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Hugh Hefner has died

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I saw my first naked woman at the age of 10 when I found a Playboy magazine under the seat of my dads truck. Truthfully, it forever changed me. Some might say for the worse, others for the better...depending on who you talk to these days.

One thing is for certain though, that over time, perceptions change. He built an empire, for good or for bad. Again, depending on who you talk to will determine this. He lived a lavish life and made many women a lot of money in the process. I'm not in the position to cast a judgement on his life and activities, so all I will say is fair winds and following seas to a fellow human being who had a profound effect on many.
 
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I normally don't care when celeb's die but this guy right here is one of my idols. He started a huge empire; was a pioneer in this industry and I have a ton of respect for him. I remember seeing my first playboy and just in complete awe of what he had created. As a entrepreneur he is serious inspiration.

Rest Easy to an icon!
 

zippypinhead

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I honestly admire the man as an independent publisher. It may seem out of place to talk about earnestness when discussing Hugh Hefner, but it seems to me that he was honest about who he was, and the lifestyle he championed. I think that's why he managed to be such a force of personality within our culture for generations.

I drew a little tribute.

Bunny-in-Black.png
 

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I cannot say I am sad he has passed. Sure he built his own empire, but I don't really feel that was a positive edition to the world. I think sex is great and magazines with sexual images are a fun fantasy, but I feel that he promoted all sorts of unhealthy attitudes which has led to oppressing and controlling women's own discoveries of sexual liberation and making it about male pleasure. I believe that sex would have become more open even without him, it was definitely going that way and once the birth control pill came out it gave women the opportunity to become sexually liberated. So probably could have done without the narrow view that attractive women had to be young, tall, skinny, blonde with big boobs and not much in the brain department. I think that playboy definitely had a big impact on that preference.

I have also read a fair amount about him and how he treats the women who live with him. It's disgusting and he sounds like a pretty vile man behind closed doors. Controlling, manipulative and completely objectifying. While yes, these women did consent to being there, it's a bit of a grey area as they didn't seem to know exactly the level of control and isolation they were agreeing to and the whole idea of the fame may have put some of them in a position where they felt pressured into it or felt like they couldn't say no.
 

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I don't have any strong feelings toward him one way or another, but I do think it's annoying to see people pick apart whether he's "good" or "bad" now that he's dead. He's no worse than the CEO of any other empire. McDonald's sucks in teenagers and gets them to burn their arms up for minimum wage. Walmart picks up the old folks and pays them next to nothing. I'll take bunnies over that any day. I do think Playboy is a big part of the unattainable perfection women now aspire to have when they undress. And, I wish he weren't being laid next to Marilyn. Even in death, she's a half won trophy.
 
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My thoughts on him are really torn. I think he did a lot for the world and even women but at the same time was kind of a shitty guy.

I found an article that might express at least close to my thoughts on this.

http://www.ravishly.com/Hugh-Hefner-Abuser-Civil-Rights-Advocate


So an article that someone wrote, made you think other wise about him? For all you know that could be false news or fake news. Can’t believe everything you read on the internet. Js not trying to be rude but like I read half way through the article and chuckled because it’s fake news that someone made up about the guy .
 
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So an article that someone wrote, made you think other wise about him? For all you know that could be false news or fake news. Can’t believe everything you read on the internet. Js not trying to be rude but like I read half way through the article and chuckled because it’s fake news that someone made up about the guy .

And why do you think that article is fake news?

Must be the tons of women who have spoken out about him over the years? Or the books that have been written by previous bunnies? Or countless interviews from the people he "employed"

Yes sweety, muuussssstttt be fake news just because you decided it was.
 

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Never really had a strong opinion about the dude but he was definitely a legend. When I think Playboy, I think Anna Nicole and Carmella DeCesare, so I'm not really up to date. I did like how he made porn appear to be classy and succeeded in bringing it to the mainstream. Also appreciate how he displayed a wide range of women and body types. Will also admit that his E show was a guilty pleasure. Wealthy old guy pays three glorified escorts to live and sleep with him was strangely entertaining. Dude got the only advantage of being Mormon without actually having to be a Mormon. Respect. Always interesting, and often depressing, to see what people are willing to stoop to for a little bit of money and fame.

So an article that someone wrote, made you think other wise about him? For all you know that could be false news or fake news. Can’t believe everything you read on the internet. Js not trying to be rude but like I read half way through the article and chuckled because it’s fake news that someone made up about the guy .

Not sure that I'd call it fake news. Poorly written and sourced? Absolutely. Predictably stupid and pandering to a very specific type of small minded people? Undeniable. Just not sure if fake news fits. Hilarious article either way.
 

zippypinhead

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And why do you think that article is fake news?

Must be the tons of women who have spoken out about him over the years? Or the books that have been written by previous bunnies? Or countless interviews from the people he "employed"

Yes sweety, muuussssstttt be fake news just because you decided it was.

It's not fake news. It's not news at all. It's an opinion piece. And whose opinions are these? A few people who never met the man, never experienced the situations they're discussing, never even read the books describing the situations they're discussing.

People are going to have differing opinions on a man like Hugh Hefner. His entire life's work was divisive in so many ways. I do find it a bit disturbing, though, that people seem to be using his death not just to speak for him, but also to speak for those whom he has known or affected, and doing so in a way that pushes outside agendas.

The thesis of the essay is fair enough. People are complex, and capable of both bad and good, even at the same time. Hugh Hefner was no different in that regard. It's quite clear that his contributions to our culture over the last seven decades does not come without controversy, much of which he courted directly. So, I think it's fair to call him "problematic". I'm just not going to take some statements quoted out of context by Cosmopolitan or People Magazine or the word of a very small handful of anonymous "sex worker" acquaintances of the author of the essay in question as damning evidence that he was some sort of monster.
 

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He seems to be like every other influential person in that he did some good, but he also seemed to be more than one face. What former girlfriends say shouldn't be dismissed, they saw the guy when he was unseen by the public, and after all plenty of people silence non-sex worker women if they speak out against powerful men for being "gold digging whores". Doesn't surprise me to see people ignoring and slamming his ex-girlfriends now. It makes my stomach twist to see so many people praising Hugh and ignoring the women who made him famous because they were pornstars, nude takers, and sluts. The sexphobia and whorephobia is still alive and well towards women.

(Like, holy shit, I still see whorephobia on Marilyn Monroe and Hugh got famous off of her by buying her photos *edit* and publishing them without her consent.)
 
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He seems to be like every other influential person in that he did some good, but he also seemed to be more than one face. What former girlfriends say shouldn't be dismissed, they saw the guy when he was unseen by the public, and after all plenty of people silence non-sex worker women if they speak out against powerful men for being "gold digging whores". Doesn't surprise me to see people ignoring and slamming his ex-girlfriends now. It makes my stomach twist to see so many people praising Hugh and ignoring the women who made him famous because they were pornstars, nude takers, and sluts. The sexphobia and whorephobia is still alive and well towards women.

(Like, holy shit, I still see whorephobia on Marilyn Monroe and Hugh got famous off of her by buying her photos *edit* and publishing them without her consent.)

Professionally Hef was a very important figure for all the reasons discussed. He helped shaped the sexual revolution, was the forefront of racial and gay rights. The Playboy interview, was arguably the first place in the country you could read unfiltered, no BS interview, of important people from politicians, and sports and movie stars, to technologist and noble laureates, and controversial folks like a leader of the American Nazi party and the Black Panthers.

Personally, I'm not a big fan. It seems to me that exploited lots of women (really young girls in many cases), he also allowed folks like Cosby and other famous celebrities to grab a lot of pussy with no consequences at the Mansion. However, for every book I read like the Bunny Tale, that talks about the bad stuff he did. I will say that in my many years on the Playboy CyberClub (aka Playboy Plus) forums there were at least 10 Playboy models that describe meeting Hef as a real gentleman, and often kind and generous. Still, I don't think is good for society for any guy to have a harem of girls under <25. Although, I'd happily admit to wanting to try for a week.
Finally, I keep seeing this stuff about the photos he published about Marilyn Monroe or Madonna as him doing something wrong. A photographer paid Marilyn to shot nudes of her. She signed a model release letting the photographer do want with them. Hef bought them and got a really a good deal because the calendar publisher, liked Hef a lot. He didn't need Marilyn's permission.
According to Hef, and other contemporary accounts I've read, Marilyn was not upset. She proudly said "I posed with nothing on but the radio"
This is not only normal for the porn biz, it is true for any type of modeling arrangement. You'll might want to read your modeling agreement you signed with your websites. If any of you become famous you can pretty much count on them selling or releasing your shows, without your permission.
 

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in my many years on the Playboy CyberClub (aka Playboy Plus) forums there were at least 10 Playboy models that describe meeting Hef as a real gentleman, and often kind and generous.
To me that’s like saying you asked a Walmart employee on the official Walmart Facebook page if it was a good place to work, lol. His girlfriends all spoke highly of him, until they left and their tune changed. Idk I’d take that with a big grain of salt. The website and forum literally exist to advertise his brand.
 
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To me that’s like saying you asked a Walmart employee on the official Walmart Facebook page if it was a good place to work, lol. His girlfriends all spoke highly of him, until they left and their tune changed. Idk I’d take that with a big grain of salt. The website and forum literally exist to advertise his brand.

Fair point, but I'm seeing many of these same models a 10 even 20 years after they stopped doing work for Playboy say nice things about Hef on twitter and in the media. His girlfriends are bit more complicated he had 3 wives and probably 50 girls that rose to the level of girlfriends.Kimberly Conrad had generally good things to say about Hef. I didn't watch much of the girls next door TV show, but I haven't heard a lot of Hef bashing from them. Holly, Kendra, and the Shannon twins all had nice things to say about Hef, and Bridgett didn't say anything initially.
Kendra said this.

"Hef changed my life. He made me the person I am today. I couldn't be more thankful for our friendship and our time together. I will miss him so much but he will be in my heart forever."

I know there are some exceptions but it seems that girls who knew him best, have mourned his passage, while his critics are people who didn't know him.
 

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He didn't need Marilyn's permission.
According to Hef, and other contemporary accounts I've read, Marilyn was not upset. She proudly said "I posed with nothing on but the radio"
This is not only normal for the porn biz, it is true for any type of modeling arrangement. You'll might want to read your modeling agreement you signed with your websites. If any of you become famous you can pretty much count on them selling or releasing your shows, without your permission.

But do you know why Marilyn took those photos? She took them for fifty dollars, to keep herself fed and off of streets. Her nude shots weren't part of her being sexually revolutionary, it was because she was poor. (She claimed to have been acting as a escort on the streets to also make money early on in her career.) And you know what, just because someone can do something, doesn't mean they should. Also, have you read anything about Marilyn? Her personality was that- someone fragile and sexual- her public personality at least. In reality, it doesn't matter what she said- she could have felt the complete opposite. Fuck, even if she was like "okay whatever" about it, it doesn't make it right.

I could publish my friend's poetry that they sent over text, it doesn't mean I wouldn't be a scumbag for doing so. He did so without asking these women, to profit off of them. You can't shrug that off as "well that's their fault" for trying to make money when they were desperate. Phones existed, one model that was friends with Hugh even begged him not to- he still did it. That's cruel.

You also do not take the degrading and superior tone "You'll might want to read your modeling agreement". Of course I read it, and I know men who own and operate the site is profiting off of me right now. So I am. Did Hugh let these women know that they were going to be shared? Did they get any profit from their nude photos being shared?

Just because it's "legal" doesn't mean it isn't a scumming shit thing to do. :)
 
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But do you know why Marilyn took those photos? She took them for fifty dollars, to keep herself fed and off of streets. Her nude shots weren't part of her being sexually revolutionary, it was because she was poor. (She claimed to have been acting as a escort on the streets to also make money early on in her career.) And you know what, just because someone can do something, doesn't mean they should. Also, have you read anything about Marilyn? Her personality was that- someone fragile and sexual- her public personality at least. In reality, it doesn't matter what she said- she could have felt the complete opposite. Fuck, even if she was like "okay whatever" about it, it doesn't make it right.

Ok let's go back to late 1953. Hef and Marilyn are both 28 years old. Hef is a nobody who spent the last of his life-savings $500 (almost $5000 in today's dollars) to try and launch a men's magazine.
Marilyn Monore is one of the most famous actresses in Hollywood, she is dating Yankee legend Joe DiMaggio and just signed a big contract with Fox pictures.

First, how in the hell does Hugh nobody Hefner even talk to Marilyn Monore.? Fox hired an army of folks just to keep pesky fans away. It would be easier for me to get the telephone number and address of top MFC 20 model, than Hugh Hefner getting a chance to talk to Marilyn Monore.

Ok lets assume that somehow he contacts Marilyn. "Hi, Marilyn I'm going to launch a new men's magazine would it be ok to run your nude calendar pictures in the magazine." Even if Marilyn like the photos, there is no way her agent or Fox are giving permission for them to be published. What the hell could Hef offer Marilyn?,her jewelry alone was worth ten times more than Hefner had. Offer her a share of the profits? nobody including Hef knew if there would be any profits.

Marilyn was 24 years old when she posed she was paid $50 ($500 in 2017 dollars) she signed the model agreement. I'm really struggling to see how this much different than webcamming or posing for men's magazine today. Yes posing nude was much rarer back then but her poses were pretty demure (actually very beautiful). We have contracts in this country for a reason and I don't think we are doing anyone a favor by saying 24 year old is too young to be held to them.

From the Washington Post.

Monroe herself said “the magazine, I was told, thanks to my photos, [was] an instant sellout all across the country, an instant success.” From “Marilyn: Her Life in Her Own Words:”

I never even received a thank-you from all those who made millions off a nude Marilyn photograph. I even had to buy a copy of the magazine to see myself in it … I admitted it was me who posed for that nude calendar even when the Fox executives became nervous and believed this would cause the ruination of any films I would appear in and also the end of my movie career. Of course they were wrong. The fans, my public, cheered when I admitted it was me, and that calendar and that Playboy first-issue publicity helped my career.

I'm far more sympathetic to girls who appeared on the Bachelor, Big Brother and other reality shows, when Playboy would dust off their casting pictures and run them in the magazine or online. In most cases, the girls were happy for the publicity, but in some cases, they were pretty traumatized but it didn't seem to matter much. Yes, that's pretty shitty behavior. Having said that there were times that Playboy would remove photos at a models request, which is I suspect something that most other Men's magazine wouldn't do.

But trying to cast Marilyn as a victim that just doesn't fly.
 
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Ok let's go back to late 1953. Hef and Marilyn are both 28 years old. Hef is a nobody who spent the last of his life-savings $500 (almost $5000 in today's dollars) to try and launch a men's magazine.
Marilyn Monore is one of the most famous actresses in Hollywood, she is dating Yankee legend Joe DiMaggio and just signed a big contract with Fox pictures.

First, how in the hell does Hugh nobody Hefner even talk to Marilyn Monore.? Fox hired an army of folks just to keep pesky fans away. It would be easier for me to get the telephone number and address of top MFC 20 model, than Hugh Hefner getting a chance to talk to Marilyn Monore.

And what about after Playboy takes off? Also, man, I think you're underestimating "famous actress" to be "very well paid".
*edit because even though I said it before, hey again is still valid! :h:* You are also acting as though this was the famous, at the top of her career Marilyn who had these photos taken. Read my first paragraph. Over, and over again if you need to. She took these because she needed them. They were great, sure, they were a scandal of the time, and Hugh profited off of that.
He profited off of how high her career was going with something that she did when she needed. That isn't sex revolutionary. That sounds a lot like people leaking nudes of celebrities than it does being revolutionary.
Then what about Madonna? He was famous enough then to get in some type of contact with her (although hey, even back in the 50s, I'm sure he could have let Marilyn know, or her agent, something- with some kind of effort.) or the woman who begged him not to release the photos? Was he just a "poor guy" then? Trying to start up a company off of the backs of women? Hm? (The answer is nah.)
Just because you can doesn't mean it isn't a shitty thing to do.

You keep thinking you, though! Lmfao. :D
 
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Professionally Hef was a very important figure for all the reasons discussed. He helped shaped the sexual revolution, was the forefront of racial and gay rights. The Playboy interview, was arguably the first place in the country you could read unfiltered, no BS interview, of important people from politicians, and sports and movie stars, to technologist and noble laureates, and controversial folks like a leader of the American Nazi party and the Black Panthers.

Personally, I'm not a big fan. It seems to me that exploited lots of women (really young girls in many cases), he also allowed folks like Cosby and other famous celebrities to grab a lot of pussy with no consequences at the Mansion. However, for every book I read like the Bunny Tale, that talks about the bad stuff he did. I will say that in my many years on the Playboy CyberClub (aka Playboy Plus) forums there were at least 10 Playboy models that describe meeting Hef as a real gentleman, and often kind and generous. Still, I don't think is good for society for any guy to have a harem of girls under <25. Although, I'd happily admit to wanting to try for a week.
Finally, I keep seeing this stuff about the photos he published about Marilyn Monroe or Madonna as him doing something wrong. A photographer paid Marilyn to shot nudes of her. She signed a model release letting the photographer do want with them. Hef bought them and got a really a good deal because the calendar publisher, liked Hef a lot. He didn't need Marilyn's permission.
According to Hef, and other contemporary accounts I've read, Marilyn was not upset. She proudly said "I posed with nothing on but the radio"
This is not only normal for the porn biz, it is true for any type of modeling arrangement. You'll might want to read your modeling agreement you signed with your websites. If any of you become famous you can pretty much count on them selling or releasing your shows, without your permission.


This maybe the first time I will say this and maybe the last (since I typically don't agree with anything member's say) but fuck I agree with all of this. If I took pictures and signed a release I know theres a chance they can end up anywhere. He also started from nothing as well. Of course there are women coming forward now that he's dead, didn't anyone expect that?

Nobody is perfect and everyone has flaws. I don't agree with the way he treated some of the women but there are ladies who speak super high about him who were his girlfriends. I just don't understand why people can't just let the poor dude rest in peace. Seriously. There are bigger problems in the world then the way he treated women.

Also this was just a general statement about the world. Everyone is entitled to hate Hugh but he's an entrepreneur and as independent contractors (especially since I started poor and with nothing) what he did is amazing. He was an advocate for gay rights and did a TON of good yet there's SO many people bashing him and over looking what he actually accomplished in 91 years.
 
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