Dead dogs and cats used in pet food...

[BlueViolet]

It's really disgusting what commercial cat and dog foods will allow into their products--including euthanized dogs and cats.

The FDA really doesn't regulate pet foods. They say that as long as the ingredients listed are considered safe such as "meat, poultry, and grains" then it does not need to be pre-market approved. Meat can mean anything.

WARNING: Very graphic video. It censors nothing and shows the process starting from the vet's clinic to the meat processing plant.



This doesn't mean that every label that says "meat meal" or "bone and meat meal" is necessarily of dead cats and dogs, but it doesn't mean that it is not.

Please read the labels on the back of the food you choose for your pets or animals. Even if buying good food costs a little bit more, it will save you a lot of money in the long run by avoiding many health problems in the future. Most commercial dog food is the equivalent of a corn husk with flavored gravy on it. Iams, Purina, Pedigree, Beneful, Eukanuba and Hill's Science Diet are all terrible quality food. The bulk of them are filled with corn product, various grains, by-products (beaks, feet, etc), even propylene glycol which is close to antifreeze. You really can't find any good food at grocery stores or Walmart and even most pet stores and vet clinics don't keep any good quality food stocked.

I buy my pet food at Tractor Supply or I order offline.

Good quality food to look out for: Acana, Innova, Hollistic Blend, Orijen, Wellness Core, and Canidae to list a few.

Check out http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/ to learn more about comparing brands and what to look for in good food.

TL;DR:

Read dog and cat food labels so you don't feed your pets dog and cat meat or corn and chicken beaks with meat flavoring.

 

[CallMeWilliam]

A must read for cat owners http://www.catinfo.org/

On a side note a friend of mine (an avid hunter as well) makes his own cat food from some of the unused organs/meat/bones from his killed animals (deer, moose, duck). He adds a small amount of processed cooked brown rice 1:10 ratio and freezes it in hockey puck size portions.

 

[LadyLuna]

Science Diet is what my parents used to feed our pets.

They switched to that "granny's cupboard" stuff, where the wet food is basically a stew, exactly like we would eat, sometime in my high school years.

 

[BlueViolet]

A must read for cat owners http://www.catinfo.org/

On a side note a friend of mine (an avid hunter as well) makes his own cat food from some of the unused organs/meat/bones from his killed animals (deer, moose, duck). He adds a small amount of processed cooked brown rice 1:10 ratio and freezes it in hockey puck size portions.

That reminds me of what I was also going to mention.

Commercial dog food kibble has really only been mainstream since the late 1950's. Before then, dogs were eating table scraps and whatever they were given and honestly, probably a lot better off health wise. I was looking into feeding raw food diets or at least homemade type foods but my dog has very specific diet requirements being a large/giant breed puppy so I'm keeping him on high-quality large breed puppy food until he is about 2 years. Most puppy formulas cause them to grow rapidly when he needs to grow slowly to support his weight (40 lbs at 16 weeks.)

Science Diet is what my parents used to feed our pets.

They switched to that "granny's cupboard" stuff, where the wet food is basically a stew, exactly like we would eat, sometime in my high school years.

Never heard of Granny's Cupboard, but it's good that your parents switched. It bothers me so much that so many vets will recommend Science Diet either from lack of education or product promotion in their clinic. Most people will say to trust everything your vets say, but only recently were vet schools required to take just one class in veterinarian nutrition and even then it basically brushed over. Which is so crazy to me considering the quality of nutrition anyone receives directly correlates with their health. Even guest speakers from the big brands (Pedigree, Iams, etc.) will come talk to those schools about why their product is great in order to form a bias for them to recommend.

----

Wanted to add how to identify good quality pet foods.

The first four ingredients in the back are what is the bulk of the bag. The second ingredient is the most crucial in most cases where "chicken" or "beef" is listed first because before these meats are cooked, about 70% - 80% of it is water and the water is cooked out of it. The first four ingredients should be some sort of named animal or animal meal but mostly not include corn or any kind of "filler". Named animal meal is good because it is pretty much the dehydrated meat which has a lot more protein and nutrients than regular animal since the water has already been cooked out prior.

This is good:

"Ingredients: Chicken, turkey, chicken meal, turkey meal..."
"Ingredients: Fresh boneless salmon, salmon meal, herring meal, fresh boneless herring, fresh boneless walleye, russet potato, sweet potato..." (Orijen Adult Formula)
"Ingredients: Turkey giblets (turkey livers and turkey hearts), turkey meal, turkey, chicken meal..." (Back To Basics Turkey Formula)

This is bad:
"Ingredients: Ground yellow corn, chicken by-product meal, corn gluten meal, whole wheat flour, animal fat..." (Beneful)
"Ingredients: Whole grain corn, chicken by-product meal, soybean meal, animal fat..." (Hill's Science Diet. Note: by-product meal is not good. This could mean ground beaks, feet, feathers, etc. even if it's mixed with heart or giblets.)
"Ingredients: Ground whole corn, chicken by-product meal (natural source of glucosamine) corn gluten meal, animal fat..." (Pedigree Large Breed)

Healthy dogs don't need many carbohydrates at all and keep a look out at the fat content and crude protein.

I will admit that I do not know nearly as much about cat nutrition as I do dogs, but I've read that be wary of any ingredients in cat food that say "carrots", "spinach" etc, as they hold no nutritional value for cats and are only listed to make you believe they look healthier.

 

[Rose]

I've been thinking about switching my babies to completely home cooked kibble and this is encouraging. My only dilemma is I'm not sure how much they need to eat to maintain a healthy weight, or in Sammy's case gain weight and keep growing. If I knew exactly how much they needed to eat to stay healthy, I'd switch them to home meals tonight.

 

[BlueViolet]

I've been thinking about switching my babies to completely home cooked kibble and this is encouraging. My only dilemma is I'm not sure how much they need to eat to maintain a healthy weight, or in Sammy's case gain weight and keep growing. If I knew exactly how much they needed to eat to stay healthy, I'd switch them to home meals tonight.

Yeah, that's my same problem with my Mishka. I just don't want to risk depriving him of something by accident. I'd just try to keep them on a healthy brand of food until they are both full grown and you can do enough research on what exactly they need to not cause some sort of vitamin deficiency or something.

Here's a really good video on determining good dog foods. I currently feed Diamond Natural's Large Breed Puppy Formula and was thinking of switching to something better that isn't a dry kibble, but finding specific large breed puppy food is really difficult. It's technically a four-star on Dog Adviser but none of the five star have a large breed puppy formula that I see. I really like Orijen, though.

 

[Rose]

Sammy has his good boy training class tomorrow and they sell a lot of organic pet food. I'll have to check and see if they have anything decent for a growing lab/pyrenees though. He's already over half Sadie's size and she's a pit. If all else fails, I can just feet them chicken and veggies until they stop eating, lol.

 

[SoTxBob]

40 lbs already? Sweet !
What kind is he? :-D
I foster rescued Great Pyrs and so have run the entire gamut of feeding 8 wk olds to Sr adults.
My adopted pair get a lamb and rice kibble normally BC "Girl dog" has a skin allergy and can't eat 'chicken crap' or corn. If it's in anything more than minuscule percentages she will break out in a skin fungus that's a pain to get rid of. If you have the freezer space and the time, making your own is by far the best route to insure quality for them. All it takes is a bit of research on how to concoct the mix for your breed size, age, nourishment requirements. I don't simply because it'd take a commercial kitchen to prepare 50-100 lbs a week, depending on who's living here at the time.
Also, I've found that the majority of feed stores carry a better grade of bagged kibbles than anywhere else does and its generally cheaper. You still need to read the labels tho.
And yes, the vets selling the Science Diet and Euk. brands is purely a marketing point. They take a nice cut of the inflated prices. The main attraction for the Purina and the rest of the heavily marketed "less healthy" is of course the price. ~50lb bags are generally less than $30 and you will generally pay $50/65 per 45/50lb bag of "the good stuff" and sometimes even more.

 

[BlueViolet]

40 lbs already? Sweet !
What kind is he? :-D
I foster rescued Great Pyrs and so have run the entire gamut of feeding 8 wk olds to Sr adults.
My adopted pair get a lamb and rice kibble normally BC "Girl dog" has a skin allergy and can't eat 'chicken crap' or corn. If it's in anything more than minuscule percentages she will break out in a skin fungus that's a pain to get rid of. If you have the freezer space and the time, making your own is by far the best route to insure quality for them. All it takes is a bit of research on how to concoct the mix for your breed size, age, nourishment requirements. I don't simply because it'd take a commercial kitchen to prepare 50-100 lbs a week, depending on who's living here at the time.
Also, I've found that the majority of feed stores carry a better grade of bagged kibbles than anywhere else does and its generally cheaper. You still need to read the labels tho.
And yes, the vets selling the Science Diet and Euk. brands is purely a marketing point. They take a nice cut of the inflated prices. The main attraction for the Purina and the rest of the heavily marketed "less healthy" is of course the price. ~50lb bags are generally less than $30 and you will generally pay $50/65 per 45/50lb bag of "the good stuff" and sometimes even more.

Yay, Pyrs! : )

I've been in love with the breed since I first saw them when I was like twelve, but he's my first Pyr, though. I think the breeders said he was about 18 - 20 lbs about a week before we came to pick him up at 8 weeks.

I really only go out to the Tractor Supply Store to get food. There's too much crap at pet stores, but even Tractor carries a lot of bad stuff but at least they have Taste of the Wild, Diamond Naturals, and Blue Buffalo as well as a few other brands. A 40 lb of Diamond Naturals is about $40, which is not bad considering the quality. I wanted to try Orijen but like I said, no large breed puppy formula.

I am definitely going to start looking into making my own food for him.

I'm actually switching vets because the first vet I took Mishka doesn't carry any healthy food in the lobby. It's kind of the concept to me regardless of whether the vets push the food on you or not (which, that particular clinic gave us plenty of coupons for specific brands). I know it's mostly the dog food companies just giving the vets money to rent out space in their lobby or to market it to people, but it's kind of like if I went to the doctor's office and there was a McDonalds in the lobby. Whether or not the doctor recommends me eat there, the fact is that I'm already in the office and it's convenient to just pick some up to take home.

I also took some new pictures of Mishka last night, so this is the most recent of him. I was trying to get him to pose with the wine bottle but he decided that he'd prefer to just chew on the top of it.

 

[LacieLaPlante]

Ezio gets Taste of the Wild

It's kinda pricy but it's the only food he's actually enjoyed and won't put off eating until 10PM at night.

Also, it's made well.

Bah, how could I not give this face what he wants?

 

[JickyJuly]

My dog has uti issues. Recently, her vet instructed me to feed her only Royal Canin Urinary SO. I didn't read the pricey bag. I just let her pile what was necessary onto the counter. Upon further inspection, I'm pretty bummed. One of the 1st ingredients was corn. :? I'm kind of confused as to why a primarily corn food would be so expensive and why my vet (who seems very animal smart and caring) would suggest it. I'd like to switch to something else, but I don't want to cause any kidney stones or crystals.

Also, not to scare anyone, but I'm pretty sure factory farmed animals are also fed all sorts of disgusting stuff which in turn passes to human consumers. :whistle:

 

[BlueViolet]

My dog has uti issues. Recently, her vet instructed me to feed her only Royal Canin Urinary SO. I didn't read the pricey bag. I just let her pile what was necessary onto the counter. Upon further inspection, I'm pretty bummed. One of the 1st ingredients was corn. :? I'm kind of confused as to why a primarily corn food would be so expensive and why my vet (who seems very animal smart and caring) would suggest it. I'd like to switch to something else, but I don't want to cause any kidney stones or crystals.

Also, not to scare anyone, but I'm pretty sure factory farmed animals are also fed all sorts of disgusting stuff which in turn passes to human consumers. :whistle:

Vets aren't really trained in animal nutrition. Most vets aren't required to even have one class on veterinary nutrition, though now most schools require one class and that's it. It's really upsetting considering how much the quality of food you receive directly correlates to your animal's health. Some people say that vets suggest poor quality food in order to make you visit them more often with health problems, but I sincerely doubt they are doing it on purpose. I think they just don't know any better. It doesn't make it any better to me, though, considering these people are paid and trained to make sure my animals stay healthy and then they suggest food that is bad and sometimes toxic to them.

Dogs don't need corn in their food. They really can't digest it and a lot of dogs are allergic to it. : / But most vets just believe what they hear when it comes to those sorts of diets for urinary health. I'll look into it as well, but I know for cats, you can sprinkle vitamin c to their food to help with urinary problems. I'm sure there is a natural thing you can add to a good quality dog food so you don't have to sacrifice quality but still get the urinary health benefits.

On that note, Dr. Karen Becker mentioned that dry kibble can cause future urinary and intestinal problems since there isn't enough moisture in the food to regulate their organs. Maybe by putting your dog on a better quality food in general and mixing it with a good quality wet food and seeing if you can find any kind of urinary health additives in like a sprinkle powder form to mix into the food might be better. I know they make huge tins of medicine powder to mix in with their food each day so they probably have something for urinary health.

Something like this:

http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/products/ ... 99157.aspx

 

[BlueViolet]

Double post!

Ohmygosh. :angry4:

Seriously. I don't know if it's the same exact brand as you, Jicky, but I am looking online at Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Urinary SO Dry Dog Food and the biggest bag they sell is a 25.3 lb bag--for $72! That is insane considering it's made primarily of rice and corn! I really want to know exactly -how- that can be healthy for a dog? It makes me so mad to know they are taking advantage of people and risking the health of their pets when their owners are willing to pay that much to keep them healthy!

Brewers rice, corn, chicken fat, chicken meal, natural flavors, dried egg product, corn gluten meal, salt, powdered cellulose, potassium chloride, fish oil, calcium carbonate, potassium phosphate, calcium sulfate, taurine, choline chloride, vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol acetate (source of vitamin E), biotin, D-calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin A acetate, niacin supplement, thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), riboflavin supplement (vitamin B2), folic acid, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement], marigold extract (Tagetes erecta L.), trace minerals [zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, zinc proteinate, manganese proteinate, copper sulfate, manganous oxide, copper proteinate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite], rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols and citric acid.

And Amazon has it listed for $88.99 for a 6.6 lb bag! The fuck? :-x

http://www.amazon.com/Royal-Canin-Veter ... y+Dog+Food

 

[Anonymous]

I don't think this one has been mentioned yet, but it's definitely worth a mention:
4health.

It I remember correctly, it's made by Diamond and it uses no corn/wheat/soy.

Not too pricey, yet it's a great food.
Available at Tractor Supply.

 

[AshleyMarks]

I've been feeding my dog Pedigree and after watching the video and looking at the ingredients used, I have found that the preservatives BHT and BHA can cause aggressiveness in dogs. Funny thing is that my dog has exerted aggressive qualities several times while on this dog food. Not only can it cause aggressive behavior, but it can also cause liver failure, kidney failure and learning problems not only in animals, but also in humans. I want to help my dog, but i do not have the means available. I am researching a preservative-free, non-offending dog food and I am going to need time to figure all of this out. Thank you so much Dakota. You may have just kept my dog from dying early, being sent to the pound and not living a very happy life. This really opened my eyes.

 

[Just Me]

You know dogs (cats too sometimes) will eat their own and other animals shit and don't seem to have problems? Just saying.... :lol:

 

[JickyJuly]

Double post!

Ohmygosh. :angry4:

Seriously. I don't know if it's the same exact brand as you, Jicky, but I am looking online at Royal Canin Veterinary Diet Urinary SO Dry Dog Food and the biggest bag they sell is a 25.3 lb bag--for $72! That is insane considering it's made primarily of rice and corn! I really want to know exactly -how- that can be healthy for a dog? It makes me so mad to know they are taking advantage of people and risking the health of their pets when their owners are willing to pay that much to keep them healthy!

Brewers rice, corn, chicken fat, chicken meal, natural flavors, dried egg product, corn gluten meal, salt, powdered cellulose, potassium chloride, fish oil, calcium carbonate, potassium phosphate, calcium sulfate, taurine, choline chloride, vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol acetate (source of vitamin E), biotin, D-calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin A acetate, niacin supplement, thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), riboflavin supplement (vitamin B2), folic acid, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement], marigold extract (Tagetes erecta L.), trace minerals [zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, zinc proteinate, manganese proteinate, copper sulfate, manganous oxide, copper proteinate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite], rosemary extract, preserved with natural mixed tocopherols and citric acid.

And Amazon has it listed for $88.99 for a 6.6 lb bag! The fuck? :-x

http://www.amazon.com/Royal-Canin-Veter ... y+Dog+Food

I grabbed the bag to double check. Yep. That's the one. I paid about half that for the 6# bag, but still. It doesn't look to be any better than the cheap stuff she was on. Also, it looks like it has a lot of mineral type stuff which I read can cause more struvite crystals. This thread inspired me to do more investigating. On the doggy uti forums, it looks like a lot of people have been successful using non-byproduct food, adding a cranberry powder specifically made for dogs and giving distilled water instead of tap water. I guess that will be my new plan. Feeling kind of dopey for not reading the food and asking questions about it at the vet.

 

[Rose]

I just got Sammy Wellness kibble! I know all the ingredients on the list. :dance: The first ingredient is deboned chicken, the second is beef. Yay! It's not terribly expensive and he only needs two cups a day of it if he has snacks. Petco carries it and if you have a pals card it's cheaper than the listed price. Once Sadie finishes her current bag of food we'll be switching her to the adult Wellness kibble. Here's a link to the brand's website: http://www.wellnesspetfood.com/dog-wellness.aspx

My Petco actually has one of Wellness's totally organic lines (only has like 5 ingredients or something like that) too, but it's hella expensive and I don't see it listed on their site.

 

[SweepTheLeg]

Soylent Green puppy chow. Picturing a golden retriever looking just enough like Charlton Heston to barge in and barking "Rogs! rit's rade rout rof Rogs!" Hold on, let me give Pixar a call. I want to make this happen.

 

[BlueViolet]

Yay : ) This thread is making me happy

I've been feeding my dog Pedigree and after watching the video and looking at the ingredients used, I have found that the preservatives BHT and BHA can cause aggressiveness in dogs. Funny thing is that my dog has exerted aggressive qualities several times while on this dog food. Not only can it cause aggressive behavior, but it can also cause liver failure, kidney failure and learning problems not only in animals, but also in humans. I want to help my dog, but i do not have the means available. I am researching a preservative-free, non-offending dog food and I am going to need time to figure all of this out. Thank you so much Dakota. You may have just kept my dog from dying early, being sent to the pound and not living a very happy life. This really opened my eyes.

Aw, I'm really glad that I could be of help. : ) I'm pretty passionate about (exposing) the dog food industry just because it's so deceitful and harmful.

Trying to find some better quality foods that aren't too expensive. I found about 2 that look decent for the price.

4Health is about $30 for a 35 lb bag.
http://www.tractorsupply.com/4health-trade-chicken-rice-formula-for-adult-dogs-35-lb-bag-6009468

Ingredients:
Chicken, chicken meal, cracked pearled barley, millet, brewers rice, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), dried plain beet pulp, natural chicken flavor, flaxseed, fish meal, potassium chloride, salt, choline chloride, dried chicory root, glucosamine hydrochloride, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, yucca schidigera extract, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, chondroitin sulfate, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.

Diamond® Naturals™ Chicken & Rice Formula for Adult Dogs. $29 for a 40 lb bag. (No corn, wheat or soy.)
http://www.tractorsupply.com/diamon...rice-formula-for-adult-dogs-40-lb-bag-5054575

Ingredients:
Chicken, chicken meal, whole grain brown rice, white rice, cracked pearled barley, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), oatmeal, dried plain beet pulp, egg product, flaxseed, natural chicken flavor, fish meal, salt, potassium chloride, choline chloride, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.


Considering chicken and chicken meal are the top two ingredients, it does make it better than anything that has chicken, then corn. The bulk of those two foods consist of chicken meal which is good. Like you said, the food you feed now can cause all of those problems you listed, so by paying just a little more a month, it will save a good bit in the long run from not having to schedule expensive vet appointments, surgeries, and the cost of future medication, so I think it's worth it : ) Plus, with food that is $1/lb or less, that's pretty good to me considering how much I spend on food a month for myself.

I'll continue to keep my eye out, if anyone else has any recommendations on quality food that isn't too expensive, please share! : )

I grabbed the bag to double check. Yep. That's the one. I paid about half that for the 6# bag, but still. It doesn't look to be any better than the cheap stuff she was on. Also, it looks like it has a lot of mineral type stuff which I read can cause more struvite crystals. This thread inspired me to do more investigating. On the doggy uti forums, it looks like a lot of people have been successful using non-byproduct food, adding a cranberry powder specifically made for dogs and giving distilled water instead of tap water. I guess that will be my new plan.

I'm also glad that this thread could inspire you! Yay

Well, I'm glad you got a good game plan now. I didn't know about the distilled water instead of tap water, but I knew there had to be some kind of cranberry powder or some kind of mixed powder that would work with a good brand of food. Those cranberry powder mixes really aren't that expensive either it looks like, so that's awesome. But even at $40 for a 6 lb bag of food that is essentially corn is absolutely ridiculous. Even the really best of the best quality brands of food have 6 lb bag for like $15.

Feeling kind of dopey for not reading the food and asking questions about it at the vet.

The GF and I were just talking about this, it's like, you go to the doctor and you expect him or her to be educated enough to prescribe you the best treatment and to care enough about your well-being to trust them. You don't typically research every single medicine they prescribe because you trust that they've went through enough school and treated enough people that they generally know what they are talking about.

So it's really not anyone's fault for not questioning their vet when they say "this food will help". : /

I just got Sammy Wellness kibble! I know all the ingredients on the list. The first ingredient is deboned chicken, the second is beef. Yay! It's not terribly expensive and he only needs two cups a day of it if he has snacks. Petco carries it and if you have a pals card it's cheaper than the listed price. Once Sadie finishes her current bag of food we'll be switching her to the adult Wellness kibble. Here's a link to the brand's website: http://www.wellnesspetfood.com/dog-wellness.aspx

Yay! : ) I've always heard Wellness is a really awesome brand and always liked the ingredients.

 

[Rose]

They have Diamond Naturals at Petco too but it was a few dollars more than Wellness. I'm pretty certain that most Petcos and Petsmarts carry Wellness too. There was one other brand that had really awesome ingredients and was fairly cheap too, but I can't remember the name or price. I didn't get it because they didn't have a weight loss version that I could use for Sadie.

 

[BlueViolet]

Wellness looks really awesome. Like really good.

I just found a large breed puppy formula from Wellness! Sweet! : ) It's about $60 for a 30 lb bag and he goes through about that much a month, maybe a little more, but I feel like knowing he is getting quality food is definitely worth the price. I got Mishka so that we can have a large protector of our family and home so I definitely want him to be in optimum health

I don't really think that's all that expensive, though. I mean, considering he is going to be bigger than me when he grows up (his father was 160 lbs) and I eat more than $100 in food a month at 120 lbs, I think that's pretty reasonable.

Large Breed Puppy Formula:

Ingredients: Deboned Chicken, Deboned Whitefish, Chicken Meal, Oatmeal, Ground Peas, Ground Barley, Ground Brown Rice, Salmon Meal (a natural source of DHA-Docosahexaenoic Acid), Tomato Pomace, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a natural source of Vitamin E), Tomatoes, Natural Chicken Flavor, Ground Flaxseed, Salmon Oil (a natural source of DHA - Docosahexaenoic Acid), Carrots, Spinach, Sweet Potatoes, Apples, Blueberries, Salt, Minerals [Zinc Sulfate, Zinc Proteinate, Iron Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Proteinate, Copper Sulfate, Manganese Proteinate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Selenite], Vitamins [Beta-Carotene, Vitamin E Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C), Vitamin A Supplement, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin, Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Folic Acid, Biotin, Vitamin B-12 Supplement], Choline Chloride, Taurine, Chicory Root Extract, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (a natural preservative), Dried Lactobacillus plantarum, Enterococcus faecium, Lactobacillus casei, Lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation products

 

[AmberCutie]

Soylent Green puppy chow.

That's the exact thought I had when I read the title of this thread.

By the way there's no way I can bring myself to ever watch that video. There are just certain things I can't handle seeing in my lifetime.

A handful of years ago, I started to really pay attention to the actual ingredients in our doggies food. I mean, I knew without even doing research that buying the regular ol' brands that you can find at Walmart and the grocery store weren't good enough. I think we always had some of the higher end, more natural stuff. But there were some scary words in the ingredients list in those, and we switched to Buffalo Blue and Nutro Ultra which are a lot more wholesome than many without completely making us broke trying to keep them fed. Sugar is on the Nutro Ultra Senior wet food since she's getting older and can't chew kibble, and that stuff is good enough that in a national disaster, can be consumed by humans if the need arose. We will probably move Tank to that in the next couple years (at least the kibble version) since the Blue still has chicken meal in it.

I find it completely appalling that Science Diet foods have so much filler in them, and that since they're available and recommended by vets, people just trust that and buy it at the insanely inflated prices that it sells for. Ugh.

 

[Rose]

Wellness looks really awesome. Like really good.

I just found a large breed puppy formula from Wellness! Sweet! : ) It's about $60 for a 30 lb bag and he goes through about that much a month, maybe a little more, but I feel like knowing he is getting quality food is definitely worth the price.

This is the exact one that Sammy's on since he's a pyr mix and we're unsure of how big he'll get. He's already as tall as Sadie and still growing pretty fast. If you have a PetPals card from Petco or a store card from Petsmart you'll get it for quite a bit cheaper than listed price. I think we saved $10, maybe $15, off sticker price today but that was without our rewards discounts.

 

[BlueViolet]

This is the exact one that Sammy's on since he's a pyr mix and we're unsure of how big he'll get. He's already as tall as Sadie and still growing pretty fast. If you have a PetPals card from Petco or a store card from Petsmart you'll get it for quite a bit cheaper than listed price. I think we saved $10, maybe $15, off sticker price today but that was without our rewards discounts.

I shop at Petco and I have a card with them, so I'll definitely be looking into getting him a bag of Wellness next time. : )

Also, I remember you saying you got Sammy from a shelter that you drove out to, right? Did they tell you he was a Lab/Pyr mix? I'm just wondering because I once had a bloodhound/lab mix that the shelter claimed was a rottie/german sheppherd. He was my first dog and I miss him dearly, but I have no idea how they got rottie/GSD with his lankiness, droopy face, and hound bark.

Just asking because I've actually been around lab/pyr mixes and they usually look like medium long haired black Pyrs.

Sammy's hair looks shorter than a Lab's coat even, and I'm sure you know how big and fluffy GP coat's get. Also, Labs and Pyrs both have really big and massive sized paws and big, floppy ears that don't stand up at all and Sammy's paws look smaller than a lab's at his age and his ears are smaller and perky. Labs get to be pretty tall, so he probably has lab in him from the way he is growing, but I've heard of lab/pyr mixes taking after the pyr growth usually putting Sammy at Sadie's size around 4 months. Him being taller than her at 6 months seems right for a lab since Pits don't get that tall usually.

I'm definitely not trying to offend you or anything so I hope you aren't. You can ask SoTxBob's opinion as well since he does Pyr rescue and has been around more than I have, but I've been around them since I was really young as well. I'm mostly just mentioning this because Labs and Pyrenees have much different dietary requirements. Pyrenees have a really slow metabolism so after the puppy years, they require as much food as a medium sized dog since they are very calm, still dogs, whereas a lab would need a different kind of diet since they are high energy dogs.

It wouldn't be bad to keep him on large breed puppy food since some labs can weigh up to 100 lbs, but how much does he weigh now and how much is he gaining a month? That would be a good indicator of how big he will get. I've always thought he looked like a lab/pit mix personally but I could be wrong, but if so it would make sense if the shelter said he is a lab/pyr since most shelters won't say a dog has pit in them and most people don't know what a pyr is anyway.

Here's what lab/pyrs tend to look like:

http://i.imgur.com/dkWrr.jpg

Here's a lab/pit:

http://i.imgur.com/DKoUQ.jpg

I think he looks more like the second in regards to the ears, coat length/texture, coat pattern, head structure, and paws. Though, I think if Sammy is definitely one of the most gorgeous dogs I've ever seen in how happy he looks, how healthy his coat looks, and just his pattern is gorgeous. I think that his collar is really cute as well against his color.

 

[Rose]

That first picture is actually what Sammy is starting to look like as he grows. His hair can't seem to grow fast enough to keep up with him though and his sister likes to bite the wavy matts off so he gets little short spots occasionally if we don't watch them. The shelter we got him from supposedly had both his parents and they were a lab and a pyrenees. I'm not for sure though since I never met either of his parents, so this is all just heresay. The only thing I know for sure is that he was/is the runt of his litter and has some growing problems. When we brought him home he had a LOT of trouble eating, holding down food and regulating his body temperature. His tummy issues are mostly resolved now but he still has trouble regulating his body temperature.

As for his growth, this is guestimation since I haven't kept a good track of it. When we brought him home he was only a couple of pounds. Right now, a few days before his 7 month mark, he's about 45-50lbs. I say between because he was 42lbs last week but I know he's definitely gained weight since then.

His coat is tending to get really wavy and long lately even though it's hot as hell. I won't be surprised if it just keeps getting longer like a pyr though. Eh, whatever he is, he's mine and he's here to stay. I don't really care what breed he is so long as I can provide a safe home, healthy food and plenty of love for him.

By special, I mean he's mentally special. :lol: His sister is special too, but she wasn't born special like he was.

 

[SoTxBob]

Just another tidbit in case y'all aren't aware.... You shouldn't shave double coated dogs in an attempt to help them keep cool in the summer months. The hair acts as insulation against the suns heat as well as UV rays. Almost without exception, the Pyrs that have been shaved at some point [neglected grooming and mats, infestation or just uninformed owner choice] have some sort of skin issue as well as the hair seldom grows back as beautiful as it was [or should have been]. They also sunburn if the skin is exposed to the sun. Pyrs are also semi grooming intensive being long hair DC, meaning they need regular comb outs with a good rake. As long as their coats are maintained, the full coat is very beneficial to them for body temp regulation. For my 2 big "cotton balls", I will give them a trim after spring shedding simply to even out some of the very long hairs. This makes them look better but leaves both coats fully intact. Last note... being long hair dogs, if you use a vacuum with the typical beater bar brush, you will need a small pair of pointed scissors to cut the hair from the roller every few uses. I've found better luck to use a canister vac, with no mechanical brush, like you would normally use on wood or tile floors. :-D

I have a yr old female and a ~5 month old male pup coming in 2 weeks. Something about having almost 500lbs of dogs in the house makes me giddy. :dance: :lol:

 

[BlueViolet]

Yeah, I definitely like that the fur helps by trapping cool air underneath as well. I have heard about shaving pretty much ruining the texture of the fur, I live in a moderately hot area in the summer so I was reading up on that before I got him. Most groomers try to convince you to shave them regardless no matter what you tell them. I just let Mishka dig holes outside in the backyard and lay in them and make sure he has lots of water when we do happen to be outside during the afternoon, but I usually wait to let him play outside during the late evenings so it isn't too hot for him.

He's okay with that considering he would rather be sleeping all day anyway on the cool linoleum.

Something about having almost 500lbs of dogs in the house makes me giddy.

I know, I can't wait until Mishka gets older but he's already getting massive. I personally can't pick him up, he's almost half my size. We are getting a second dog when he turns a year old since we are trying to get 5 acres by then, but we may end up getting him an English Mastiff for his birthday first. I think that as guard dogs, they would make a pretty formidable team and I don't want Mishka to "work alone" even if the need hopefully never arises.

I like EM's for what they were bred to do, but GP's have and will always be my favorite breed. We originally were planning on getting a second Pyr when he turned a year old and we may still, but we are looking into the EM option since they are known for pinning intruders down and holding them until the police arrive and that would be good to have in addition to a GP. Considering it's just me and the GF and we are young girls who will be watching young family, I definitely like the idea of having 500+ lbs on our side. : )

But regardless, when we move we are going to have a good bit of livestock so I'm looking forward to having a reason to have a lot of GPs running around being awesome.

Also, we are looking for property up in the mountains where my mom lives so I know Mishka is going to love that since it snows up there.

 

[Rose]

Sammy only gets clothes in the winter or if it's particularly cold out. When it's hot he gets lots of frozen carrots and ice cubes to help stay cool. I try not to 'alter' their hair except for Sadie's and that's only for doggy safe temporary dye. Otherwise Sammy just gets brushed a couple times a week as needed and when his hair starts to get ratty and long. Typically I don't have to do too much because they're pretty good at grooming each other and baths take care of the rest.

We don't take Sammy to the groomers yet since he's pretty rude and still learning manners, but Sadie's groomer is really good about not haircuts. They do a couple shampoos, good brushing, some deshedder stuff and then a nice condition and blow dry and that seems to be good about getting rid of the loose hair without getting rid of too much. When Sadie doesn't get baths at home, she gets the full spa treatment because she seems to really like it and is always really happy afterwards.

As I type all this out, my babies are grooming and playing with each other while hogging more than half the couch. Lol. Picture proof.

I could talk about my babies for days, lol. Sorry.

 

[AedanRayne]

This is a very good post, Blue. The video did turn my stomach but it's best to stay informed. I feel compelled to say something though, I am slightly turned off by anyone who takes it upon themself to suggest that someone take their pet off a prescription diet like Urinary SO. While I do not agree with everything a Veterinary recommends (due to them getting rewards for their sales from the big companies * I was in the field since I was 15, mind you), I have seen Urinary SO work wonders for animals (including my own). One of the amazing things about Urinary SO is that it stimulates the animal to drink more throughout the day. Which, in turn, dilutes their urine and helps reduce the risk of them creating Struvite Crystals and such.

My two cats experienced recurrent UTI's that were seemingly uncontrollable. I had them on several diets (especially ones with high moisture - can food), daily cranberry pills, used a water fountain, etc. but it just wasn't cutting it. Brian's urethra ended up becoming blocked, he was rushed into surgery, and was in ICU for a week due to his severe illness. Thankfully, he ended up recovering but it was questionable for awhile. I was extremely worried that he would become blocked again and was frightened that I would end up losing him. Long story short, I ended up putting him on Urinary SO and get this... he hasn't had any UTI's and has not been blocked since he started on that diet. The same goes for Tommy, he does not experience UTI's anymore. Imagine my relief! Let me tell you, the price for this expensive food does not bother me one bit after having my little boy in surgery & hospitalized for over a week. And I'm more than willing to pay a bit more in order to keep him healthy and painless.

I admire that you're so excited to inform people of the corrupted food industry and applaud you for your efforts. I just ask that you keep in mind that a doctor did prescribe this food for a reason and suddenly taking the animal off of it could lead to further illness and even surgery. My suggestion would be to take these questions to a Veterinarian and see what is best for the patient. I'm not just saying this as a Veterinary Technician but also as a mommy of two sweet kitties who were in a lot of pain but thankfully are no longer hurting since they found this prescription diet.

EDIT: One more thing that I left out (crazy since it's a huge post, huh?) many veterinarians spend a lot of their free time studying animal nutrition and not all of their knowledge comes from big companies like Hills, Iams, Nestlé Purina, etc. Many of these doctors are passionate about what they do and are truly dedicated to learning everything they can to help their patients (yes, that includes nutrition). Please, do not discredit them because graduate school didn't offer loads of courses on nutrition. What graduate school does teach them is how to research these issues themselves effectively and believe me, a good Vet takes a lot of time to do exactly that!