Student Photographer hoping to study camming

[ph0tographer]

Hi! I am a current college Senior studying photography and film in Connecticut. I am creating an art studio thesis in photography and sculpture, exaiming online interactions, relationships, and how the internet mediates contemporary social discourse and life. I have been fascinated with the industry/community surrounding camming and joined the site to learn more hopefully and to pitch my project to anyone who would be interested in talking to me or possibly being a part of the project. I also don't know if this is appropriate for the forum but am hoping it is

 

[Nigerian Prince]

Your post doesn't make it clear on what exactly the project is, and what exactly it is you are looking to get from any model involved.

 

[Miss_Lollipop]

Hi! I am a current college Senior studying photography and film in Connecticut. I am creating an art studio thesis in photography and sculpture, exaiming online interactions, relationships, and how the internet mediates contemporary social discourse and life. I have been fascinated with the industry/community surrounding camming and joined the site to learn more hopefully and to pitch my project to anyone who would be interested in talking to me or possibly being a part of the project. I also don't know if this is appropriate for the forum but am hoping it is

Heads up you may get some tough responses - some of us are tired of being a subject of fascination. Makes us feel like we're in a zoo..

 

[MarieElise]

... and how much you plan on paying us for our time ...

 

[AudriTwo]

also proof this is for your thesis and not total bs.

 

[Vixxen81]

There are already a handful of thesis that have been published on this very topic. I don't believe you're a student or have good intentions.

 

[ph0tographer]

Heads up you may get some tough responses - some of us are tired of being a subject of fascination. Makes us feel like we're in a zoo..

Thank you for letting me know. I really don't want to make anyone feel like the subject of aestheticization but rather just looking to have a conversation.

 

[ph0tographer]

To be honest I am new to this and am slightly worried about posting information here that could identify me but happy in a pm to provide proof. I have a website/portfolio of photography as well as a cv/resume. If anyone could advise sorry.

 

[ph0tographer]

There are already a handful of thesis that have been published on this very topic. I don't believe you're a student or have good intentions.

I am aware and am looking at them. This is more looking into the aesthetics of an online experience. I don't believe work has been done to explore it photographically. I also work in sculpture and with data as a way to abstract the photography, something else which is novel to my project.

 

[ph0tographer]

... and how much you plan on paying us for our time ...

As I'm a student and really don't have a crazy budget for this I sadly can't offer a significant sum, however, I am committed to paying anyone for being a part of the project. Sorry.

 

[ph0tographer]

As I'm a student and really don't have a crazy budget for this I sadly can't offer a significant sum, however, I am committed to paying anyone for being a part of the project. Sorry.

I don't want to be exploitative in any manner. Thank you all for pointing this out. Something I really shouldn't have overlooked.

 

[ph0tographer]

Just a bit more context. My hope was that by going to the performer, I hoped to get the point of view of the person putting themselves in front of the camera. I think there is a similar performative aspect to much of contemporary photography. I see this as a metaphor for existence in a commercialized and capital-driven world. I see camming as a way of claiming agency over oneself in a way. These are the things I hoped to explore in the project, both photographically, but also through abstracting the images with sculpture. I hope that helps.

 

[MarieElise]

Just a bit more context. My hope was that by going to the performer, I hoped to get the point of view of the person putting themselves in front of the camera. I think there is a similar performative aspect to much of contemporary photography. I see this as a metaphor for existence in a commercialized and capital-driven world. I see camming as a way of claiming agency over oneself in a way. These are the things I hoped to explore in the project, both photographically, but also through abstracting the images with sculpture. I hope that helps.

Yes ofcourse your thesis makes sense, but expecting us to do it out of the good of our hearts when we are busy people does not. This just opens the door to more of you college types wanting to come here and use us. I find it irritating, but at least your responses have been mannerly. No way I'd do this though. Good luck.

When I was getting my Master's I had to provide something in return to get info from established professionals, whether it be a consult fee, or free work.
So I find these kind of requests really naïve, exploitative and rude.
But don't worry I'm leaving the thread now.

When you become an established artist/ sculptor/ whatever you will do the same. Because as well as artist, you are a business person, and you have to wear both hats.

ETA; Especially if you are self-employeed!!!!

 

[AudriTwo]

To be honest I am new to this and am slightly worried about posting information here that could identify me but happy in a pm to provide proof. I have a website/portfolio of photography as well as a cv/resume. If anyone could advise sorry.

Oh that's ironic.

 

[ph0tographer]

Yes ofcourse your thesis makes sense, but expecting us to do it out of the good of our hearts when we are busy people does not. This just opens the door to more of you college types wanting to come here and use us. I find it irritating, but at least your responses have been mannerly. No way I'd do this though. Good luck.

When I was getting my Master's I had to provide something in return to get info from established professionals, whether it be a consult fee, or free work.
So I find these kind of requests really naïve, exploitative and rude.
But don't worry I'm leaving the thread now.

When you become an established artist/ sculptor/ whatever you will do the same. Because as well as artist, you are a business person, and you have to wear both hats.

ETA; Especially if you are self-employeed!!!!

Thank you for taking the time to respond to me. This conversation has already made me reconsider so many aspects of the project. I thought I had mentioned I wanted to pay people however I could. I just can't offer a lot. Most photographers I know work with models for 20/hr. I don't think that's enough. I would hopefully pay more. I've been saving up for three years to fund this project and don't have a ton.

 

[MarieElise]

Thank you for taking the time to respond to me. This conversation has already made me reconsider so many aspects of the project. I thought I had mentioned I wanted to pay people however I could. I just can't offer a lot. Most photographers I know work with models for 20/hr. I don't think that's enough. I would hopefully pay more. I've been saving up for three years to fund this project and don't have a ton.

I do think it's a very good idea for a project. Being open and throwing ball park amount out there is helpful. I know you don't feel comfy sharing your identity, and that's good. But I think it does help models if you share as much info as you can in the thread, about what you're looking for, what is entailed, what you can compensate etc etc I do think there will more likely be people interested if you do that.

 

[ph0tographer]

I do think it's a very good idea for a project. Being open and throwing ball park amount out there is helpful. I know you don't feel comfy sharing your identity, and that's good. But I think it does help models if you share as much info as you can in the thread, about what you're looking for, what is entailed, what you can compensate etc etc I do think there will more likely be people interested if you do that.

Honestly, this is my first time trying to work with people outside of my friends and family. I generally struggle with this in person, but weirdly on the internet it becomes easier. This process of dissociation online is at the heart of the project. Some more information:

- I shoot on 35mm and 120mm film with a Nikon and Pentax 67
- I would love to have conversations on here about the project if anyone would like to but am also looking for people possibly interested in being more involved photographically
- I can happily pay in the range of 20-50 an hour
- I can also trade work as a photographer if that would be helpful to somebody, high quality and edited images
- I've been working in photography and sculpture for three years since my sophomore year at university in Connecticut.

This is the working version of my artist statement for the project:

My thesis is based in a marxist aesthetic theory. It works through the contemporary means of production to highlight and asehteticize contemporary life as it is mediated by technology, data, computer science, and how these shape a unique contemporary experience of memory. Memory is viewed as the basis for human consciousness. Memory as it works through vision and experience is particularly emphasized. This is shown by deconstructing images using computer science techniques intervened in by hand making objects, and materializing the data into a physical relationship with the image. The same techniques used to analyze categorize and commercialize our digital (now involuntary) existence. I hope by exploring a wide variety of interactions mediated by the internet, the apparatus of the digital world will become the subject of the work, abstracting the individuals the same way that the internet does through dissociation. Weirtz says photo is a philosophical enlightenment to painting. What enlightens photo? Is data neccecary to abstract photography? Or do aesthetics evolve to abstract the machine through its apparent failure to serve its function?

Do you think it is worth reposting this thread or that would probably just cause a worse reaction?

 

[ph0tographer]

Honestly, this is my first time trying to work with people outside of my friends and family. I generally struggle with this in person, but weirdly on the internet it becomes easier. This process of dissociation online is at the heart of the project. Some more information:

- I shoot on 35mm and 120mm film with a Nikon and Pentax 67
- I would love to have conversations on here about the project if anyone would like to but am also looking for people possibly interested in being more involved photographically
- I can happily pay in the range of 20-50 an hour
- I can also trade work as a photographer if that would be helpful to somebody, high quality and edited images
- I've been working in photography and sculpture for three years since my sophomore year at university in Connecticut.

This is the working version of my artist statement for the project:

My thesis is based in a marxist aesthetic theory. It works through the contemporary means of production to highlight and asehteticize contemporary life as it is mediated by technology, data, computer science, and how these shape a unique contemporary experience of memory. Memory is viewed as the basis for human consciousness. Memory as it works through vision and experience is particularly emphasized. This is shown by deconstructing images using computer science techniques intervened in by hand making objects, and materializing the data into a physical relationship with the image. The same techniques used to analyze categorize and commercialize our digital (now involuntary) existence. I hope by exploring a wide variety of interactions mediated by the internet, the apparatus of the digital world will become the subject of the work, abstracting the individuals the same way that the internet does through dissociation. Weirtz says photo is a philosophical enlightenment to painting. What enlightens photo? Is data neccecary to abstract photography? Or do aesthetics evolve to abstract the machine through its apparent failure to serve its function?

Do you think it is worth reposting this thread or that would probably just cause a worse reaction?

Oh, also I have been working professionally as a prod assistant and photo assistant on editorial shoots in New York for the past two summers and have gained experience working professionally with models. This is something I hope will help the project. I am trying to do this as professionally as possible but at the same time is still a learning experience for me.

 

[ph0tographer]

The photographs would hopefully highlight specifically the mechanical tools used for camming and how they relate to the body in the process of broadcasting.

 

[ph0tographer]

Lastly, and then Ill shut up, a project I am very inspired by is Larry Sultan's "The Valley" Where he was granted access to pornography sets shot in San Fernando Valley all in home residences. The book is as much about the industry of pornography as it is about the aestheticization of the working-class bedroom as the set for many of the films they were producing at the time.

 

[MarieElise]

- I would love to have conversations on here about the project if anyone would like to but am also looking for people possibly interested in being more involved photographically

Can you elaborate what this means, like you want people in connecticut, or you want long distance coochie pics? I think a few more details are needed here.

Offering photo and editing is super cool, but I'm thinking this means people have to meet with you in person? Which is dangerous. But maybe it doesn't.

Do you think it is worth reposting this thread or that would probably just cause a worse reaction?

It comes off as spamming if you have more than 1 thread here.
I think so far you actually look really good in this thread, because you aren't responding defensively or rudely to some pushback and grilling. Just my opinion though. Lots of people have melt downs or lash out when they get even the slightest pushback or questioning.

 

[ph0tographer]

I am definitely not looking for long-distance coochie pics. More so, the ideal situation would be to visit the physical location and take photos. This is something that I want to set up as professionally as I can, though, with release forms and other people present. I'm also very hesitant to do this and would ideally be on the East Coast US somewhere. I can travel a bit. But yeah, I want to have conversations first, over the phone ideally, and then probably first meet for a coffee to talk about the project in person before even discussing a more engaged photo shoot. Just to be super clear I looked through similar threads and I'm not looking for screen grabs or for content from streams, it is really about the space and the tools of the stream.

 

[ph0tographer]

I am definitely not looking for long-distance coochie pics. More so, the ideal situation would be to visit the physical location and take photos. This is something that I want to set up as professionally as I can, though, with release forms and other people present. I'm also very hesitant to do this and would ideally be on the East Coast US somewhere. I can travel a bit. But yeah, I want to have conversations first, over the phone ideally, and then probably first meet for a coffee to talk about the project in person before even discussing a more engaged photo shoot. Just to be super clear I looked through similar threads and I'm not looking for screen grabs or for content from streams, it is really about the space and the tools of the stream.

I'm not even committed to having explicit nudity in the project. I think even the intentional denial of such is more interesting.

 

[D_A_X]

i might be able to assist you. i'm an art model by profession and have worked with different types of visual artists, including art students in various capacities. i just started camming. you can reach me here, or on my camming platform.

https://share.myfreecams.com/D_A_X

good luck on your project ~

 

[Lilly_____]

I like the idea of the permanence of sculpture versus the volatility of the online interaction. But also on the other hand, as you might be well aware by not wanting to share your identity, whatever you share on the internet is also very permanent. I think the fact that what we represent as models is at the same time so liquid and permanent and you want to represent it with both liquid and permanent mechanics is very meaningful. I like it.

 

[ph0tographer]

I like the idea of the permanence of sculpture versus the volatility of the online interaction. But also on the other hand, as you might be well aware by not wanting to share your identity, whatever you share on the internet is also very permanent. I think the fact that what we represent as models is at the same time so liquid and permanent and you want to represent it with both liquid and permanent mechanics is very meaningful. I like it.

Thank you so much! Im more explicitly working with glass, plaster, steel, and sand to illustrate this permanence and relationship with materials. I'm really excited about it. The glass tests have been really promising. Another theme I'm working with is anonymity, using ml models to anonymize images so specifically images in public spaces where surveillance is so pervasive.

 

[melanieoncam]

To be honest I am new to this and am slightly worried about posting information here that could identify me but happy in a pm to provide proof. I have a website/portfolio of photography as well as a cv/resume. If anyone could advise sorry.

Yeah, because you would never want your name to be associated with us dirty, dirty cam models!

 

[ph0tographer]

Yeah, because you would never want your name to be associated with us dirty, dirty cam models!

No not really what I'm worried about. Especially if I would make a thesis about it... Kind of attached to my name forever.

 

[Vixxen81]

No not really what I'm worried about. Especially if I would make a thesis about it... Kind of attached to my name forever.

Then what are you worried about? Do you want to be sex positive and uplift the industry and yourself at the same time or do you want to just profit off of us anonymously and call it a day? Because let me tell you, we need allies more than ever right now.

 

[AudriTwo]

I am definitely not looking for long-distance coochie pics. More so, the ideal situation would be to visit the physical location and take photos.

To be honest I am new to this and am slightly worried about posting information here that could identify me but happy in a pm to provide proof. I have a website/portfolio of photography as well as a cv/resume. If anyone could advise sorry.

No not really what I'm worried about. Especially if I would make a thesis about it... Kind of attached to my name forever.

im going ignore the irony of us cammodels putting ourselves out there while you get to hold onto anonymity for now.

i have some good solid advice. if you want to come to cammodel locations, for their safety and yours, i suggest you start being publicly open with who you are when you are ready to do your thesis. i think its pretty ignorant to assume we'd allow some random tankie college student into our homes. background checks are $10. you will have to get model release forms with our private info to prove consent. so you gotta build trust my dude. sex workers targets of violence and it's important that people coming into our spaces are open with who they are.

i also maybe recommend hiring third-party security so everyone is safe.


(ps: the tankie bit was meant to be a light-hearted joke, not a jab. you sound like you read theory for fun. serious good luck. its nice to see a photography student want to take actual photos of us and not screenshots of our streams passing off as their own work. i prefer to shoot with 100 b/w film. good luck with your thesis op)