. I see both sides very clearly. And I agree with both sides on some aspects. I also disagree with both sides on some aspects. I try to make my opinions fair to everyone. I do not like to pick sides.

 

[Alexandra Cole]

It seems like families were more put together then they are today.

This seems like nostalgia for a past that never was.

Up until 60-70 years ago, the marriage rate and the percentage of the population that was married was much higher, the divorce rate was much lower, and the percentage of children born out of wedlock and raised by single parents was drastically lower than it is today.

That's what he was obviously referring to.

Is marriage the single defining trait here? Because in both the industrial and pre-industrial eras, marriage and family served an economic function, not an emotional one. Marriage was used to regulate inheritance, resources, and power, manage and extend landholding, and generate tiny workers with tiny hands until the federal government took steps to restrict child labor (1936). Contemporary notions of parenting didn't develop until second half of the 20th century, which also happens to coincide with the push for civil rights.

So, sure, more people were married, largely by force, necessity, or obligation. They also had the tendency to die a lot, particularly during childbirth. Shorter life expectancy --> shorter marriages --> reduced demand for divorce. Stigma and access also reduced the divorce rates, so with death, stigma, and access keeping the divorce rates down, and force, necessity, and obligation keeping marriage rates up, I wouldn't use either as an index of happiness in the idyllic past.

The decline in marriage and nuclear family systems has been complemented with a rise in extended and alternative family systems, and this reflects something else that's characteristic of the post-Women's Lib apocalypse: choice. The choice to marry, or not, the choice to have children, or not, and the choice of family systems, whether it's nuclear, alternative, or extended. Divorce, too, is a reflection of choice (and not a reflection of failure). Personally, I'd rather have the freedom to live my life as I choose than live in a world of very low divorce rates and very high marriage rates. And based on the sheer number of treatises that were published over the course of those decades, and centuries, they did too.

 

[KudosKids]

It seems like families were more put together then they are today.

This seems like nostalgia for a past that never was.

Up until 60-70 years ago, the marriage rate and the percentage of the population that was married was much higher, the divorce rate was much lower, and the percentage of children born out of wedlock and raised by single parents was drastically lower than it is today.

That's what he was obviously referring to.

Is marriage the single defining trait here? Because in both the industrial and pre-industrial eras, marriage and family served an economic function, not an emotional one. Marriage was used to regulate inheritance, resources, and power, manage and extend landholding, and generate tiny workers with tiny hands until the federal government took steps to restrict child labor (1936). Contemporary notions of parenting didn't develop until second half of the 20th century, which also happens to coincide with the push for civil rights.

So, sure, more people were married, largely by force, necessity, or obligation. They also had the tendency to die a lot, particularly during childbirth. Shorter life expectancy --> shorter marriages --> reduced demand for divorce. Stigma and access also reduced the divorce rates, so with death, stigma, and access keeping the divorce rates down, and force, necessity, and obligation keeping marriage rates up, I wouldn't use either as an index of happiness in the idyllic past.

The decline in marriage and nuclear family systems has been complemented with a rise in extended and alternative family systems, and this reflects something else that's characteristic of the post-Women's Lib apocalypse: choice. The choice to marry, or not, the choice to have children, or not, and the choice of family systems, whether it's nuclear, alternative, or extended. Divorce, too, is a reflection of choice (and not a reflection of failure). Personally, I'd rather have the freedom to live my life as I choose than live in a world of very low divorce rates and very high marriage rates. And based on the sheer number of treatises that were published over the course of those decades, and centuries, they did too.

I can't say anything to this one, but your right. The reasons why marriage even existed was because of reasons listed above. Once upon a time actually people bought there wives. But in today society, marriage is a religious thing.
Dearly Beloved, we are gathered together here in the presence of God and this company to join (Groom ___________ and (Bride) ___________ in the holy bonds of matrimony. Marriage is an institution ordained of God when man's estate was that of innocence and supreme happiness. God prepared a perfect home for Adam and placed him in the midst of a beautiful garden rich in earth's choicest fruits. He gave him blessed employment, free from anxiety and toil, in caring for the garden. At first man was alone, having no human associate and helper. Birds and beasts and all the living creatures of earth could not bring him satisfaction. God is pictured as noting man's incompleteness and lack of perfect happiness apart from woman. Now follows the beautiful story of the forming of woman from the side of man. Let us not forget the great lessons God would teach by this story. Let us look at the proper relation between husband and wife, "that she was not made out of his head to rule over him; nor out of his feet to be trampled on by him; but out of his side to be equal with him; under his arm to be protected; and near his heart to be beloved." When God made woman He made her to be man's helper and companion. "I will make for him a help, as his counter-part," said God. What nobler mission could woman desire than this? God's thought about marriage is the union of one man and one woman in perpetual wedlock. We would naturally infer from our Savior's presence and the part He played at the marriage feast in Cana of Galilee, that he considered the act of matrimony well worth His own recognition; but when He selected the tie that binds husband an wife as a fit emblem of His relationship to His own ransomed church He broadened and deepened its significance until there is no tie on earth so binding and none so sacred, as that which binds men and women in the holy bonds of matrimony. Such a relationship then, should not be entered into thoughtlessly, insincerely or indiscreetly, but advisedly, thoughtfully, and in fear of God.


Those words right there are exactly why I don't believe in divorce. If you are not able to take those words seriously, then do not get married. Even today people get married for entirely the wrong reasons. Taxes, money, insurance, green cards. People abuse marriage to much. Marriage is still used as a business agreement today. The only difference now is you can get divorced and it not be shunned upon if you don't like the arrangement anymore.

 

[Nordling]

Keep in mind that those vows are not in any way universal. Not everyone uses the same vows when they get married.

Also, I get the feeling you think marriage is ONLY a religious rite. In the US, though many, if not most people have a religious ceremony, it is not required and marriage is actually a contract, controlled and regulated by the various states.

Atheists, agnostics, Buddhists and jains get married for entirely different personal reasons than Christians, Muslims and Jews, e.g.

 

[VallieBeuys]

I can't say anything to this one, but your right. The reasons why marriage even existed was because of reasons listed above. Once upon a time actually people bought there wives. But in today society, marriage is a religious thing.
Dearly Beloved, we are gathered together here in the presence of God and this company to join (Groom ___________ and (Bride) ___________ in the holy bonds of matrimony. Marriage is an institution ordained of God when man's estate was that of innocence and supreme happiness. God prepared a perfect home for Adam and placed him in the midst of a beautiful garden rich in earth's choicest fruits. He gave him blessed employment, free from anxiety and toil, in caring for the garden. At first man was alone, having no human associate and helper. Birds and beasts and all the living creatures of earth could not bring him satisfaction. God is pictured as noting man's incompleteness and lack of perfect happiness apart from woman. Now follows the beautiful story of the forming of woman from the side of man. Let us not forget the great lessons God would teach by this story. Let us look at the proper relation between husband and wife, "that she was not made out of his head to rule over him; nor out of his feet to be trampled on by him; but out of his side to be equal with him; under his arm to be protected; and near his heart to be beloved." When God made woman He made her to be man's helper and companion. "I will make for him a help, as his counter-part," said God. What nobler mission could woman desire than this? God's thought about marriage is the union of one man and one woman in perpetual wedlock. We would naturally infer from our Savior's presence and the part He played at the marriage feast in Cana of Galilee, that he considered the act of matrimony well worth His own recognition; but when He selected the tie that binds husband an wife as a fit emblem of His relationship to His own ransomed church He broadened and deepened its significance until there is no tie on earth so binding and none so sacred, as that which binds men and women in the holy bonds of matrimony. Such a relationship then, should not be entered into thoughtlessly, insincerely or indiscreetly, but advisedly, thoughtfully, and in fear of God.


Those words right there are exactly why I don't believe in divorce. If you are not able to take those words seriously, then do not get married. Even today people get married for entirely the wrong reasons. Taxes, money, insurance, green cards. People abuse marriage to much. Marriage is still used as a business agreement today. The only difference now is you can get divorced and it not be shunned upon if you don't like the arrangement anymore.

I disagree that marriage is religious. It's still a contract between two people. Some choose to add religion on top of the contract, but what you're sining in a marriage license is between you, your spouse, and the government. Hubby and I got married for what you would probably consider the wrong reasons (taxes, health care) and we're very glad we did. We are not religious, though my husband is Jewish and does believe in a force greater than us. There was absolutely no mention of god, or any higher power (beyond the government, at least) in our "vows". It was literally a contract signing where both parties had to agree to the terms of the contract at the courthouse. I'm not trying to argue, just saying that while god may be an important part of marriage to you, there are plenty of people who get married because it's the smart thing to do financially, or because they love each other but don't have any religious affiliations. Religion doesn't necessarily ever enter into the equation. Sure, I love my partner and would never have considered signing such an important contractual agreement with someone I didn't care deeply for. If we ever get divorced it will be because one or both of us no longer agree to the terms of the contract. I don't see that as shameful or sad. It seems pretty mature to me.

Also super duper glad that my parents got divorced when I was a kid. They had been married for over 20 years when they split. While my life after that wasn't perfect there was a huge improvement in the overall sanity, comfort, and understanding in the family once my dad was out of the picture.

 

[KudosKids]

Keep in mind that those vows are not in any way universal. Not everyone uses the same vows when they get married.

Also, I get the feeling you think marriage is ONLY a religious rite. In the US, though many, if not most people have a religious ceremony, it is not required and marriage is actually a contract, controlled and regulated by the various states.

Atheists, agnostics, Buddhists and jains get married for entirely different personal reasons than Christians, Muslims and Jews, e.g.

rr
I understand that. Marriage today is for religious purposes. Here in the US it is mainly a christian thing. When you walk into a courthouse and get married that is the vows they say. That is what the government and churches construed marriage to be like today. Christian views are very strong in this country versus other religions. I am well aware that there are marriages out there that do not say these things when they have the ceremony. But it is the majority. I am saying if you do not believe in those vows, then don't say them, don't take back your promise because you feel you want to be a drunk dick now or cheat, or just don't feel like being married anymore just because.

 

[KudosKids]

I can't say anything to this one, but your right. The reasons why marriage even existed was because of reasons listed above. Once upon a time actually people bought there wives. But in today society, marriage is a religious thing.
Dearly Beloved, we are gathered together here in the presence of God and this company to join (Groom ___________ and (Bride) ___________ in the holy bonds of matrimony. Marriage is an institution ordained of God when man's estate was that of innocence and supreme happiness. God prepared a perfect home for Adam and placed him in the midst of a beautiful garden rich in earth's choicest fruits. He gave him blessed employment, free from anxiety and toil, in caring for the garden. At first man was alone, having no human associate and helper. Birds and beasts and all the living creatures of earth could not bring him satisfaction. God is pictured as noting man's incompleteness and lack of perfect happiness apart from woman. Now follows the beautiful story of the forming of woman from the side of man. Let us not forget the great lessons God would teach by this story. Let us look at the proper relation between husband and wife, "that she was not made out of his head to rule over him; nor out of his feet to be trampled on by him; but out of his side to be equal with him; under his arm to be protected; and near his heart to be beloved." When God made woman He made her to be man's helper and companion. "I will make for him a help, as his counter-part," said God. What nobler mission could woman desire than this? God's thought about marriage is the union of one man and one woman in perpetual wedlock. We would naturally infer from our Savior's presence and the part He played at the marriage feast in Cana of Galilee, that he considered the act of matrimony well worth His own recognition; but when He selected the tie that binds husband an wife as a fit emblem of His relationship to His own ransomed church He broadened and deepened its significance until there is no tie on earth so binding and none so sacred, as that which binds men and women in the holy bonds of matrimony. Such a relationship then, should not be entered into thoughtlessly, insincerely or indiscreetly, but advisedly, thoughtfully, and in fear of God.


Those words right there are exactly why I don't believe in divorce. If you are not able to take those words seriously, then do not get married. Even today people get married for entirely the wrong reasons. Taxes, money, insurance, green cards. People abuse marriage to much. Marriage is still used as a business agreement today. The only difference now is you can get divorced and it not be shunned upon if you don't like the arrangement anymore.

I disagree that marriage is religious. It's still a contract between two people. Some choose to add religion on top of the contract, but what you're sining in a marriage license is between you, your spouse, and the government. Hubby and I got married for what you would probably consider the wrong reasons (taxes, health care) and we're very glad we did. We are not religious, though my husband is Jewish and does believe in a force greater than us. There was absolutely no mention of god, or any higher power (beyond the government, at least) in our "vows". It was literally a contract signing where both parties had to agree to the terms of the contract at the courthouse. I'm not trying to argue, just saying that while god may be an important part of marriage to you, there are plenty of people who get married because it's the smart thing to do financially, or because they love each other but don't have any religious affiliations. Religion doesn't necessarily ever enter into the equation. Sure, I love my partner and would never have considered signing such an important contractual agreement with someone I didn't care deeply for. If we ever get divorced it will be because one or both of us no longer agree to the terms of the contract. I don't see that as shameful or sad. It seems pretty mature to me.

Also super duper glad that my parents got divorced when I was a kid. They had been married for over 20 years when they split. While my life after that wasn't perfect there was a huge improvement in the overall sanity, comfort, and understanding in the family once my dad was out of the picture.

I take back my statement below. I have seen courthouse marriages and they had said those vows. But maybe that was arranged to happen that way. You have opened my eyes. Thank you for giving me the ability to correct myself.

 

[Leon_Omega]

It's all related. It's the big picture context for the specific things being discussed in this thread.

So can we skip the part where you blame every bad thing to happen on the generation that came directly before us and start on the road to actually solving some issues?

I mean, I get that finger-pointing is very cathartic (I really like how you manage to say that "they will never take responsibility for their own actions" in the same breath which you use to say that none of the problems our society has are the fault of the current generation, by the way), but you've made that point, it's time to move on to other points, preferably ones with a bit more substance.

 

[SexySteph]

When you walk into a courthouse and get married that is the vows they say.

... no its not.

You can request a religious script but the standard is no mention of god or religion and ends with "I, (officiant's name), by the power vested in me by the Marriage Act, pronounce (groom's name) and (bride's name) to be married." (And sometimes not even that).

You're pushing your ideals on other people.

(Also, even back in the days of Jesus, marriages were not love marriages. Ceremony's might have been 'religious' because it was believed that god wanted these two people, one who was purchased, to be joined forever, but it's not the romantic ideal that you're wanting to believe. It was more like "God gave you this chicken, you have promised him to keep this chicken. You are to protect this chicken and this chicken is not allowed to leave you because you paid for it and that would be theft and god doesn't like that.")

 

[KudosKids]

When you walk into a courthouse and get married that is the vows they say.

... no its not.

You can request a religious script but the standard is no mention of god or religion and ends with "I, (officiant's name), by the power vested in me by the Marriage Act, pronounce (groom's name) and (bride's name) to be married." (And sometimes not even that).

You're pushing your ideals on other people.

(Also, even back in the days of Jesus, marriages were not love marriages. Ceremony's might have been 'religious' because it was believed that god wanted these two people, one who was purchased, to be joined forever, but it's not the romantic ideal that you're wanting to believe. It was more like "God gave you this chicken, you have promised him to keep this chicken. You are to protect this chicken and this chicken is not allowed to leave you because you paid for it and that would be theft and god doesn't like that.")

Like I said I was not aware of this. You could try reading a little more carefully before you put out a opinion that was already said. I am not pushing my values on anyone. I was just misinformed clearly. I have read the bible, I am well aware. That is why I also said, back in the day people even bought there wives.

 

[Joeternal]

The baby boomers was the largest generation and it went from 1946-1964. This is what they fought for.

Your list ends in 1964, when the oldest baby boomer was 18 according to your own dates. So regardless of whether or not you think all of the things on that list are good, none of them were done by baby boomers. They were in elementary school, junior high and high school, and many of them weren't even born yet. It was't until the late 60s, when the boomers hit college, that the "Boomer Era" began.

Your posts are not entirely coherent.

 

[Joeternal]

It's all related. It's the big picture context for the specific things being discussed in this thread.

So can we skip the part where you blame every bad thing to happen on the generation that came directly before us and start on the road to actually solving some issues?

I mean, I get that finger-pointing is very cathartic (I really like how you manage to say that "they will never take responsibility for their own actions" in the same breath which you use to say that none of the problems our society has are the fault of the current generation, by the way), but you've made that point, it's time to move on to other points, preferably ones with a bit more substance.

I raised the point because I think ultimately that's where most of the problems we now face as a society come from. We're to blame to the degree that we've bought into their BS. #WomenAgainstFeminism is something of a revolt against one part of it.

I will agree that this is going far off topic, and this forum is not the best place to take this stuff much farther. I was just curious to see how cam girls view some of these issues around feminism.

 

[KudosKids]

The baby boomers was the largest generation and it went from 1946-1964. This is what they fought for.

Your list ends in 1964, when the oldest baby boomer was 18 according to your own dates. So regardless of whether or not you think all of the things on that list are good, none of them were done by baby boomers. They were in elementary school, junior high and high school, and many of them weren't even born yet. It was't until the late 60s, when the boomers hit college, that the "Boomer Era" began.

Your posts are not entirely coherent.

Does anyone here actually read every post?

 

[SexySteph]

#WomenAgainstFeminism is something of a revolt against one part of it.

No it isn't. It's mostly mysogynistic red pill silliness. I don't see anyone using that hashtag claiming they're against it because divorce rates or the economy. They're against it because "a woman should know her place" "too many false rape accusations".

Now, if you can find me proof that that hashtag supports your weird baby boomer claims I'll believe you. But I'm really not buying it.

 

[Leon_Omega]

The baby boomers was the largest generation and it went from 1946-1964. This is what they fought for.

Your list ends in 1964, when the oldest baby boomer was 18 according to your own dates. So regardless of whether or not you think all of the things on that list are good, none of them were done by baby boomers. They were in elementary school, junior high and high school, and many of them weren't even born yet. It was't until the late 60s, when the boomers hit college, that the "Boomer Era" began.

Your posts are not entirely coherent.

Does anyone here actually read every post?

I read every post before I enter a discussion, if anything it's to prevent my bringing something useless to the playing field.

 

[KudosKids]

It's all related. It's the big picture context for the specific things being discussed in this thread.

So can we skip the part where you blame every bad thing to happen on the generation that came directly before us and start on the road to actually solving some issues?

I mean, I get that finger-pointing is very cathartic (I really like how you manage to say that "they will never take responsibility for their own actions" in the same breath which you use to say that none of the problems our society has are the fault of the current generation, by the way), but you've made that point, it's time to move on to other points, preferably ones with a bit more substance.

I raised the point because I think ultimately that's where most of the problems we now face as a society come from. We're to blame to the degree that we've bought into their BS.

And I did agree with you. But I was pointing out that the baby boomers were not pointless, they did fight for many rights that people do deserve. If you keep reading on that website, you can see that. Its not all "bullshit". A lot of the outcomes are bullshit. I think the problem with our generation now, is people have way to many options. And many job markets are now far over saturated. You have alot of kids in there 20's not sure what they want to do with there life and not looking forward to college or a career. I mean when you have 500 options, and your expected to pick one, thats really difficult. When college costs are through the roof, no one gets excited about "Oh yay! I get to do my time and then pay this loan off for the next 15 years of my career" But this is really off topic. Maybe you should make a thread on baby boomers, so we do not keep getting side tracked on this thread.

 

[Joeternal]

#WomenAgainstFeminism is something of a revolt against one part of it.

No it isn't. It's mostly mysogynistic red pill silliness. I don't see anyone using that hashtag claiming they're against it because divorce rates or the economy. They're against it because "a woman should know her place" "too many false rape accusations".

Now, if you can find me proof that that hashtag supports your weird baby boomer claims I'll believe you. But I'm really not buying it.

Can you point me to the post on that Tumblr that says, " a woman should know her place"? I must have missed it.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

#WomenAgainstFeminism is something of a revolt against one part of it.

No it isn't. It's mostly mysogynistic red pill silliness. I don't see anyone using that hashtag claiming they're against it because divorce rates or the economy. They're against it because "a woman should know her place" "too many false rape accusations".

Wait, what? What is misogynistic or silly about #WAF? Haven't really been following it.

 

[SexySteph]

#WomenAgainstFeminism is something of a revolt against one part of it.

No it isn't. It's mostly mysogynistic red pill silliness. I don't see anyone using that hashtag claiming they're against it because divorce rates or the economy. They're against it because "a woman should know her place" "too many false rape accusations".

Wait, what? What is misogynistic or silly about #WAF? Haven't really been following it.

I posted some earlier in this thread. This was a pretty popular hashtag so when I searched again it was mostly people arguing against the hashtag and I've scrolled through over a thousand and I'm only now on the 15th. So... Yeah, I gave up. But they were there when the hashtag first started.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

#WomenAgainstFeminism is something of a revolt against one part of it.

No it isn't. It's mostly mysogynistic red pill silliness. I don't see anyone using that hashtag claiming they're against it because divorce rates or the economy. They're against it because "a woman should know her place" "too many false rape accusations".

Wait, what? What is misogynistic or silly about #WAF? Haven't really been following it.

I posted some earlier in this thread. This was a pretty popular hashtag so when I searched again it was mostly people arguing against the hashtag and I've scrolled through over a thousand and I'm only now on the 15th. So... Yeah, I gave up. But they were there when the hashtag first started.

Oh, so it isn't that silly or misogynistic then. I thought it was mostly strong, empowered, smart women so when I saw you trying to push your opinion as fact I was kinda confused. Just didn't see any misogyny or silliness.

 

[PlayboyMegan]

Keep in mind that those vows are not in any way universal. Not everyone uses the same vows when they get married.

Also, I get the feeling you think marriage is ONLY a religious rite. In the US, though many, if not most people have a religious ceremony, it is not required and marriage is actually a contract, controlled and regulated by the various states.

Atheists, agnostics, Buddhists and jains get married for entirely different personal reasons than Christians, Muslims and Jews, e.g.

I am saying if you do not believe in those vows, then don't say them, don't take back your promise because you feel you want to be a drunk dick now or cheat, or just don't feel like being married anymore just because.

I used to think like you. And to an extent, I still do. But after my divorce, my views on it have changed. I got married when I was 17. I was still a child. In some states you can legally marry at age 16, but a humans brain isn't fully developed until age 25. Just from age 17 to age 22, my perspective on the world has changed so drastically. I used to think, "if you make a commitment, you need to stick with it no matter what!" But when you're young, you can't fully comprehend the consequences of your actions. I got divorced because I met and fell in love with someone who was better fit for me. Many people probably consider that a petty reason. But I really don't care. If I had children, I probably would have stayed but thankfully I didn't. I do believe when you have children their best interests should come first. But when you don't, life is just too short to be unhappy. The divorce was initially hard on both of us. But now I am much happier and so is he! He found a girl who has children that are not biologically his, but he loves those children with every fiber of his being and can't imagine life without them. I now have the mental stimulation I was craving so much from my current boyfriend. We are both in much better places. And to be honest, I don't consider our marriage a mistake. I learned a lot from it and I have no regrets about the marriage or divorce. Again, you just need to see that everyone's circumstances are SO different.

 

[AlexLady]

Ok I think I can explain my side a bit better now. There are three main problems I have with Feminism and two little ones.


Please don't waste your time reading this if you think the only thing hearing my opinion will do is upset you. That's not my intent. If it would ruin your day to hear about some of the things I dislike about feminism, then I suggest scroll past it.



Primarily: I'm against feminism because it has no place in our government. It is no longer about rights, laws, or freedoms. If anything it's the opposite because it is often now trying to limit the freedoms we already have.

For example; someone earlier mentioned that Feminism has evolved beyond laws and is tackling social issues. I completely agree. One part of this is that it seems now it's more about how one person makes another feel. Such as feeling offended, unnecessary guilt due to ignorance or caring too much about a stranger's opinion, being uncomfortable all the time, ashamed, feeling threatened even though no one threatened you, etc.

While some of feminist's points such as educating people about their genitals are important; your feelings don't belong in the law. The law is equality for everyone; taking away people's rights (such as free speech,) just because you don't want to feel offended is selfish and un-American.

Again the feelings thing is just part of it. As the first sentence of this point said I just don't think it's about laws anymore and as such shouldn't be a government issue. Any points that are actually about laws/rights without taking away from other's rights should be fought for in court; things that are more social based do not. Because Feminism is about many, many issues of all types then it shouldn't be a government issue because many of the things Feminism wants accomplished doesn't hold up to liberty and true freedom for all.


Problem two: A lot of the things they say about how things "used to be" are false, only slightly accurate, or most often announced in a way to make history look like it benefited/hurt one gender without giving information on both sides.

That and they fail to keep in mind that the country is young and evolving as our need's change. That's normal.

An example of misleading information: "Women had to earn the right to vote!" Truth is...so did men; on and off the battlefield. Even after Independence Day 60% of men still couldn't vote. They had to fight a second time for that. If anything men fighting for the USA and the original beliefs of democracy/freedom is why we have voting to begin with.


Problem three: Equal pay. This seems to be a very big deal to Feminists. I think it's another misinformation tactic because they seem to always fail to put pregnancy into the equation. If a woman gets pregnant and can't work she's often given maternity leave. Even if she isn't given maternity leave and is forced to find a new job; the company she worked for could have paid for training or are invested in their workers in other ways. If a woman is unable to work while pregnant that is a loss for the business. As such I would understand if females were paid slightly less (even though I myself am not having kids.)

I believe the wage gap decreases dramatically when a woman doesn't take time off for pregnancy or we add in child support (which isn't reported as income.)
Like it or not, women are far more likely to get pregnant than men.


The little problems:
I DO agree with equality as far as our constitution goes. Feminism's use of the word "equality" and implying anyone who "believes in true equality is a feminist" is offensive to me. It's rude to label someone or take my beliefs in our constitution and use them to try to rope me into your bandwagon. It's again, linguistics. Someone brought this up earlier on this point and I think they said it better. I also think that what Violet said about feminists wanting "justice" is a better suited word for when Feminists say "equality."


and my last issue: The buddy-buddy/peer pressure/groupie system that it is. You're all right, people who disagree are wrong (or are titled "feminists" by self-identifying feminists simply because of the word "equality" [another linguistic issue.]) I don't like it when people are in groups that stroke their egos; it's like a cool-group bragging system. Similar to how someone brags about only eating organic food around other people who also only eat organic food. I dislike these buddy-systems and people who conform with them just to fit in (no one on this forum I don't think, but other people particularly those who are young and haven't grown as a person yet.)



I present this information as and only as my opinions.
:twocents-02cents:



If you have any issues with my opinions, please don't take them outside of this topic. Someone is already sending me rude asks to my website for simply stating I'm against feminism earlier and I now ask you publicly to stop this.

I do honestly wish everyone the best and think you have the right to believe whatever you want--even if you are on the other side of this--and I hope you can do the same for me.

 

[Always_Tim]

Keep in mind that those vows are not in any way universal. Not everyone uses the same vows when they get married.

Also, I get the feeling you think marriage is ONLY a religious rite. In the US, though many, if not most people have a religious ceremony, it is not required and marriage is actually a contract, controlled and regulated by the various states.

Atheists, agnostics, Buddhists and jains get married for entirely different personal reasons than Christians, Muslims and Jews, e.g.

rr
I understand that. Marriage today is for religious purposes. Here in the US it is mainly a christian thing. When you walk into a courthouse and get married that is the vows they say. That is what the government and churches construed marriage to be like today. Christian views are very strong in this country versus other religions. I am well aware that there are marriages out there that do not say these things when they have the ceremony. But it is the majority. I am saying if you do not believe in those vows, then don't say them, don't take back your promise because you feel you want to be a drunk dick now or cheat, or just don't feel like being married anymore just because.

Wow. That's the single most misguided post I've seen on ACF in weeks.

 

[AlexLady]

And Kudos; I had specifically asked for my thoughts on this to stay within this thread and as such I won't be replying to your PM.

Just because I am against many ideals of feminism does not mean I am somehow on your side.

 

[AlexLady]

(too late to add but I don't really thing there are "sides" on this. It's too complex for that. Sure; yeah I'm against Feminism, but I'm not against any feminist. I just meant I wasn't on Kudos' side.)