Time to really stir things up!

[Lady_Sebilla]

But yeah, if 50 years is too old for an ideology, we should probably revisit the Declaration and the Constitution because they're about 5 times older than that. Not even touching religious text here, I'll let someone braver than I handle that one.

Different marketing. More powerful. Still, gonna collapse one day. Nothig is eternal

 

[yummybrownfox]

I think you might be on to something, but I think it could be expanded out to parenting in general. I think that states (in part through the educational system) have limited how we (and by we i mean everyone with kids... I made sure not to have any cuz i'm selfish like that) raise our children. In the late 60's my 1st grade teacher, some old lady in her 50's or 60's, would take us out into the hallway... Grab a handful of hair at the top of our heads, and shake the living shit out of us for 5 or 10 seconds to discipline us. I don't remember what I did to get that, but 45 years later I remember it and I doubt if i did what ever it was again. In the 70's I remember being paddled by several grade school principles for acting out. The Dean of Boy's at our Junior High School, who was this huge black guy that played professional football for the Vikings at one point in time, paddled me once for fighting. You better believe I remembered it. By today's standards each incident would probably be viewed as child abuse, and I can't imagine my 1st grade teacher would't wind up all over CNN and land in jail by today's standards.

After the schools stopped corporal punishment, they went on the lookout for child abuse in the home. With state child protective services backing the schools up, physically punishing children became a jail-able offense and all but stopped in the late 80's. I'm not saying child abuse isn't a horrible offense or shouldn't be punished, but I can't remember the last time I heared a friend say they even spanked their child for acting out. I mean everyone's more worried about being charged with a crime than disciplining their children and they all want to "talk it out" or give the kids "time out's".

I saw a youtube video the other day of some 9-ish year old kid that was completely out of control and terrorizing his mother at some clothing store. He was having a meltdown and hitting & kicking her while calling her a "fucking bitch". Instead of bringing down the hammer on the lil brat, she spent most of the video pleading and begging for him to stop. When he didn't, she sort of wrestled him to the ground, and gave him "hugs" till he stopped. Which he hadn't by the time the video ended, and was still going strong kicking his mother and calling her names. If I acted like that in public... My parents would have immediately knocked the shit out of me on the spot. I think anyone that grew up in the 60's would tell you the other adults during that time frame would have praised and supported her for it too.

My dad use to love to tell the story of the first time my mother heard me use the word "fuck". I was in 2nd grade and she overheard me use it with a friend. My dad use to laugh at the mental picture of me hauling ass down the street in sheer terror as my mother came running out of the house. I also remember a grade school friend of mine telling me his father backhanded him so hard he flew out of the dinning room chair because he wouldn't take his elbows off the table. While punishments might have been harsh pre-1980's... They insured we considered those around us. I won't say me or my friends were angles by any stretch of the imagination... But we were respectful to adults and knew our place and went a long way towards how we behaved as adults.

Well said, bodisha.

We are living in times where cursing out your parents and teachers is becoming the norm...with the excuse "Well, kids will be kids" being used more. School teachers and principals (and let's not forget daycare center workers) are put in the uncomfortable position of dealing with parents who get defensive if you tell them something upsetting about their precious angels. Parents now are more interested in buying iPads and iPhones for their 6-year olds, and being the cool parents.

 

[bob]

Hippie subculture is just too old for this new world we live in today.

.....this does not compute
sittin around on the computer, chattin with friends and strangers who happen by, talking about "the way things are, and the way they could be", discussing taboos, travesties and "awws".....practicing critical thought and being unafraid to try new things (the two things are a binary star system, interrelated).....living a life that FEELS anyway, on a personal level, to be closer to peace and love than aggression and control, that is not programmed to consume, understanding through experience that regardless of who you are or what you do, there is the same human filament that connects us.....hell, this is the santa cruz mountains in 1968....with wifi.....lol

as a friend just told me.....there's at least three of us left

it doesn't mean the world isn't what it is, with all of its struggle and heartache and joy, nor that commerce isn't what makes it go round
it's just an approach to a system

 

[DeezNA]

I don't think anyone is disputing that everything will inevitably change in one form or another, it's just a matter of time. However, nothing "dies" unless it is completely wiped from history. We are talking about it, it is still here, its influence remains. People still practice centuries-old, even millennial traditions based on teachings and practices of the time. It's the counterpart to fashion: tradition.

We're supposed to learn from the past - learn from their mistakes, incorporate what works, build towards a better future. That's the idea, right?

As far as aesthetic fashion goes (being, by definition completely impractical and solely cosmetic), a lot of people are revisiting and re-working the 40-60's with this "hipster/steampunk" thing they do. That's totally personal choice and is surprisingly (kinda) socially acceptable. Reverse it (wearing popular contemporary skimpy clothing in the 40-60's), and you'd have a riot on your hands. It's social progression.

People dressing up in the style of the hippie generation is well alive, I can provide photographic evidence if necessary. Actual hippies from the hippie generation are still alive - they're incredibly kind and also very helpful if you want a 3-hour dissertation on solar power and kale.


Now let's be clear here, there have been massive leaps and bounds in the past 30 years in developmental psychology that have explained a lot of stuff that, in hindsight, seems obvious. Don't abuse your children, don't smoke or drink while pregnant, vitamins and medicines for an "optimal child"; for fuck's sake, autism wasn't even socially understood until the 80's and many would argue that it still isn't well understood. However, we do know the difference between someone disciplining their child and someone disciplining a child an autistic child who obviously doesn't know better. This is improvement, in my book.

As far as child discipline, it will always be up to the parent(s). I theorize that, due to advances in psychoanalysis and developmental psychology, parents of this generation are "lighter-handed" because they are aware of the horrific negative effects of neglect and abuse; not just physical but verbal and psychological, which can be just as potent if not more. No one wants to raise the next serial killer or pariah...

Parents of the digital age have all the wealth of wisdom, knowledge, fear-mongering and snake-oil salesmen known as the internet at their disposal 24/7. It's their choice how to raise their child; ultimately, it's their responsibility to make informed decisions. All we can do as a species is incorporate useful, correct new information with effective and useful tools from the past to create a better present. Then just cross fingers, roll the dice and hope for the best.

 

[Lady_Sebilla]

sittin around on the computer, chattin with friends and strangers who happen by, talking about "the way things are, and the way they could be", discussing taboos, travesties and "awws".....practicing critical thought and being unafraid to try new things (the two things are a binary star system, interrelated).....living a life that FEELS anyway, on a personal level, to be closer to peace and love than aggression and control, that is not programmed to consume, understanding through experience that regardless of who you are or what you do, there is the same human filament that connects us.....hell, this is the santa cruz mountains in 1968....with wifi.....lol

What are you trying to say? Everything you're talking about has existed long before hippies. And when I say hipppie subculture is dead, I don't mean all hippies are dead. Subculture dies when it's not a mass phenomenon anymore. Three hippies don't make a subculture!

 

[VeronicaChaos]

A point I don't believe that was mentioned: is it possible that we don't really have more PC people, but those who are have their voices amplified by buzzword article sites and social media? I'm generally an offensive person and I've had generally no problems, save for a few REALLY LOUD social justice warriors. You guys are linking to Chevy chase saying the word nigger as if comedy is all PC now but what about that recent bit with Louis CK talking about pedophiles? On Snl as well, I might add.

I guess I generally just think people really aren't that much different, just the landscape has changed and it's skewed our perception of who the players are. But from where I'm standing, most people are totally down to laugh at a so-called offensive joke as long as they don't think the PC police is listening.

So really, I think the only thing that has changed is our fear of being called out for being offensive because social justice warriors can be just as abusive bullies as those they fight if not entirely more so.

 

[JickyJuly]

Kids today are not rude because their parents fail to punish them. We now have a generation of kids who were neglected and raised by the TV or the street raising kids the same way. Some of us who grew up on MTV and empty houses hope to raise a family differently, but most people just do what they know themselves. Compounding things is the fact that we live in a culture that prizes things over people or education, and kids are learning that earlier and earlier. Punishment doesn't create respect. Kids aren't encouraged to learn and grow before defining themselves. They latch on to any idiotic idea that makes them feel like somebody and run with it. You can absolutely raise polite thoughtful children without punitive parenting. I do not do any sort of made up punishment with my kids... no spanking, no hand hitting, no time outs. If I even raise my voice, I apologize. It's totally possible to respect your child's personal space and personhood without creating a monster. Educated people who know that they deserve respect are going to be more likely to act respectfully to others. They're also going to be less likely to jump on the "you disagree with me so I'm offended" train because their opinions aren't going to be the only thing that defines them.