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Happy International Men's Day!

Discussion in 'Random Chat' started by AudriTwo, Nov 19, 2018.

  1. AudriTwo

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    IMG_20181119_173328.jpg

    Know how loved and appreciated you guys are. Please use this day to focus or direct toward self care. If you are feeling sad or anger, please find someone you can reach out to, your family, partners brohams, therapist. You and your feelings matter :h:
     
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  2. ForceTen

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    This is a thing? Seems like too many are busy putting men down, making them the cause of most of the world's problems, etc.
     
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  3. justjoinedtopost

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    It's from the UN.
     
  4. AudriTwo

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    Way to bring it down, and focusing on bigotry, man. lol.

    It actually wasn't bad this year. More spreading awareness to men's mental health and other male issues than bashing men. Which I hope every dude here are taking theirs seriously. :)
     
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  5. ForceTen

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    Not everything from the UN, or WHO, is bad. I was just questioning it for the reasons specified.

    My apologies, I didn't mean to bring it down. It was a legitimate question, and comment, because it seems that if you're not part of a special interest group (anything other than white, heterosexual male), you're either ignored or trash. Thus, why it seemed surprising that there's even a day for this.
     
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  6. AudriTwo

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    It's all good, I understand. :h:

    Last was a misandric mess. This year has vastly improved. I think certain groups of people are starting to grow and are able to look at both gender and other issues without blame. It's exciting. But there will always hateful assholes. :)
     
  7. DivaTraffic

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    Great day to be a man :) Men's right are also important, but not often talked about.
    The documentary "The Red Pill" was great on this topic.
     
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  8. Gen

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    For anyone who’s interested in men’s rights but is put off by MRA’s, I highly recommend the subreddit r/MensLib. I think I’ve posted about it before but I love it. They have some really great discussions about men’s issues, masculinity, gender roles, etc and I’ve learned a lot from reading there.
     
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  9. IsabellaSnow

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    I imagine the point is to raise awareness that while yes, being straight, white and male does statistically put you at less risk for a lot of issues, it's not 100%. It's easy for people to focus on say, significantly higher domestic violence/homicides against women by male partners/ex partners and then either ignore or miss the 30% of domestic violence incidences which affect males, 20% of which by females. Being male does not make you safe of exempt from issues and it's important to recognise that. Having looked into the statistics for a fair amount of these issues, the posted stats look higher than everywhere I've looked at, but these issues are still very real and affect huge amounts of men. Raising awareness of gender issues is important no matter what gender you are. Unfortunately there are a bunch of "men's rights" groups which in my opinion cause more damage to the movement of raising awareness to men's issues than good due to their barely veiled bigotry, but this does not mean that people should avoid any push forwards for understanding the issues men go through and encouraging men to seek help for the issues they face. By having days like this with both men and women openly supporting it, perhaps more men seeking support will be less inclined to turn to more extreme groups.

    I also think that you should be careful to not judge everyone on their opinions on men by a few more aggressive subgroups, just like I am sure that you do not wish to be judged by some of the actions of men, I imagine most people, including myself, don't appreciate themselves and the world to be judged as hating straight white males. There are almost certainly far more women who do wish to support both the men in our lives and those elsewhere in the world if given the right opportunities, if you strolled off the internet more often you might find that for most straight white males, they're not all ignored and treated like trash. I think it is a sad day when the reaction to something compassionate is to attack and question those showing said compassion. It worries me immensely that things have got this far and highlights more need for days such as international men's day.
     
  10. ForceTen

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    Interesting movie. While I agree with a lot of what the supporters of the MRA are raising issues on, I do not associate myself with them, MGTOW or any other group.

    She's really only touching the surface of many, many different issues.

    Cassie's ending statement of "I don't know where I'm headed. But, I know what I've left behind. I no longer call myself a feminist."

    The simple, and short answer is "You're becoming a humanist." Meaning, one no longer sees issues specifically as men vs women, gays vs hetero, atheism vs Christianity, skin color, etc. One fights for the rights of everyone, and casts aside any reference to a group, label or denomination.

    However, getting there isn't so short and easy.
     
  11. ForceTen

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    You're completely misconstruing my point, and you're making false assumptions that I'm basing this solely being on the internet. Nor was my post being an attack on what Audri posted for being areal thing. If you think it was, then perhaps you need to take a step back and look at it again instead of assuming something.
     
    #11 ForceTen, Nov 21, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2018
  12. IsabellaSnow

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    I never said solely and I am sorry if it came across that I was being rude to you. My point was that a lot of the big discussions which make straight white males the butt of jokes or appear like the bad guys (whether this is people saying this or men stating that this will happen) are happening due to online and media influences. If you remove those aspects most straight white dudes are not as a general rule being consistently made out to be evil. I live in possibly the most sensitive liberal snowflake city at the moment and even here it's not that bad. I just focused on your choice of words, which may have come across the wrong way, but I feel it's not a healthy form of wording to spread around, especially not in light of discussing a movement which is opposing those viewpoints.
     
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  13. justjoinedtopost

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    My very own international day, where I can reflect on being mentally ill and my toxic masculinity, and get encouraged to seek help because people 'love' me , and my very own set of victimhood statistics too! Gosh, I'm so glad my awareness has been raised above all that nasty misandry floating around out there!
     
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  14. ForceTen

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    Generalizations are bad and that was not my intention as I was thinking about many specific circumstances and how it goes against this Men's day event. I have seen many times in person as well as personal accounts from others I know and trust, where simply being a straight white man has been denegrated, punished, and attacked without merit. Not to mention put into a severe disadvantage for jobs, education, etc.. For example, if you watched the video that was talked about "The Red Pill", you'd see and understand some of the points I'm thinking of.

    I disagree with your comments about "it's not healthy to talk about". In fact, it's a very healthy topic to bring up because it's but a small part of a broader issue: Why do special interest groups feel that it's okay to shun, belittle, and harrass others for speaking their mind and fighting for equal rights? When they demand the same thing? For example, why is it okay for there to be groups, parades, demonstrations, etc. for LGBT, people of colour, women, etc and use those labels to define their group/organization? Yet, if straight white men do it, they're labeled as hate groups, mysogenists, racists, Nazis, etc? I'm not even talking about internet or media here. I'm talking about in the work place, or even if it's a small local event that's attempting to be organized that isn't about hate/negative views in any way shape or form, word gets spread or it's shot down immediately.

    See my point? Refer to post #10 in this thread where I talk about the movie, and her closing statement. That is the broader picture I'm after.
     
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  15. IsabellaSnow

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    Having watched that "documentary" and followed the hype of it while it was being made, and also having done my research into the people she interviewed in that movie, I don't think that it is in any way, shape or form a good representation of men's rights. In the movie they come across as just nice guys wanting to address certain issues, which is perfectly reasonable, yet if you look into it you'll see a whole load of horrific things they say about women. And when I say horrific, I mean horrific. Also certain incidences of supporting abusive men to abduct children during custody cases and generally a bunch of stuff that has no place in a men's rights conversation. I have wondered before if the whole hype about a woman making that documentary and her being "boycotted" by feminists was a publicity stunt. I think be careful about what you believe from that documentary, it is not an accurate or non biased account of the issues that are faced by men. This is unfortunately why people are often very quick to jump on white males as hate groups, because unfortunately, a bunch of the loudest anti-women hate groups pose themselves as MRA's, when really they don't actually seem that interested in solving a lot of the very genuine issues which men face.

    I also did not say it's not healthy to talk about the impact on many straight, white men's feelings in today's culture where feminist, lgbtq and anti-racist issues are being vocalised so strongly and it is often coming out that straight, white men are the benefactors or even the instigators of such issues. I said that I do not think the wording you used was a healthy way to discuss the topic, which is rather than addressing the issue, jumping straight onto a "everyone hates white men". The reason I feel that's unhealthy is because it encourages an "us and them" attitude and it makes men the victims of other groups trying to discuss the issues they've faced. It's important now more than ever not only for liberal rights groups to ensure they do not place blame on all men and recognise that many of these issues are shared at least to some extent by males, sometimes with men having their own separate issues, but also for straight, white men to try and resist taking these things personally. I understand that for a male who has never sexually harassed a female, who has never felt in any way advantaged by society and has only respected and supported female friends and coworkers, that being talked to like you're automatically a sexist sex offender is extremely insulting. Especially if you have not directly seen some of the common sexual harassment and sexism which women face at the hands of the minority of dudes who take part in that behaviour, it must feel pretty targeting and uncalled for. No one likes being blamed for something they haven't done.

    This is unfortunately very true. It actually happened for a international men's day event at a UK uni. I don't know exactly what happened, but I think basically it was mentioned that more females were hired at the university which could make men feel disadvantaged. People then kicked off and pointed out that the majority of people in high positions at the university were men and the females were in lower paid, secretarial jobs. Anyway they took back the plans for the day. Personally I think it was ridiculous that they shut this down and that in the end it actually creates more of a division between men and women. I can understand the point if you remove individuality and look at gender as a collective, it'd be like one person playing a game and complaining that their opponent held more chips than them, even though their chips were of higher value and actually made up more as a result. But people aren't a collective, we're individuals. Just because some men are doing very well does not mean that we should ignore the problems of other men. I think it also focused on one particular point made by someone within the university and completely ignored all the other topics which should be talked about.

    Personally I would like more open discussions about the statistically realities of the dangers which men might face in their lives. There are a lot of myths in terms of the disadvantages men face which many MRA's seem to focus on which a small amount of reading shows to not be true, while more dangerous realities keep getting overlooked. If no one is allowed to discuss these topics then how is anyone going to gather the correct information and know how to put the right support processes in place? And surely if more men and women recognise their issues are shared, it'd create more empathy and acceptance between sexes and maybe even reduce say domestic violence or rape for both genders.

    I do think it's worrying how some liberal groups are going, and I have seen some young people more recently being particularly cliquey in lgbtq groups to the point that even many gay/bisexuals no longer feel welcome or connected to those networks. I have seen these groups being particularly distant, isolating and even rude to straight, white males. This is an issue with people getting carried away, though I will also say, I prefer the attitudes of straight white males of that generation to my own. There is a small generation gap from when I was a teenager growing up to when the 3rd wave feminist movement really kicked off, and while I can see the negatives of the over reaction which is happening right now, I also see far more positives in the way that young men and women are communicating. So I don't know, maybe in the end it will be beneficial to everyone once the adaptation period is over and people find level ground.
     
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  16. BobbyLeStrange

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    Wow, thanks for the reminder!
    I only thought I was part of the world's biggest problem lately :eek:
     
  17. Lilglitterfox

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    Happy Belated International Men's Day from a new member. :)
     
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  18. eyeteach

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    I missed it! I was busy doing other stuff and had no idea there was a day directed to the utero-unabled such as myself. Were we supposed to get cake? Cuz I really, really, really want cake! :)
     

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