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Marijuana users must turn in their weapons within 30 days

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I have been waiting to see how the goosestepping fascist frauds at the NRA field this one.

I think we need to apply this to consumers of alcohol too...
 
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But if the police chief believes this, the federal prosecutor still has to issue warrants or write up federal charges for the legal state marijuana users before the police can request the confiscation of firearms (you aren't a breaking the law till formally charged by the government).

I would be like if a cop wrote the expired meter ticket before your meter expired because he knows you're out of quarters and doesn't want to wait till the meter actually expires.
 
lol well that's fucking unconstitutional af. medical marijuana is legal too... so anyone who is prescribed pain killers need to turn in their guns.
 
First thing I do when getting pulled over is to make sure the officers see my hands showing I'm not a threat.

That's not a racial thing, it's not demeaning, it's common sense afaic.


I agree that that's the wise thing to do when pulled over, but wasn't Philando actually reaching for his driver's license (like he was asked to do) when that idiot cop decided to shoot him five or more times? I refuse to watch/listen to that video clip anymore, btw. It's horrifying.
 
Why should the NRA get involved with that?

First thing I do when getting pulled over is to make sure the officers see my hands showing I'm not a threat.

That's not a racial thing, it's not demeaning, it's common sense afaic.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/d...didnt-defend-philando-castile/article/2631154
But Dana Loesch, a spokeswoman for the NRA, said there were other factors that have to be considered in the case.

"He was also in possession of a controlled substance and a firearm simultaneously, which is illegal. Stop lying," Loesch said on Twitter early Thursday.
Loesch pointed out in her Thursday tweet that Castile was breaking the law by having a controlled substance in his possession at the time of the shooting. According to a memo filed during Yanez's case by his attorneys, Castile was a regular marijuana user and had high levels of THC in his system when he died.

According to the memo, Castile lied on his application for his firearm permit by denying he was "unlawful user of any controlled substance." It is a felony to be in possession of a controlled substance while armed with a firearm, even if lawfully in possession of the gun.

Yanez testified that the car smelled like marijuana when he pulled Castile over, and later on, Castile's fiancé Diamond Reynolds told police they had smoked marijuana before being pulled over, and had the drug in their car.
Marijuana Boce, marijuana.

Let me tell you about my bro. He did a year (in the great state of Alabama no less) locked up for marijuana possession, no gun involved. Fun stories, that guy; told me about some guy that was getting gangfucked, and how the room smelled so bad of shit he wanted to puke. So go tell your buddy with ms it could be worse, he could be getting fucked up the ass courtesy of this tyrannical government. And not for a gun, mind you; just for possession. Oh you poor 2nd amendment martyrs!!!

This is a real bone of contention with me. People I used to shoot with, people that I worked with, way back when...I disagreed with them when this goddamned war on drugs started heating up; but all those good little patriots were watching the train conductor anti-marijuana ads right along with me, and they were eager for government to protect us.

So like your little poster-girl Loesch says, it's illegal; let your bro be a good little bootlicker and obey the goddam law if he wants a fucking gun.
 
in MN, marijuana is only legal if you have a medically approved need for it. Even then, it is a controlled substance and should follow suit to that similar of alcohol. Meaning, can't be under the influence of it, and at measurement level of .04 or below (yes, I know THC is measured differently and using this as a reference for similarity). Castille was not legally allowed to have marijuana.

However, safety, is also the biggest issue. There's many issues with the Castille case that are confused easily and not always communicated.

1) While he had a permit to carry, he lied on his application. Therefore, legality of it is called into question (however, this is a technical issue not a result of the shooting)
2) There was a robber of a gas station/store in the vicinity, and his car matched the description of the vehicle. Even more so, it was said he had a similar appearance to one of the suspects
3) When the officers pulled them over, the car smelled of pot
4) Castille was shot because he refused to listen to orders and made an erratic move which was seen as potentially reaching for a weapon.


This is local events for me, and it a tragedy which could have been avoided on so many levels But, there are so many factors that come into play that contributed to the situation playing out as it did. I don't agree with the verdict. But, by the same token, they couldn't find him guilty of the charges and they couldn't convict him on a lesser charge since that is how the legal system works.


I don't agree with the confiscation of weapons solely because someone uses medical marijuana. They don't confiscate weapons if someone drinks unless proven to be a risk/threat. If someone is caught with an illegal substance, and a firearm, then I think it needs to be reviewed on a case by case basis. Does the substance fall under a confiscation of possessions legality issue? If so, then perhaps. I'm not a fan of confiscation laws that much either. But, in some cases, I can't necessarily disagree with them either.
 
I have been waiting to see how the goosestepping fascist frauds at the NRA field this one.

I think we need to apply this to consumers of alcohol too...
Most definitely. I’ve never seen someone who just smoked a blunt get irate over something silly. I can’t say that about drunk people... seems like a safety issue that should be brought up to me.
 
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I don't agree with the confiscation of weapons solely because someone uses medical marijuana. They don't confiscate weapons if someone drinks unless proven to be a risk/threat. If someone is caught with an illegal substance, and a firearm, then I think it needs to be reviewed on a case by case basis.
I guess it's safe to assume that it's a debated issue because MJ is on the path to NOT being an illegal substance, but isn't quiiiiite there yet.

I'm not sure how I feel about the issue overall. MJ is legal in my state, I partake very mildly in a safe manner. The way I handle myself, I suppose I'd feel offended if someone thought I was less worthy of using my right to bear arms due to responsibly using MJ in my personal time and home.
 
This is the first I've heard of this news-it is really odd. Hawaii in general is not a very big gun-culture type of place aside from hunting. O'ahu has gotten a lot worse lately though in terms of violence but I never ever thought there would be some sort of link between marijuana use/irresponsible gun handling so I'm not quite buying the reasoning behind the decision.
 
I guess it's safe to assume that it's a debated issue because MJ is on the path to NOT being an illegal substance, but isn't quiiiiite there yet.

I'm not sure how I feel about the issue overall. MJ is legal in my state, I partake very mildly in a safe manner. The way I handle myself, I suppose I'd feel offended if someone thought I was less worthy of using my right to bear arms due to responsibly using MJ in my personal time and home.

I'm sure it's debated. But, there are multiple points about the legalities of marijuana. For instance, it's legal in some states, and to varying degrees. Therefore, it'll be charged differently in each state and depending on the circumstances of it as well. However, it's still illegal at the Federal level. Therefore, even if you're in a state where its legal, on a Federal level offense, you'll be charged.

I agree with you though in that just because someone uses marijuana doesn't mean they can't be responsible. Which, is why I referenced how MN law is in regards to firearms and alcohol consumption and a possible solution to it.
 
it's legal in some states, and to varying degrees. Therefore, it'll be charged differently in each state and depending on the circumstances of it as well. However, it's still illegal at the Federal level.
That's why I said on its way to, but not yet, being legal. We'll get to a point some day where it's treated just like alcohol. So it's easy to feel conflicted about this situation.
 
1) While he had a permit to carry, he lied on his application. Therefore, legality of it is called into question (however, this is a technical issue not a result of the shooting)
2) There was a robber of a gas station/store in the vicinity, and his car matched the description of the vehicle. Even more so, it was said he had a similar appearance to one of the suspects
3) When the officers pulled them over, the car smelled of pot
4) Castille was shot because he refused to listen to orders and made an erratic move which was seen as potentially reaching for a weapon.
It is hard for me to blame the officer 100% without seeing what he saw. Very easy for me to blame the system.

I can feel for officers that walk around fearing for their lives. I think there are a lot of good ones being put in a pretty impossible situation. But the whole "scent of marijuana = danger" line is such a crock of shit, along with using it after the fact as any sort of justification.
 
I agree that that's the wise thing to do when pulled over, but wasn't Philando actually reaching for his driver's license (like he was asked to do) when that idiot cop decided to shoot him five or more times? I refuse to watch/listen to that video clip anymore, btw. It's horrifying.

Horrifying indeed and a terrible tragedy that could have been avoided.

You just can't be too careful these days with cops having a hair trigger!

I'd have had both my hands outside the window holding my foid card, license, and proof of insurance when the officer walked up.

You NEVER want to hide your hands while reaching for ANYTHING!

That said, I didn't see what the officer saw, so it's impossible for me to make any sort of judgement call.
 
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It is hard for me to blame the officer 100% without seeing what he saw. Very easy for me to blame the system.

I can feel for officers that walk around fearing for their lives. I think there are a lot of good ones being put in a pretty impossible situation. But the whole "scent of marijuana = danger" line is such a crock of shit, along with using it after the fact as any sort of justification.

It's impossible to place sole blame on either party since we weren't there and many facts get hidden for many different reasons. Add to it, the different spins based upon the bias of the news agency, and even just layperson views/comments.

I can't say whether or not they used the smell of pot as justification, I only know of the references as a descriptor. My post included it for two reasons:

1) To call into question the legality of whether he should have had the pistol on him or not.
2) To show the use of marijuana, to reaffirm that he lied on his application regarding the use of a controlled substance.

Right or wrong MN law states that a habitual user of a controlled substance cannot possess a firearm. It is also a question on the application, to which he lied on the application. Again, this isn't meant to justify the shooting solely on the MJ issue alone. But, it is one of many factors which contributed to the events unfolding.

Taken in context, and put into another hot topic, this would be similar to those arguing faulty background checks/loopholes allowed those with some reason to not own a firearm resulted in a mass shooting or other shooting. The difference being the person getting shot is the one who shouldn't have had it in the first place due to a legal technicality of him falsifying information on his permit application.
 
Fuck legality. Step back from the trees and look at the forest.

Is it right, or is it wrong?

Already answered above. But, if you want to continue down this rabbit hole. "Car smelled of pot" and Castille's girlfriend admitted they smoked it prior to being pulled over. Therefore, were they driving under the influence of a controlled substance? Again, take the shooting out of the picture. Should they have even been driving in the first place?

I'm not arguing by any means to justify the shooting, so don't go there. I'm pointing out that MANY factors contributed to the end results.

1) Should he have legally been in possession of the firearm?
2) Admitted smoking of MJ just prior to being pulled over, along with a heavy smell of MJ. So, more likely DUI of a controlled substance. Should they have driving in the first place? Especially with a young child in the car.

So, from a legal standpoint, should they have put themselves in that situation? From a right/wrong perspective, should they have put themselves in that situation?

Those two situations alone would have most likely prevented the shooting from occurring. Again, this does not justify the shooting. Only that had any one of a number of items not occurred, he would most likely have not been shot.
 
Already answered above. But, if you want to continue down this rabbit hole. "Car smelled of pot" and Castille's girlfriend admitted they smoked it prior to being pulled over. Therefore, were they driving under the influence of a controlled substance? Again, take the shooting out of the picture. Should they have even been driving in the first place?

I'm not arguing by any means to justify the shooting, so don't go there. I'm pointing out that MANY factors contributed to the end results.

1) Should he have legally been in possession of the firearm?
2) Admitted smoking of MJ just prior to being pulled over, along with a heavy smell of MJ. So, more likely DUI of a controlled substance. Should they have driving in the first place? Especially with a young child in the car.

So, from a legal standpoint, should they have put themselves in that situation? From a right/wrong perspective, should they have put themselves in that situation?

Those two situations alone would have most likely prevented the shooting from occurring. Again, this does not justify the shooting. Only that had any one of a number of items not occurred, he would most likely have not been shot.
No. Not talking about the shooting.

I am talking about marijuana prohibition, the volumes of propaganda the government has spread about it, the numerous and egregious overreaches of power in it's name. Right, or wrong?

Is this government protecting anything (excluding corporate profits)? Or is this government preying on its own citizens, a significant portion of which are so thoroughly indoctrinated they will obediently parrot the line "
6e6589ba.200x.gif
...smell of marijuana"
without a second critical thought?
 
Fuck legality. Step back from the trees and look at the forest.

Is it right, or is it wrong?

I'd say it was a wrongful shooting if there wasn't that reasonable doubt clause, which has nothing to do with the odor of pot.

Multiple commands escalating in tone from calm to panicking were heard saying ...Don't reach for the weapon!
 
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I'd say it was a wrongful shooting if there wasn't that reasonable doubt clause.
I don't know, I can't see what the driver was doing. I read some accounts he was reaching for his license, but in the dashcam video it looked to me like he had already handed it to the officer. But my main interest in this whole thing is the NRA, and how (if) they respond to the original news story you posted.

http://www.thecannabist.co/2016/09/02/marijuana-users-nra-second-amendment-rights/62327/
 
which has nothing to do with the odor of pot.

Multiple commands escalating in tone from calm to panicking were heard saying ...Don't reach for the weapon!
Is that anything like "STOP RESISTING"? Please. :hilarious: That could mean the officer thought he was really facing a threat, or it could mean he was poorly trained and/or too high strung. It is pretty clear the cop was telling him not to do whatever he was doing (or what he thought he was doing).

But again, forget the shooting. I posted the link to the Castile shooting to point out the comments of Dana Loesch, nothing more. I should have realized it was going to turn into a defend-the-establishment derailment.

Over the years I have signed petitions, donated money, done the NORML thing, etc. I don't even smoke marijuana any more, but I did go to Colorado to buy legally a couple years back just so I could see what it was like to live in a sane country. Might let go of a little of the contempt I have for the NRA here if they would step up, but I am fully expecting hypocrisy (even if by way of silence).

My grandpa told me about hemp being grown when he was young. And now a whiff of weed is playing a role in justifications for why we pull people out of cars, dig through their shit, or even on occasion pump them full of lead?

Lol maybe Dana will come out and say the officer should have urinated on Castile...I mean this War on Drugs is a war, right?
“C’mon people, this is a war,” she said. “Do I have a problem with that as a citizen of the United States? No, I don’t.”
 
No. Not talking about the shooting.

I am talking about marijuana prohibition, the volumes of propaganda the government has spread about it, the numerous and egregious overreaches of power in it's name. Right, or wrong?

Is this government protecting anything (excluding corporate profits)? Or is this government preying on its own citizens, a significant portion of which are so thoroughly indoctrinated they will obediently parrot the line "
6e6589ba.200x.gif
...smell of marijuana"
without a second critical thought?

In general, I view marijuana similar to that of alcohol. Let it be legal, with laws similar to that of DUI/DWI, etc. People can use it, just be smart about it. No driving under the influence, don't show up to work reeking of it, nor under the influence. If there are habitual behavioral issues, again similar to that of alcohol, then follow procedures regarding treatment, etc.

That being said, there are still things which need to be discussed further regarding its use:
1) Employers have the right to deny employment if they decide to. If part of the job hiring process is testing for it and other controlled substances, they have that right to do so. If someone disagrees, they don't have to work there. This includes both private and public sector jobs.
2) Testing for THC levels needs to be more clearly defined when it comes to DUI and other scales of how judgment and motor skills may be impacted. Again, similar to that of alcohol with the BAC levels.
3) Other smaller discussions regarding things such as growth in home and packaging. Again, similar to homebrew kits for beer, or wine making kits, etc. I'm not familiar with laws on this. But, I believe there are laws regarding sales/distribution of homemade alcohol.

There are many other related points which would need to be ironed out. Again, I look at it as being similar to alcohol, thus can model laws off those. Which, alcohol laws need to be reviewed to some degree as well.

The argument then switches over to other controlled substances. Where is the line drawn for what other drugs are legal, and which aren't? Is it as simple as naturally occurring (peyote, opium, etc), vs synthetic? Or, do we continue to use the classification we have on record now?


Going back to the Castille case, replace "smells of marijuana" with "smells of alcohol". Should it have been treated any different? No. Again, it was a descriptive used in the scenario as to possible indicators of how they might be acting. When put in a high-stress situation such as a vehicle stop, anything out of the ordinary puts the situation at an even higher level. As I stated in my original post, there were already a large number of items which unfortunately led to the outcome it did.
If we remove the marijuana use, would he not have been shot? It's very difficult to say. Again, they were in a vehicle which matched the description of one involved in a robbery. He had a similar appearance to that of one of the suspects. Those two right there already put the officers on high-alert. He was ordered to not reach for his pocket multiple times, yet he continued to do so. Was this the result of his being nervous and not thinking clearly? Or, was it compounded by an impared judgment immediate preceding use of marijuana?

Again, I'm not trying to debate the shooting. I'm only looking at how marijuana may have impaired the judgment of Castille. If it was alcohol, should it have been treated any different? What about meth, or other drugs where there most likely wouldn't have been a smell? What if it was prescription drugs he was addicted to, and under the influence of? Would/should it be viewed any differently?

Let's go back to my statement which you have issues with:

Right or wrong, marijuana is illegal in the state of MN for recreational use. MN firearm laws currently are written that a habitual user of controlled substances cannot be in the possession of a firearm, and the use of such substances are a question on the application. Knowing Castille was a habitual user, and he had a permit to carry, we know he lied on his application for a permit to grant purchase of a firearm. The admission of the use of marijuana almost immediately preceding the stop reaffirms his use

Knowing the items in the immediate paragraph above, let's look at it from a right/wrong perspective:

1) Did Castille use sound judgment to operate a motor vehicle while more than likely under the influence of a controlled substance? Does having two passengers, one of which was a very young minor, impact this decision as well? Knowing the legality of said controlled substance, should that have changed his decision?
2) Was sound judgment used for making the decision to have a firearm in his possession while under the influence of a controlled substance? Knowing the state classifies it as an illegal substance, does it change the decision one would reasonable make?

So, I ask the question: Was it right or wrong of Castille to have put himself into the situation he did? I broke the legality of marijuana into a separate question for the reason that knowing it is currently illegal may cause one to have a second level of reasoning for a decision as if compared to that of a legal substance such as alcohol. Which, at a 0.04% BAC, or under the influence of a controlled substance, one is prohibited from carrying a firearm per MN state law. These are laws which a person issued a permit to carry are supposed to know and follow.

For myself, and those I know who can legally carry, we will not have a firearm in our possession when we decide to drink. BAC of 0.04% comes up very quickly, and it is not worth it to put oneself into legal situations such as this. I don't use drugs recreationally, and if I have to take a prescription which may impair my judgement and/or motor skills, I do not have it in my possession nor will I drive a vehicle.

Again, this is by no means meant to justify the shooting. Only a response to your question of "right or wrong" hen applied to sound decision making. Or, lack thereof.
 
I don't know, I can't see what the driver was doing. I read some accounts he was reaching for his license, but in the dashcam video it looked to me like he had already handed it to the officer. But my main interest in this whole thing is the NRA, and how (if) they respond to the original news story you posted.

http://www.thecannabist.co/2016/09/02/marijuana-users-nra-second-amendment-rights/62327/
I spiraled down this ponder drain a couple months ago and the bottom is just super fucking enraging and honestly, kinda of proof of a lot of non-gun related shit being talked about in this country right now IMO.
 
In general, I view marijuana similar to that of alcohol. Let it be legal, with laws similar to that of DUI/DWI, etc. People can use it, just be smart about it. No driving under the influence, don't show up to work reeking of it, nor under the influence. If there are habitual behavioral issues, again similar to that of alcohol, then follow procedures regarding treatment, etc.

That being said, there are still things which need to be discussed further regarding its use:
1) Employers have the right to deny employment if they decide to. If part of the job hiring process is testing for it and other controlled substances, they have that right to do so. If someone disagrees, they don't have to work there. This includes both private and public sector jobs.
2) Testing for THC levels needs to be more clearly defined when it comes to DUI and other scales of how judgment and motor skills may be impacted. Again, similar to that of alcohol with the BAC levels.
3) Other smaller discussions regarding things such as growth in home and packaging. Again, similar to homebrew kits for beer, or wine making kits, etc. I'm not familiar with laws on this. But, I believe there are laws regarding sales/distribution of homemade alcohol.

There are many other related points which would need to be ironed out. Again, I look at it as being similar to alcohol, thus can model laws off those. Which, alcohol laws need to be reviewed to some degree as well.

The argument then switches over to other controlled substances. Where is the line drawn for what other drugs are legal, and which aren't? Is it as simple as naturally occurring (peyote, opium, etc), vs synthetic? Or, do we continue to use the classification we have on record now?


Going back to the Castille case, replace "smells of marijuana" with "smells of alcohol". Should it have been treated any different? No. Again, it was a descriptive used in the scenario as to possible indicators of how they might be acting. When put in a high-stress situation such as a vehicle stop, anything out of the ordinary puts the situation at an even higher level. As I stated in my original post, there were already a large number of items which unfortunately led to the outcome it did.
If we remove the marijuana use, would he not have been shot? It's very difficult to say. Again, they were in a vehicle which matched the description of one involved in a robbery. He had a similar appearance to that of one of the suspects. Those two right there already put the officers on high-alert. He was ordered to not reach for his pocket multiple times, yet he continued to do so. Was this the result of his being nervous and not thinking clearly? Or, was it compounded by an impared judgment immediate preceding use of marijuana?

Again, I'm not trying to debate the shooting. I'm only looking at how marijuana may have impaired the judgment of Castille. If it was alcohol, should it have been treated any different? What about meth, or other drugs where there most likely wouldn't have been a smell? What if it was prescription drugs he was addicted to, and under the influence of? Would/should it be viewed any differently?

Let's go back to my statement which you have issues with:

Right or wrong, marijuana is illegal in the state of MN for recreational use. MN firearm laws currently are written that a habitual user of controlled substances cannot be in the possession of a firearm, and the use of such substances are a question on the application. Knowing Castille was a habitual user, and he had a permit to carry, we know he lied on his application for a permit to grant purchase of a firearm. The admission of the use of marijuana almost immediately preceding the stop reaffirms his use

Knowing the items in the immediate paragraph above, let's look at it from a right/wrong perspective:

1) Did Castille use sound judgment to operate a motor vehicle while more than likely under the influence of a controlled substance? Does having two passengers, one of which was a very young minor, impact this decision as well? Knowing the legality of said controlled substance, should that have changed his decision?
2) Was sound judgment used for making the decision to have a firearm in his possession while under the influence of a controlled substance? Knowing the state classifies it as an illegal substance, does it change the decision one would reasonable make?

So, I ask the question: Was it right or wrong of Castille to have put himself into the situation he did? I broke the legality of marijuana into a separate question for the reason that knowing it is currently illegal may cause one to have a second level of reasoning for a decision as if compared to that of a legal substance such as alcohol. Which, at a 0.04% BAC, or under the influence of a controlled substance, one is prohibited from carrying a firearm per MN state law. These are laws which a person issued a permit to carry are supposed to know and follow.

For myself, and those I know who can legally carry, we will not have a firearm in our possession when we decide to drink. BAC of 0.04% comes up very quickly, and it is not worth it to put oneself into legal situations such as this. I don't use drugs recreationally, and if I have to take a prescription which may impair my judgement and/or motor skills, I do not have it in my possession nor will I drive a vehicle.

Again, this is by no means meant to justify the shooting. Only a response to your question of "right or wrong" hen applied to sound decision making. Or, lack thereof.
I say we bulldoze Monticello. That rat-bastard king-subverting traitor Jefferson grew hemp. Not the kind of role model the law abiding need...

NIJJ8F6.png
 
I spiraled down this ponder drain a couple months ago and the bottom is just super fucking enraging and honestly, kinda of proof of a lot of non-gun related shit being talked about in this country right now IMO.
What part enrages you?
 
What part enrages you?
The fact that the NRA didn't latch on to such a high profile story in defense of Castille. It was a 2nd ammendment fight worth fighting for VS. the usual BS they focus on intended to whip people into gun buying hysteria.
 
The fact that the NRA didn't latch on to such a high profile story in defense of Castille. It was a 2nd ammendment fight worth fighting for VS. the usual BS they focus on intended to whip people into gun buying hysteria.
Gotcha. I wish I hadn't even brought that up, should have just stuck to the Livingston opinion piece and left the Castille shooting out of it. (I thought the Livingston article was what you meant enraged you).
 
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