INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype...

[rwesmill]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I really wish folks would not use a particular nationality as a "token" of some meaning. Romanians, Hungarians, Slovakians, Americans, Canadians, et al, are all individuals and it's not fair to group humans into a "scammer box" because of their nationality, or any other grouping. It's not necessary; why not group them like "and other scammers" rather than ethnicity?

Strictly an mfc meme reference, nothing more. Please don't read too far into it. Last thing I want to do is have this thread turn into a PC debate with NSA and Obama references.

Regarding skype, I only do it for the cam quality aspect. Eons better than MFC due to heir server compression/processing, if the model has a good quality camera. Oftentime it will be true 1080p resolution, and look unreal. Ever seen the minute follicles sprouting from aereola goosebumps? Heaven.

 

[Evvie]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I think the problem here is maybe this undertone that seeps in in regards to how some models view members. A plumber has no reason to look down on a person who needs their sink fixed, but I think maybe it's easier for a model to see a member as being a scummy, perverted bastard who deserves to be separated from his money because of what he's asking her to do, even though she is OFFERING that service. Does that make sense? Sort of like--I'm going to offer to get naked for you in exchange for money, but if you give me money to get naked for you then you are misogynistic scum and it's ok to rip you off. I'm not saying all, or even very many, models think like that but I've definitely seen that mentality out there.

I'll try to keep it short as my sleeping pill is kicking ---

At least here on ACF, I do not really see this mindset. I think it would actually be far, far more difficult for models to, well, model if they felt like 300 dirty perverts were staring at them instead of 300 relatively average dudes. I have truly never seen the kind of vindictive thing you refer to (that a member "deserves" to be stolen from because he likes his penis pleasured in weird ways) and I would in fact be very surprised to see this attitude from any model. Some of this mentality may be out there to a degree -- "oh well, you've already spent the money so it's too late for you," but certainly not any kind of willful malice behind it, just willful greed.

After spending a long time observing these situations (member pays, model doesn't want to deliver) I would guess that the vast majority of the time, it occurs when the model doesn't actually want to do the Skype, or just as often a custom video, in the first place. She just can't afford to turn the money down that is being offered to her. At other times, it is models who offer such services as a reward (for a raffle, perhaps) and then find that it's harder than they thought to fit that time in to their schedules. Sometimes, the model will even offer the service as a show of appreciation - "wow, thanks for that huge tip, how about a Skype later just for you?" without thinking her plan through.

In this regard, I do not think I agree with your above statement, that this habit occurs because models think members deserve it. I think that's looking too far for an explanation.

IMO, when this behavior occurs, the simplest and most obvious explanation is the model wants money and agrees to work some time in the future - but when the due date approaches, she finds that she doesn't want to get the job done. Laziness, dishonesty, anxiety, or any number of factors may cause a model to fudge on putting out (so to speak).

When we get talking about what models think of members, and therefore a member might deserve poor treatment - that's just the rationalization of the act the model was already going to commit. He only turns in to a needy, frustrating, begging, or perverted person AFTER she has decided that he's not going to get his show. Now again, I could not say all or even many models think this way. In my observation it is not so much "he's an asshole/pervert" than, "he wants something from me, and I am finding it difficult to deliver, so he needs to go."

I must make one final note: I do not agree that this behavior models put on is a good one. It is damaging not only to their own careers, but the industry as a whole. However, I think members get the impression that the model needs to only pop online for thirty minutes and do a quick show, while on the model side of the fence we are plotting out a couple of hours and an entirely shifted afternoon to oblige a member for half an hour (if she only has a 5 hour window to cam before the kids get home from school, it's now either your prepaid skype or her daily goal she can choose between). I believe it is easy for members to forget that some issues, like performance anxiety, can have a huge effect on models as well. If she's stressing about being able to give you a good time, she won't want to do it at all. I think you will agree that a model doing a show with a member is hardly as routine as a plumber working on your sink. So I do understand that this type of behavior from models is not good, but I do not believe it can all be attributed to laziness, delusion, or thievery. There are legitimate and common reasons why models cannot do shows on schedule and then understandably develop anxiety surrounding them. What they do next (do the show anyway, try to compensate the member, or cut him off) is the important part.

(Well, that wasn't short at all... )

 

[yossarian]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I think the way you explained it there makes much more sense to me. But still, if a model is having issues like that, why not just be up front about it? Perhaps schedule a specific time with the member and plan for it rather than just putting it off? I understand that being in the mood and performance anxiety would be major factors, but now that you've explained it further, maybe what we're really seeing is a lack of communication or models who are just bad at communicating.

I almost deleted that last part of my previous response right after I posted it, because I didn't want to give the impression that I think it's a common thing for models to look down on members as pervy creeps. I certainly don't see that mentality around here, or with the models I regularly visit. When I have seen it, it seems to be models who treat camming like an ATM machine -- "hey, free money. I just show my boobs to these gross men and get paid for it." They're the ones we talk about here, who don't make any effort to develop a rapport with members, try to scam, spam other models' rooms, etc. I suspect they don't last long. And I don't know anything about the model the OP is talking about, so I'm not saying she's like that (obviously if she has a high cam score, she's probably not), but I was sort of fishing for an explanation as to why somebody would see taking money and not delivering as being okay.

 

[Jupiter551]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Evvie just ride the high, you'll ruin sleeping pills but it'll be fun! lol

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Can someone explain to me why so many people opt for Skype shows?

Pros-
Better a/v
much more private
Models are always offering huge discounts
Only way to get shows from certain models

Cons-
Might get scammed, usually easy to avoid
Show won't be in your archive, oh well

There are legitimate and common reasons why models cannot do shows on schedule and then understandably develop anxiety surrounding them.

I get having to reschedule but the rest kinda just sounds like an excuse. Why is it understandable that they develop anxiety over it? How is it not completely the models own fault if she can't do what she offered and was paid for? I've never had this problem with models that I consider good or honest.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I must make one final note: I do not agree that this behavior models put on is a good one. It is damaging not only to their own careers, but the industry as a whole. However, I think members get the impression that the model needs to only pop online for thirty minutes and do a quick show, while on the model side of the fence we are plotting out a couple of hours and an entirely shifted afternoon to oblige a member for half an hour (if she only has a 5 hour window to cam before the kids get home from school, it's now either your prepaid skype or her daily goal she can choose between). I believe it is easy for members to forget that some issues, like performance anxiety, can have a huge effect on models as well. If she's stressing about being able to give you a good time, she won't want to do it at all. I think you will agree that a model doing a show with a member is hardly as routine as a plumber working on your sink. So I do understand that this type of behavior from models is not good, but I do not believe it can all be attributed to laziness, delusion, or thievery. There are legitimate and common reasons why models cannot do shows on schedule and then understandably develop anxiety surrounding them. What they do next (do the show anyway, try to compensate the member, or cut him off) is the important part.

I kinda disagree. Disagreeing with Evvie should probably be my first clue that I'm wrong but I don't see much of a difference between a plumber failing to turn up to fix someone's sink and a model failing to deliver a planned/paid for Skype show. Obviously the work is completely different, but both failings fall completely on the service provider and both are equally avoidable.

If the model only has a five hour window to cam then she shouldn't be putting herself in a position where she has to choose between a five hour shift on cam or taking a pre-arranged Skype show. It's the model's job to plan her day around the demands of her work and whatever other responsibilities she has. And for every model who has three jobs to juggle, kids to look after and who faces a daily struggle to cram everything she needs to do to make enough money to survive into her day, there's another model who has the evenings completely to herself and has nothing at all getting in the way of doing a thirty minute Skype show. I don't think members should have to second guess how angry they should be that they've paid for something that hasn't been delivered. Whether a model is very busy, or not busy at all, there's still no justification for ripping a member off.

As for performance anxiety, if this is an issue that's likely to prevent a model from doing a Skype show, then she shouldn't be accepting money up front for something that she may or may not be able to deliver on. At the very least, the member and model should have an understanding that schedules might not be kept to and the member shouldn't pay for anything unless they're happy withy that.

There are obviously legitimate reasons and unforeseen circumstances that crop up that get in the way of these things, but I don't think poor time management/taking on a bigger workload than the model can manage or issues with anxiety that were known about prior to services being promised and paid for count as either.

To go back to the plumber analogy, if you've paid for your sink to be fixed and the plumber doesn't turn up because he/she hasn't made much money that week so accepted another job that paid more than the job you'd already paid for and is now doing that instead, you'd be understandably pissed. Or if a plumber had a dodgy ankle that occassionally prevented them from doing certain jobs, but accepted money for those jobs anyway and occassionally skipped out on them as a result. I'm not comparing something like anxiety to an ankle injury, but in this analogy, both are known issues that prevent the service provider from doing certain jobs and both should be taken into account when accepting money for a service they might interfere with :twocents-02cents:

 

[Jupiter551]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I kinda disagree.

:violence-smack:

Bob's enthusiasm --> :auto-camptrailer: <-- Bob's common sense

 

[mynameisbob84]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I kinda disagree.

:violence-smack:

Bob's enthusiasm --> :auto-camptrailer: <-- Bob's common sense

Hey, one day, Evvie might be wrong about something. Granted, I've never seen it happen before but it has to happen at some point, right? Right?!?!? Hey, guys... right? :?

 

[marvelb0y]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

The model is 100% wrong in this case, no excuses. By the way, there are plenty of models who do deliver on their promises and are decent honest human beings. This one is a just a scammer, a liar and a dishonest person unworthy of respect. I dare say this might be her usual mo. Look at her stats on mycamgirls, she has only worked 22 hours in the last 6 months. And don't be fooled by her high camscore. It only takes 1 or 2 high tipping members to give a girl a 10k camscore. It doesn't mean she must be honest or doing something right to achieve such a score.

 

[Miss_Lollipop]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I didn't read evvies post as her justifying or saying that models are somehow OK with not following through or taking FOREVER to do so.. i read it as her explaining the justification that goes on in these girls heads.

This is why its a really good idea to schedule BEFORE you tip. I ask people to pm and confirm schedule availability. Some months i like to do lots of skypes, others I have my focus elsewhere.

Because MFC now says we are not allowed to actively scam members, while it may not get your tip back i do reccomend reporting her (and asking all the people who got jipped on vids to do so also)

If she gets enough complaints made they SHOULD take disciplinary action against her.

Due to my poor time management skills and .. me not really understanding how complicated it would be till i started it, it once took me 2 months to get a custom job completed. I delivered the video, and offered a full refund at the same time as I had previously agreed it would only take me 2 weeks.

In my opinion if a models legit circumstances (including "hey this is way more complicated than i realized") cause her to be unable to deliver something promptly or properly she should compensate the member properly. Like anything else.

 

[Evvie]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I kinda disagree.

:violence-smack:

Bob's enthusiasm --> :auto-camptrailer: <-- Bob's common sense

Oh, you guys... :lol:

Bob, here is what I think:

Like most issues, we make it seem much more cut and dry on forum talk than it actually is. You are probably correct in all your thoughts. I will say that failure to provide a paid skype show is not always ENTIRELY the model's fault, however.

If I said I had a reasonable explanation for why perfectly lovely models engage in this kind of behavior, I would be at a loss. In most situations, I still do believe it is something a model agrees to because she really needs the money - and she may be legitimately happy to do it at first - but once that tip is no longer counting towards her daily, weekly, or even monthly goal, delivering the product can begin to seem like a hassle or burden.

I am sure we can all agree that it is very difficult to be paid 100% through commission and then turn down commission that is technically for something you are fine with. It's all well and good to say "don't do Skype shows if you can't find the time", and it's another thing altogether to say, "well, you've been on cam for five hours, but don't take this Skype request because you don't already have pre-scheduled Skype slots, you'd best just stay on cam for another three hours or so."

I sympathize both with models and members on this issue, so I find it tough to totally agree one way or another.

 

[IsabellaSnow]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

With the plumber explanation... for someone who has never done camwork then that may seem like a legit comparison... for someone who has done camwork... erm it's completely different! There's a reason most women hate the idea of doing camwork. Doing shows is extremely personal, it's something you absolutely have to be in the mood for. If I'm not in the mood for a show, I'll be honest with you, in my opinion it can feel close to being raped. It feels... horrible. It's the same as the difference between having sex with someone you like and want to have sex with, and feeling like you're being forced or blackmailed into it.
Also, with a show, unlike with the plumber situation not getting a show for a month isn't going to seriously effect your life. It's just going to suck because you'll feel worried you're not going to ever get the product. But essentially whether you receive and enjoy the show that day or in a months time, you'll probably still enjoy it just as much. As much as a model should try and do the show with you in a timely fashion, and at least keep contact with you and make effort in arranging the show, your life isn't going to cave in. Because of this it's not always a matter of promptness.

Personally if I were to ever advertise that I'm offering skypes it would be because I have a time scheduled in for it. The reason I hate selling or offering custom videos or skypes is because I only like doing shows when I'm in the mood, I feel very uncomfortable being on Skype, even with regulars I don't feel as happy as I would on MFC, and with Skypes I always end up messing up my schedule, and spending ages in them chatting after. With Skypes or Custom videos if I'm already cam ready and can fit them into my schedule it's not so bad, it's when I have to get ready/sort my camspace out especially for them that takes ages.
I am someone who has owed custom vids and Skypes for periods of time, though I've never owed custom vids or skypes that I've advertised. I also have every intention of making videos/doing Skypes I agree on, but I also generally tell people before they pre tip if I haven't got a set arranged time that it will not be instant. I know it seems terrible, but when members try bullying me into doing shows it really messes my head up. To them it seems like excuses that I physically cannot do the show because of illness and general unfortunate circumstances, if you start getting impatient and pushy with someone who's already beating themselves up because they haven't been able to do a ton of stuff they needed to do it doesn't make them go "I really want to take my clothes off and do a show". It makes them want to put loads of layers on, curl in a ball and hide. Just a heads up to anyone who wants to jump to the "unprofessional scammer!" line.

Most camgirls are around the age of 20, don't really think of camming as a profession, very unprofessional I know, but most don't really know what they're involved in, so yeah, many of them are unprofessional, many are also doing a job that most girls can do and has easyish/short hours for a reason. They are girls who can be messed up, hormonal, emotional, disorganised, and generally a whole bunch of things that stop them from being robots. When you deal with camgirls you've kind of got to accept that part of their appeal and vice is that mostly they're real girls rather than professionals.

Saying that though... your situation sounds slightly different... For one she actually advertised it, if I ever advertise Skypes it's because I'm ready to do them pretty promptly. I think advertising something for a set amount of tokens in a room so obviously and having so little communication goes a bit further than unprofessional.
She doesn't cam much, I don't know why, but it could be for a whole bunch of reasons. Bear in mind she could have been very ill, or could have had some bad life problems going on. It sounds far fetched but everyone's lives are different. Honestly if I were you I'd hold out a little longer before screaming "Scammer!!", she's been on cam once since you bought the show, you also don't know if the other members were bullshitting you about not receiving vids. As for pm's, if she has countless guys sending her loads of pm's then it is easy to get lost in the crowd.
It may be a scam of a sort, maybe she just doesn't want to do the show, or maybe she has genuine reasons for not doing the show. She is in the wrong, and I am sorry you've spent money and have had this happen to you.

I don't condone models scamming, I do think there are certain situations that sometimes arise where custom vids and skypes don't get delivered on time that aren't necessarily the models fault. But I also think if this happens the model should keep contact with the member if she can. I very much doubt you'll get your tokens back so I'd potentially report it to MFC, but in the meantime I wouldn't jump the gun and start accusing the model of anything. If you do that you will never get your show. It's not that necessarily you become the bad guy, you just become the guy that she will never want to be alone with, let alone perform a show for. I'd just keep your cool and keep the contact. Try not to be passive aggressive.

 

[Miss_Lollipop]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

 

[Sevrin]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

Is there a mechanism for models to refund tokens to member?

 

[JordanBlack]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

Is there a mechanism for models to refund tokens to member?

Through the model's premium account.

 

[AmberCutie]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

Is there a mechanism for models to refund tokens to member?

Through the model's premium account.

The cost of the model's premium tokens don't equal the amount she received though, it gets hairy.

 

[Evvie]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

Is there a mechanism for models to refund tokens to member?

Most models I know that refund do it by offering other services equal to the value of tokens... for example, 1400 tokens worth of videos and other, non-skype services. However, actually refunding the tokens will mean she spends 2x-ish the amount as he spent on her and most models I don't think would prefer to do that.

 

[JordanBlack]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

Is there a mechanism for models to refund tokens to member?

Through the model's premium account.

The cost of the model's premium tokens don't equal the amount she received though, it gets hairy.

I'm quite aware of that, yet I had to resort one time at buying tokens and re-funding a member for a Skype show that I thought I honoured, but I did not.

It was an annoying situation I wanted to get out, because that said person got mad because I dared to check my Skype's archive and I did not take his word on it. He made such a fuss about it and told me he doesn't want the show anymore and I could keep the tokens he paid. I felt like shite and I just bought tokens and refunded him. Seriously felt better afterwards even though I came up short, after he made me cry just for the simple fact I dared to check how many shows I honoured.

But as sure I wouldn't recommend it to any other camgirl. I just said it's a way of doing it.

The other way is for a model to email an admin, explain the situation and hope they'll approve a refund back to the member.

 

[yossarian]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

The more I read the replies in this thread (and it's really interesting and informative), the more I'm convinced that cam sites are, from a consumer perspective, basically a recipe for disaster. The average model is in her early 20s, it seems. I've worked with people that age for almost 20 years. Many of them have their heads on straight, are responsible and mature--but many more are total fuckheads. So you put people that age, many of whom lack the maturity and responsibility to handle a business, in a situation where enormous amounts of money are changing hands and there are zero consequences for not following through on your business transactions, and it is a rather consumer-unfriendly environment.

This might not seem like a bad deal from a model's perspective, but consider: would you be able to make a living solely from your regulars? Some models can, for sure, but I bet a lot of them would not be able to. Those tips for contests, fan clubs, skype addresses, and video sales from random guys add up. I regularly visit maybe four models, tops, and there are maybe five or six more I visit occasionally. I trust the ones who know me by name, and whom I talk to often, to follow through on their promises. They always have, and I've never been scammed. But I'd be very leery of giving a large number of tokens to almost anyone else, because I'm always hearing of these kinds of things happening. If I don't know you, I'm not tipping you 300 tokens for a video. And there are only so many hours in the day to develop a rapport with people to the point where you trust them. So, as Great White said before they burned down that club...once bitten, twice shy. A member who has been scammed, or who has HEARD of scams again and again, might be reticent to dole out large amounts for ANY model, even a good one. You're all losing out when this happens.

And from what I've read, I don't think this model is necessarily a "scammer." I don't think she set out to deceive the OP. But she IS guilty of being a shitty businesswoman, and that has the same effect as if she had intentionally taken his money without planning to give him what he paid for. He's angry, he's going to tell other members, and they're going to file it away and use it against her and other models in the future. Everyone loses.

 

[Greggory]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I really wish folks would not use a particular nationality as a "token" of some meaning. Romanians, Hungarians, Slovakians, Americans, Canadians, et al, are all individuals and it's not fair to group humans into a "scammer box" because of their nationality, or any other grouping. It's not necessary; why not group them like "and other scammers" rather than ethnicity?

Fully agreed, the nicest model I ever met was from Romania...she would even ban me if I tipped her to much in one day (Quite serious though)

Can someone explain to me why so many people opt for Skype shows? It seems like every week someone runs to ACF to tell us they got scammed out of a Skype show.

Please help me fill out this Pros/Cons sheet so I can fully understand this portion of the MFC economy.

Pros
- Much Better Video Quality

Cons
- Won't Actually Happen

If you know the model well enough you can minimize the con. I mean you mentioned the biggest Pro, the video quality. Even if it means tipping 90 tokens a min I would much rather skype over mfc true privates

 

[IsabellaSnow]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

This is where it becomes a grey area though, if a model sells a show saying "I will do this immediately" and doesn't do it immediately, then she sold the show under false pretences. It is up to her to make up for it as soon as possible. If someone tips a model saying "this is to go to Skype/a custom video", without asking if they're ok with doing a skype, or when they're free, and expects them to make time for the show, as much as I'd be appreciative of the tokens and will do the show, I would have never once said that I would do the show, it is entirely in the members assumption. I had bad fights with one of my regulars when he first came to my room because he tipped me for a skype without pre arranging them, after I'd decided never to do Skypes again, I then promptly got ill for two weeks straight. During that time on many occasions he was extremely pushy and demanding, seeing as I was barely able to stand up at the time it put me in a really awkward situation.
This isn't relevant to the situation at hand, as the model was clearly advertising the Skypes, so I don't think she has much of an excuse, and she hasn't given one as far as I can tell, or even given a full apology. But it does happen a lot where members tip and expect instant gratification. If someone say paid someone to paint them a picture, the picture would take time, not only that but the person wouldn't spend every second of the day on it, so it'd be assumed that it'd take around a month to be completed, even though the actual picture would have taken a lot less time to make. If the artist never gave the picture, or any implication of giving the picture, then the person who paid should get a refund, but if the person painting the picture just hadn't completed it, especially when there was no set deadline, then it would be unfair to accuse them of stealing.

For me camming is different to other trades. When someone asks me to do anything non camming related I'm pretty quick at getting it done because it doesn't give me emotional strain. But, I am an extremely unprofessional camgirl. As much as I cam for income, and I'd never scam anyone or intentionally rip them off, it is not my career. Sex is my favourite thing in the world, I want to enjoy it the way it was supposed to be enjoyed, which is mutual. For me no money is worth changing that. There are some very professional camgirls on this forum, and I admire them ridiculously, they do what I cannot do, and are very successful because of it. I have a feeling though, that there are more camgirls in the world who take an unprofessional approach than professional, even if they try the other way.

Personally I think as a rule, always arrange the show before you tip the model. If she's not willing to arrange it then it should be red flags that she's not going to do it promptly, or she doesn't trust you enough, and if she doesn't trust you enough to plan a skype, then you should probably get to know her better before going off site with her. Then maybe if she does have a hiccup you won't be worried about her scamming you.

 

[rwesmill]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Well. Another day, another no pm return.

Although, it seems like I missed her today. She 'promised' she'd be on from 3pm to 8pm, yet only appeared to be on for about half an hour from 1 to 1:30. Logged in at 2 and still no replies to my pm's. Didn't expect any, either.

I'm convinced the girl is just a flat out scammer looking for quick bucks before the quarterly payouts (I've checked her cam stats myself and her 3 to 4 logins each month seem to be right before the 15th and the 30-31st).

I'm pretty much done with all this, and it's left a very sour taste in my mouth, to put it very lightly. Will be sending a thorough email with screenshots to mfc support. They've actually been really good to me in the past, and fully refunded token amounts back to my credit card when I purchased more than my wallet could swallow (bad financial times). However, this scam situation is a much different story.

Will report back on my success, or lack thereof...thanks to all for the replies!

 

[marvelb0y]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

With the plumber explanation... for someone who has never done camwork then that may seem like a legit comparison... for someone who has done camwork... erm it's completely different! There's a reason most women hate the idea of doing camwork. Doing shows is extremely personal, it's something you absolutely have to be in the mood for. If I'm not in the mood for a show, I'll be honest with you, in my opinion it can feel close to being raped. It feels... horrible. It's the same as the difference between having sex with someone you like and want to have sex with, and feeling like you're being forced or blackmailed into it.
Also, with a show, unlike with the plumber situation not getting a show for a month isn't going to seriously effect your life. It's just going to suck because you'll feel worried you're not going to ever get the product. But essentially whether you receive and enjoy the show that day or in a months time, you'll probably still enjoy it just as much. As much as a model should try and do the show with you in a timely fashion, and at least keep contact with you and make effort in arranging the show, your life isn't going to cave in. Because of this it's not always a matter of promptness.

Personally if I were to ever advertise that I'm offering skypes it would be because I have a time scheduled in for it. The reason I hate selling or offering custom videos or skypes is because I only like doing shows when I'm in the mood, I feel very uncomfortable being on Skype, even with regulars I don't feel as happy as I would on MFC, and with Skypes I always end up messing up my schedule, and spending ages in them chatting after. With Skypes or Custom videos if I'm already cam ready and can fit them into my schedule it's not so bad, it's when I have to get ready/sort my camspace out especially for them that takes ages.
I am someone who has owed custom vids and Skypes for periods of time, though I've never owed custom vids or skypes that I've advertised. I also have every intention of making videos/doing Skypes I agree on, but I also generally tell people before they pre tip if I haven't got a set arranged time that it will not be instant. I know it seems terrible, but when members try bullying me into doing shows it really messes my head up. To them it seems like excuses that I physically cannot do the show because of illness and general unfortunate circumstances, if you start getting impatient and pushy with someone who's already beating themselves up because they haven't been able to do a ton of stuff they needed to do it doesn't make them go "I really want to take my clothes off and do a show". It makes them want to put loads of layers on, curl in a ball and hide. Just a heads up to anyone who wants to jump to the "unprofessional scammer!" line.

Most camgirls are around the age of 20, don't really think of camming as a profession, very unprofessional I know, but most don't really know what they're involved in, so yeah, many of them are unprofessional, many are also doing a job that most girls can do and has easyish/short hours for a reason. They are girls who can be messed up, hormonal, emotional, disorganised, and generally a whole bunch of things that stop them from being robots. When you deal with camgirls you've kind of got to accept that part of their appeal and vice is that mostly they're real girls rather than professionals.

Saying that though... your situation sounds slightly different... For one she actually advertised it, if I ever advertise Skypes it's because I'm ready to do them pretty promptly. I think advertising something for a set amount of tokens in a room so obviously and having so little communication goes a bit further than unprofessional.
She doesn't cam much, I don't know why, but it could be for a whole bunch of reasons. Bear in mind she could have been very ill, or could have had some bad life problems going on. It sounds far fetched but everyone's lives are different. Honestly if I were you I'd hold out a little longer before screaming "Scammer!!", she's been on cam once since you bought the show, you also don't know if the other members were bullshitting you about not receiving vids. As for pm's, if she has countless guys sending her loads of pm's then it is easy to get lost in the crowd.
It may be a scam of a sort, maybe she just doesn't want to do the show, or maybe she has genuine reasons for not doing the show. She is in the wrong, and I am sorry you've spent money and have had this happen to you.

I don't condone models scamming, I do think there are certain situations that sometimes arise where custom vids and skypes don't get delivered on time that aren't necessarily the models fault. But I also think if this happens the model should keep contact with the member if she can. I very much doubt you'll get your tokens back so I'd potentially report it to MFC, but in the meantime I wouldn't jump the gun and start accusing the model of anything. If you do that you will never get your show. It's not that necessarily you become the bad guy, you just become the guy that she will never want to be alone with, let alone perform a show for. I'd just keep your cool and keep the contact. Try not to be passive aggressive.

Look, working on cam is hard but let's not exaggerate. And yes, a lot of models are young and in their 20s. But to put things in perspective, I was in a warzone at 19. And if you feel like you are being raped any time during your job, then you are in the wrong line of work. Noone is saying models should automatically act professionally when they first start. Everyone has a learning curve. However, to hide behind your age or lack of maturity or current mood is just excuses. It's called growing up and learning how to be responsible. If a model wants to indulge in scam like behavior, she deserves whatever consequences she has coming to her.

 

[yossarian]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Honestly, I just think... it is the same as any profession/service.

If you screw up for a legit reason (including NOT BEING in the mood... which is a legit reason when we sell sex) you refund. Completely.

I know its not the 'done' thing on mfc.. but..yeah. if you CANNOT provide the service agreed upon, for whatever reason ... you give the guy his money back.

This is where it becomes a grey area though, if a model sells a show saying "I will do this immediately" and doesn't do it immediately, then she sold the show under false pretences. It is up to her to make up for it as soon as possible. If someone tips a model saying "this is to go to Skype/a custom video", without asking if they're ok with doing a skype, or when they're free, and expects them to make time for the show, as much as I'd be appreciative of the tokens and will do the show, I would have never once said that I would do the show, it is entirely in the members assumption. I had bad fights with one of my regulars when he first came to my room because he tipped me for a skype without pre arranging them, after I'd decided never to do Skypes again, I then promptly got ill for two weeks straight. During that time on many occasions he was extremely pushy and demanding, seeing as I was barely able to stand up at the time it put me in a really awkward situation.
This isn't relevant to the situation at hand, as the model was clearly advertising the Skypes, so I don't think she has much of an excuse, and she hasn't given one as far as I can tell, or even given a full apology. But it does happen a lot where members tip and expect instant gratification. If someone say paid someone to paint them a picture, the picture would take time, not only that but the person wouldn't spend every second of the day on it, so it'd be assumed that it'd take around a month to be completed, even though the actual picture would have taken a lot less time to make. If the artist never gave the picture, or any implication of giving the picture, then the person who paid should get a refund, but if the person painting the picture just hadn't completed it, especially when there was no set deadline, then it would be unfair to accuse them of stealing.

For me camming is different to other trades. When someone asks me to do anything non camming related I'm pretty quick at getting it done because it doesn't give me emotional strain. But, I am an extremely unprofessional camgirl. As much as I cam for income, and I'd never scam anyone or intentionally rip them off, it is not my career. Sex is my favourite thing in the world, I want to enjoy it the way it was supposed to be enjoyed, which is mutual. For me no money is worth changing that. There are some very professional camgirls on this forum, and I admire them ridiculously, they do what I cannot do, and are very successful because of it. I have a feeling though, that there are more camgirls in the world who take an unprofessional approach than professional, even if they try the other way.

Personally I think as a rule, always arrange the show before you tip the model. If she's not willing to arrange it then it should be red flags that she's not going to do it promptly, or she doesn't trust you enough, and if she doesn't trust you enough to plan a skype, then you should probably get to know her better before going off site with her. Then maybe if she does have a hiccup you won't be worried about her scamming you.

I like your painter analogy better than my plumber analogy. :thumbleft:

Maybe to avoid confusion, a model might put some language on her profile that says "If you tip me for something I didn't advertise without asking me first, I reserve the right not to do it and no refund will be provided." I've seen similar language in contests (like for custom videos, for example), and it seems like a good way to protect the model in the event of an overzealous tipper like that. Nobody should be forced to do something they don't want to do, and again it might just be a lack of communication that is causing the issue.

It might be nice to have something special set aside too--like a special video that can't be purchased and is only available to members who tipped for something that ultimately can't be delivered. Some members (like the one you mentioned) probably would be pissy about it, but I think most would consider it a gesture of goodwill and appreciate it.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I will say that failure to provide a paid skype show is not always ENTIRELY the model's fault, however.

Well, whose fault is it? The members for asking for what he paid for? I can't really see any situation where it's not completely on the model.

 

[Kradek]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Maybe to avoid confusion, a model might put some language on her profile that says "If you tip me for something I didn't advertise without asking me first, I reserve the right not to do it and no refund will be provided."

This message brought to you by the same folks that put "do not ingest" on rat poison.

At some point you just have to accept that stupid people are stupid.

 

[IsabellaSnow]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

I'm pretty much done with all this, and it's left a very sour taste in my mouth, to put it very lightly. Will be sending a thorough email with screenshots to mfc support. They've actually been really good to me in the past, and fully refunded token amounts back to my credit card when I purchased more than my wallet could swallow (bad financial times). However, this scam situation is a much different story.

MFC refunded money on tokens you'd purchased? I didn't realise they even did that. I'm guessing though that you didn't tip them to anyone.

I don't think this sounds like full on scammer behaviour. It sounds like someone who spends very little time working on myfreecams, sold a skype show, now doesn't have time for the show and is probably avoiding answering until she has time. Or you said something that upset her and she's avoiding that. I don't know. Hard to tell.
Do you know anything about her real life? Does she have a regular job? A family? things to do etc. If you're a camgirl who works full time elsewhere and cams for extra money, then your time available for doing anything camming related is more limited. I'd be more wary of someone who sold a skype show yet cammed every single day for a month and didn't do the skype. That she's not camming... I don't know, maybe there's more to it. But I guess I just want to believe the best in people. Ultimately though I still think you should contact MFC about it. The way she's acted about this is not cool.

Look, working on cam is hard but let's not exaggerate. And yes, a lot of models are young and in their 20s. But to put things in perspective, I was in a warzone at 19. And if you feel like you are being raped any time during your job, then you are in the wrong line of work. Noone is saying models should automatically act professionally when they first start. Everyone has a learning curve. However, to hide behind your age or lack of maturity or current mood is just excuses. It's called growing up and learning how to be responsible. If a model wants to indulge in scam like behavior, she deserves whatever consequences she has coming to her.

I don't think you being in a warzone at 19 is perspective at all. There are people who are around 20 who are in seriously dire circumstances, it's not remotely relevant. People get put through tough situations all the time. Everyone has their own tough situations and challenges, it's not fair nor reasonable to try comparing them.
I also said I don't do shows when I don't want to, so no I do not feel like I'm being raped while I do my job. I have done shows in the past where I've felt very pressured into it and not at all comfortable though. Feeling forced to do a show, even if it's emotional rather than physical is not cool, and yes the feeling can make you feel pretty violated. Which is exactly why I do not subject myself to that. It's also why I don't advertise Skypes/custom vids on my profile, and when people ask me about them I try and deter them and let them know that I take my time. I've never not produced a video or Skype, but because of the way I see sex/sexual acts, I cannot do them at any time. It's the same reason I will turn down private shows and not always do cumshows. I cannot switch it on and off.
Fact is, someone could tell me to do something at work in a normal job. They could tell me off for not doing it and I would do it immediately. That would be growing up and being responsible. Whatever someone's job is, growing up and being responsible isn't doing sex acts whenever someone demands it of you. If I physically cannot do something, then I'm not going to force myself to please someone's penis, however much money they throw at me. I also hope that on some level whoever's paying for a show/custom would care about the model enjoying the show too.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

With the plumber explanation... for someone who has never done camwork then that may seem like a legit comparison... for someone who has done camwork... erm it's completely different! There's a reason most women hate the idea of doing camwork. Doing shows is extremely personal, it's something you absolutely have to be in the mood for. If I'm not in the mood for a show, I'll be honest with you, in my opinion it can feel close to being raped. It feels... horrible. It's the same as the difference between having sex with someone you like and want to have sex with, and feeling like you're being forced or blackmailed into it.

It's not that there aren't legitimate reasons a cam girl might not want to/be able to follow through with a scheduled Skype, just that those reasons don't justify taking a customer's money and giving them nothing in return. There should be complete transparency throughout the entire transaction. If a model isn't in the right frame of mind to offer a Skype show, they shouldn't be advertised, at least not without the disclaimer that rescheduling the Skype is a possibility. And if it can't be rescheduled, the member should be reimbursed, either getting their tokens back or content to the value of whatever they paid for the Skype.

Re: the "feeling like rape" thing, I'd sincerely hope that's not the case. The key difference I see between doing a Skype show you don't really want to and being raped is that in the latter instance, you have no say in the matter and you're physically forced to do something you don't want to; whereas in the former, you always, always have the choice of ending it whenever you want to, or not doing it at all. Which is a choice rape victims sadly don't have. I would hope that if a cam model felt violated by private shows to the extent that they'd compare it to being raped, they simply wouldn't do them. The average MFC member might be an idiot, but I don't think they're monsters. If they thought that a model was gonna have to go through extreme emotional turmoil just so they can bust a nut, they wouldn't visit the site at all. I know I wouldn't :twocents-02cents:

 

[rwesmill]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Yep, MFC does refund tokens fully to your credit card, so long as it's the same amount you had when you initially made your purchase.


Okay, here are a few points I think that need to be noted in this situation. And trust me, I'm usually the most understanding and first guy to give someone the benefit of the doubt.

1) she is well into her 30's, and has been in the adult industry and camming for over a decade. She started with her own popular website (of the same name), which; ironically, was one of the reasons why I spent many a days in my college dormitory fapping instead of preparing for a double integrals midterm. Seeing her on mfc was like instant 'u nostalgia u rose' gratification for my adolescent years.
But she's definitely not 'new' to this, and far past her early 20's and the ever-so-convincing "you know it's my first time, big boy *batting eyelashes*" retort.

2) To anyone who's checked her recent 'shows,' it's comprised of nothing but the following:

-Constant barrage of token nagging. Like literally, every 10 seconds it's 'oh my god you guys don't love me nobody's tipped in the last 5 seconds, don't you want to get me naked?' She wasn't so much like this in her early mfc days, but it appears her patience and tolerance for actually 'interacting' with paying members are long gone.

- Her 'special offers.' This is the hook. She'll offer her 'limited time' friend add + videos sent to your email + another bonus thing for 75 tokens. You'll see that this is where the majority of her session tips stem from, and they roll in quick. Then she promises to 'send out all bonuses AFTER she gets off cam, right before she logs off.' BUT WAIT, THERE'S MORE! *shamwow guy*

Here's where I got taken. Seems like every time she's on cam now she stares at her cumulative session totals and grinds the numbers in that little head of hers to see if she's reached her quota...then she offers a 'one day special deal.' In my case, it was discounted skype show sessions. I got taken. Yes, she explicitly offered the skype sessions for a special advertised price. The funny thing is, BEFORE I tipped for the skype, I actually pm'd her (have been on her friends list for months) and asked her small questions about the skype, and she was totally cool and obliged. However, AFTER I tipped, not a single response. Ever. Communication completely ceased.

Yesterday, her offer was 'okay guys...the highest tip today will get special pictures emailed to them...come on boys who wants it?' Then someone tipped 600. Would be VERY surprised if he gets them.


Offering goods or services without delivering (regardless of your personal excuse) or at least offering your customer a refund or alternative substitute of equal value...is...scamming. I don't think it can get any more black and white than that. She knows what she's offered, she KNOWS I've been pm'ing her and willfully avoiding me, and she KNOWS she has no intention to follow through with what she offered. Its simply a spur of the moment lure scheme to get big fish to bite. Nothing more, nothing less.

The thing that really, really infuriated me is that I have even TIPPED her TWICE since the 1400 tip with public tips with attached tip notes stating the situation (to kind of put her on blast) and each time she says 'oh my god I'm soooo sorry I promise i'm not ignoring you I'll reply before I get off!!' and she never does. But I do it in the most kiss-ass, white knight suit n' tie way possible, so as to appear I'm completely understanding and aware of her recent bout of strep throat and her grandma getting rain over by a reindeer. Add to the fact that I tell her to PM ME NOW PLEASE SO YOU WON'T FORGET, and she brushes it off and goes right back to begging for tokens for her public strip show, and it's simply a no-win situation.

Thus, it's the end of the road...and there's no point in trying. Can't force a 'girl' (I won't even address her as a woman, as she hasn't seem to developed into one yet) to do what she doesn't want to, even if she promises to do it.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Re: INFURIATED, feel I'm being scammed on a 1400 token skype

Offering goods or services without delivering (regardless of your personal excuse) or at least offering your customer a refund or alternative substitute of equal value...is...scamming. I don't think it can get any more black and white than that. She knows what she's offered, she KNOWS I've been pm'ing her and willfully avoiding me, and she KNOWS she has no intention to follow through with what she offered. Its simply a spur of the moment lure scheme to get big fish to bite. Nothing more, nothing less.

Agreed. Has nothing to do with anxiety or any other made up excuses. Just a lazy scammer being lazy.