UK leaves the EU. What's does this mean for the UK??

[FluffyGalore]

I know that because I'm American my voice doesn't really count on this issue. But I will state my opinion on it. I think that Scotland and Northern Ireland should leave the UK. I believe that the U.K is unfairly dominated by England. Case in point: When Americans hear the words British people, they always think of the people that live in England.

l already knew that the UK is made up of those 4 countries and that they have their own governments. But clearly England and Wales unfairly dominated in the UK's decision to leave the EU. It's not okay that you guys are going to be forced to leave the EU because of Islamophobia in those two countries.

as I said we voted as Britain. It is irrelevant that each country voted a different way. That's like saying because One city voted out and another in then that city should hold a referendum to become an independent country. Slight exageration but you get the idea. Or even better, let's say for arguments sake that Scotland votes Tories and England votes labour does that mean Scotland should become independent because then didn't want labour in government? Or that Wales should become independent because they wanted the Green Party lol? No so why should this be any different?

Edit to add: are you now accusing England and Wales of being racists, and of course anyone else that votes out? Maybe you should look into the actual reasons why most people voted out rather than shitty media hype.

 

[Guy]

as I said we voted as Britain. It is irrelevant that each country voted a different way. That's like saying because One city voted out and another in then that city should hold a referendum to become an independent country. Slight exageration but you get the idea. Or even better, let's say for arguments sake that Scotland votes Tories and England votes labour does that mean Scotland should become independent because then didn't want labour in government? Or that Wales should become independent because they wanted the Green Party lol? No so why should this be any different?

Edit to add: are you now accusing England and Wales of being racists, and of course anyone else that votes out? Maybe you should look into the actual reasons why most people voted out rather than shitty media hype.

I'm not saying that all English and Welsh people hate Muslims. Islamophobia is a major problem over there like it is over here in the US.

 

[WebcamStartup]

That's like saying because One city voted out and another in then that city should hold a referendum to become an independent country.

I would honestly love to see the states over here fracture. Federal regulation is too much of "blanket policy" and we're such a diverse country that blanket policy doesn't work for each state. Then you get the divisiveness because the people with different views (which is very geographical) need to bicker about who gets their way when it comes to federal regulation.

I'm sure the same politics exist over there. I hope the Texan referendum becomes more than dialogue. The Conch Republic failed in the 80's. Texas is in a position where it could actually happen.

 

[FluffyGalore]

I would honestly love to see the states over here fracture. Federal regulation is too much of "blanket policy" and we're such a diverse country that blanket policy doesn't work for each state. Then you get the divisiveness because the people with different views (which is very geographical) need to bicker about who gets their way when it comes to federal regulation.

I'm sure the same politics exist over there. I hope the Texan referendum becomes more than dialogue. The Conch Republic failed in the 80's. Texas is in a position where it could actually happen.

Our cities are no where near as big as your states for example an estimated 8.5 million is said to live in London. In Texas and estimated 27 odd million big big difference. Not an option to have happen here.

 

[FluffyGalore]

I'm not saying that all English and Welsh people hate Muslims. Islamophobia is a major problem over there like it is over here in the US.

I'm not sure your getting the gist of why people voted out. Or why it has anything to do with Islam.

 

[WebcamStartup]

I'm not sure your getting the gist of why people voted out. Or why it has anything to do with Islam.

But we have all listened to the news, so we're well conditioned to the propaganda If Texas were to leave the US, I'm sure it would be chalked up to nothing but racism as well.

 

[FluffyGalore]

But we have all listened to the news, so we're well conditioned to the propaganda If Texas were to leave the US, I'm sure it would be chalked up to nothing but racism as well.

Exact reasons not to listen to shit.

 

[WebcamStartup]

Exact reasons not to listen to shit.

I highly disagree. You need to know what kind of propaganda people are being spoon-fed. You just need to second guess everything being said, do your own due-dilligence and form your own opinions. At least that's how I feel.

 

[FluffyGalore]

I highly disagree. You need to know what kind of propaganda people are being spoon-fed. You just need to second guess everything being said, do your own due-dilligence and form your own opinions. At least that's how I feel.

I think it's pretty clear that I have my own opinions.

 

[RebeccaT]

Sadly, the racists see the result as a mandate to be abusive and the closet racists have become overt. The country in which I was born 55 years ago now makes me feel unwelcome.

 

[FluffyGalore]

Sadly, the racists see the result as a mandate to be abusive and the closet racists have become overt. The country in which I was born 55 years ago now makes me feel unwelcome.

Agree that it seems to be giving a minority group the go ahead to be racist. It's a sad day when an vote to leave the E.U means that racist scum have the excuse they have been looking for to abuse others.

 

[WickedTouch]

Islamophobia is a major problem over there like it is over here in the US.

Erm.... no! Islamophobia has absolutely nothing to do with the current Brexit situation whatsoever. That is just right wing propaganda that is fed to the sheeple. If news broadcasters in the USA have been stressing any kind of Islamophobia angle, they are either dancing to the beat of a right wing drum... or just plain lazy and ill informed!

The "Leave" campaign in the UK used several arguments, one of which was a proposal that the UK should drastically reduce immigration, as devices to get its message across as to why the UK would be better off outside of the E.U. rather than staying put. The largest share of immigrants to the UK at present is from Poland, a predominantly Christian country... at around 15%. That has happened because there has been increased migration to the UK over the last 10 - 12 years or so from countries who have recently become member states. People from countries such as Poland (joined 2004), Hungary (joined 2004), Romania (joined 2007) etc., were then able to benefit from the ability to travel across the zone seeking employment opportunities within other member countries.

The Leave campaigners would have us believe that these economic migrants are the problem, taking jobs and resources away from UK born residents and that the UK could manage without them. This has been an often seen headline that could be found spread across the (Tory supporting) right wing press in the UK, like the Daily Mail and the Torygraph... sorry, The Telegraph! Their stance was to stress that message, demonise the migrants from Poland etc and create a wedge of disharmony between UK born residents and the migrant population. All based on nationalism and racism. Nothing to do with religion at all. The Leave campaign basically played right into the hands of every closet racist out there and all the economic arguments are being overshadowed.

I sadly see from the UK news that it has led to an increase of racist attacks, people receiving hate mail in letterboxes, their kids being abused at school, or being verbally abused in the street for appearing to be "non-British" . It even happened to one BBC presenter who was recently describing her feelings about being on the receiving end of verbal racist abuse in Coventry.

***Trigger Warning... video contains "n" word




It's a sad day indeed for the UK when the racists think that doing this kind of shit is ok.

 

[FluffyGalore]

Erm.... no! Islamophobia has absolutely nothing to do with the current Brexit situation whatsoever. That is just right wing propaganda that is fed to the sheeple. If news broadcasters in the USA have been stressing any kind of Islamophobia angle, they are either dancing to the beat of a right wing drum... or just plain lazy and ill informed!

The "Leave" campaign in the UK used several arguments, one of which was a proposal that the UK should drastically reduce immigration, as devices to get its message across as to why the UK would be better off outside of the E.U. rather than staying put. The largest share of immigrants to the UK at present is from Poland, a predominantly Christian country... at around 15%. That has happened because there has been increased migration to the UK over the last 10 - 12 years or so from countries who have recently become member states. People from countries such as Poland (joined 2004), Hungary (joined 2004), Romania (joined 2007) etc., were then able to benefit from the ability to travel across the zone seeking employment opportunities within other member countries.

The Leave campaigners would have us believe that these economic migrants are the problem, taking jobs and resources away from UK born residents and that the UK could manage without them. This has been an often seen headline that could be found spread across the (Tory supporting) right wing press in the UK, like the Daily Mail and the Torygraph... sorry, The Telegraph! Their stance was to stress that message, demonise the migrants from Poland etc and create a wedge of disharmony between UK born residents and the migrant population. All based on nationalism and racism. Nothing to do with religion at all. The Leave campaign basically played right into the hands of every closet racist out there and all the economic arguments are being overshadowed.

I sadly see from the UK news that it has led to an increase of racist attacks, people receiving hate mail in letterboxes, their kids being abused at school, or being verbally abused in the street for appearing to be "non-British" . It even happened to one BBC presenter who was recently describing her feelings about being on the receiving end of verbal racist abuse in Coventry.

***Trigger Warning... video contains "n" word




It's a sad day indeed for the UK when the racists think that doing this kind of shit is ok.

View attachment 63981

OMG thank you. Someone who speaks sense.

 

[Guy]

Erm.... no! Islamophobia has absolutely nothing to do with the current Brexit situation whatsoever. That is just right wing propaganda that is fed to the sheeple. If news broadcasters in the USA have been stressing any kind of Islamophobia angle, they are either dancing to the beat of a right wing drum... or just plain lazy and ill informed!

The "Leave" campaign in the UK used several arguments, one of which was a proposal that the UK should drastically reduce immigration, as devices to get its message across as to why the UK would be better off outside of the E.U. rather than staying put. The largest share of immigrants to the UK at present is from Poland, a predominantly Christian country... at around 15%. That has happened because there has been increased migration to the UK over the last 10 - 12 years or so from countries who have recently become member states. People from countries such as Poland (joined 2004), Hungary (joined 2004), Romania (joined 2007) etc., were then able to benefit from the ability to travel across the zone seeking employment opportunities within other member countries.

The Leave campaigners would have us believe that these economic migrants are the problem, taking jobs and resources away from UK born residents and that the UK could manage without them. This has been an often seen headline that could be found spread across the (Tory supporting) right wing press in the UK, like the Daily Mail and the Torygraph... sorry, The Telegraph! Their stance was to stress that message, demonise the migrants from Poland etc and create a wedge of disharmony between UK born residents and the migrant population. All based on nationalism and racism. Nothing to do with religion at all. The Leave campaign basically played right into the hands of every closet racist out there and all the economic arguments are being overshadowed.

I sadly see from the UK news that it has led to an increase of racist attacks, people receiving hate mail in letterboxes, their kids being abused at school, or being verbally abused in the street for appearing to be "non-British" . It even happened to one BBC presenter who was recently describing her feelings about being on the receiving end of verbal racist abuse in Coventry.

***Trigger Warning... video contains "n" word




It's a sad day indeed for the UK when the racists think that doing this kind of shit is ok.

View attachment 63981

Thank you for correcting me. The American media never said it was because of Islamophobia. I assumed that Brexit was caused by Islamophobia because I thought most of the migrants to the U.K came from Pakistan and Bangladesh and also because of an article by the U.K edition of the Huffington Post. http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/7694452.html?edition=uk

 

[Zoomer]

Thank you for correcting me. The American media never said it was because of Islamophobia. I assumed that Brexit was caused by Islamophobia because I thought most of the migrants to the U.K came from Pakistan and Bangladesh and also because of an article by the U.K edition of the Huffington Post. http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/7694452.html?edition=uk

British Exit from Europe due to Pakistan and Bangladeshi immigrants?

Well... shit. I could have sworn they were on the other side of the planet

Sorry for the piss take... just when i read what you'd written I started giggling. Then I ... couldn't resist

p.s The spelling on this map is chronic. Tunesia? Belorussia? Moldavia? I found a piss take map to take the piss with

 

[Guy]

British Exit from Europe due to Pakistan and Bangladeshi immigrants?

Well... shit. I could have sworn they were on the other side of the planet

Sorry for the piss take... just when i read what you'd written I started giggling. Then I ... couldn't resist

p.s The spelling on this map is chronic. Tunesia? Belorussia? Moldavia? I found a piss take map to take the piss with

I already knew that Pakistan and Bangladesh are near India.

 

[Zoomer]

I already knew that Pakistan and Bangladesh are near India.

Maybe we differ in senses of humour significantly. Anyway, I think your comments in this thread indicate the issue of trying to learn something about a situation when some of those telling you about it are American - meaning simply that you're less likely to get an accurate/informed opinion. To be clear, you may get a very accurate and informed opinion - it's entirely possible But I think you are less likely.

Case in point... Is Islamaphobia an issue in the UK? Not really, no. As with any population you have a percentage of bigots and a tabloid media who will report things that increase sales. People buy into that fear - but they definitely are a minority and not the majority. Furthermore, the immigrants coming from Europe aren't (predominantly) muslim either. But immigration isn't their only fear (I mean argument)... not by a long stretch. Just that at present the immigration issue ("they took our jobs and use all our services, costing us money without contributing anything in return!") got a lot of traction during the campaign - mainly due to the economic climate we currently find ourselves in.

However, it's multifaceted. They believe we're paying huge amounts of money to an undemocratic, un-audited (that's very true), bunch of Europeans who control our laws and ride roughshod over anything the country itself thinks/wants. They're aware that we may take an economic hit, but they think it's short term and we'll be way better off afterwards as the money will pour in. They do think lots of immigrants from the EU lower our wages, take all the jobs, take all the housing, cost us a lot in various means to keep them - and probably cause more crime. There is no statistical evidence to give weight to this; quite the opposite in fact.

The problem is for years there has been a drip feed against the EU by the media for decades. A big part of it is that EU legislation seems to allow utterly bonkers things to happen which makes us all roll our eyes and say "that bloody interfering EU!". So for those not fearing immigration, or not caring hugely, this is another angle which means they've always wanted us to leave the EU.

Here's a great example:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ritain-officials-tell-Bolivian-immigrant.html

Migrant facing deportation wins right to stay in Britain... because he's got a cat

An illegal immigrant was allowed to stay in Britain because he had a cat, it was revealed yesterday.

The unnamed Bolivian was spared deportation after he told a court that he and his girlfriend had bought the animal as a pet.

Immigration judges ruled that sending him back home would breach his human rights by interfering with his family life.

Feel free to read the article, it's a genuine bit of news. That damned Article 8 of the EU Convention on Human rights! *shakes fist*. They even have commentators from several places saying how shocking the ruling is...

The media, however, aren't reporting the truth. They're playing to their crowd... knowing they'll be spitting bile and angry over this perceived meddling of our laws - and buying the paper to read about it.

The reality is the cat played no part whatsoever in the case; the reality was the Home Office hadn't applied it's own rules to the Gentlemen in question.

Mr O'Leary added that his client originally brought the case because he should have benefited from a Home Office policy on unmarried partners which gives credit to couples who have been together more than two years. The Bolivian had been with his partner for four years, he said.

"It was made clear by the initial judge and then by Senior Immigration Judge Gleeson that the appellant should benefit from that policy and be granted the right to remain," he said.

"Furthermore, it was accepted by the Home Office representative at the hearing before Judge Gleeson that the policy should apply and any other errors in the initial decision by the judge, including too much detail on the cat, were immaterial."

He added: "This case was won because the Home Office had a policy which they did not initially apply but later, through their representative, they accepted should have been applied."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...grant-allowed-to-stay-because-of-pet-cat.html

But examples of such reporting (misleading the public) are legion.

So whilst immigration played a part (which has absolutely nothing to do with Islamophobia whatsoever), it had people voting for reasons of rules of law, fear of the EU closer integration, loss of national identity, economic well being, and yes... even "independence!11".

The fact that without being an independent nation we could never hold a referendum on EU membership seems lost on them.

I voted to remain. I still think it's a mistake to leave - but mainly because of lost opportunities. I would love the chance to work, visa free, in dozens of EU countries; I also love our EU family of nations - despite their issues. But that doesn't mean I love the EU entirely; it desperately needs reform. Just once we're out... we're out. That's a mistake imo.

I should also point out that many areas voting out of the EU have small amounts of migrants. Some rely heavily on the EU for trade (the areas exporting the most to the EU tended to vote out the most too! They'll take big hits if the companies employing the people decide to move). There's a perception that migrants are causing job issues, but reality is wayy different. For example, currently there are 750,000 job vacancies in the UK. That's enough jobs for every single EU migrant for the next 4 years.

Then since the vote the fun starts. The £350 million a week we pay to the EU won't go to the NHS (part of the leave campaign slogan). Furthermore, they can't really stop the immigration; we need it.
So all that "Turkey is about to join the EU and flood us with up to 80 million inhabitants" (they're not about to join, they've been in negotiations since 1988 and have passed just 1 of the 30+ checks required to gain EU membership), so the immigration argument is out.
France immediately says we should look after our own borders and stop trying to stop immigrants in Calais (Major of Calais wants UK border police to go home - basically so they can wave migrants onto the boat i imagine ).
Furthermore, if we want access to the common market (like Switzerland and Norway) we'll have to accept all the EU regulations anyway... and free movement of people. And we'll have to pay for the privileged... without being able to make any impact upon creating / changing the laws either.

Basically... most of the arguments for leave are either found to be significantly lacking, or will be irrelevant as we'll have to accept them for trade purposes.

The alternative is not having access to the common market. What the impact will be from that I don't know and haven't bothered reading. Kind of stopped caring at present, just wait to see what happens and hope the small minority of racist arseholes don't manage to drag the UK's name through the mud.

 

[FluffyGalore]

Maybe we differ in senses of humour significantly. Anyway, I think your comments in this thread indicate the issue of trying to learn something about a situation when some of those telling you about it are American - meaning simply that you're less likely to get an accurate/informed opinion. To be clear, you may get a very accurate and informed opinion - it's entirely possible But I think you are less likely.

Case in point... Is Islamaphobia an issue in the UK? Not really, no. As with any population you have a percentage of bigots and a tabloid media who will report things that increase sales. People buy into that fear - but they definitely are a minority and not the majority. Furthermore, the immigrants coming from Europe aren't (predominantly) muslim either. But immigration isn't their only fear (I mean argument)... not by a long stretch. Just that at present the immigration issue ("they took our jobs and use all our services, costing us money without contributing anything in return!") got a lot of traction during the campaign - mainly due to the economic climate we currently find ourselves in.

However, it's multifaceted. They believe we're paying huge amounts of money to an undemocratic, un-audited (that's very true), bunch of Europeans who control our laws and ride roughshod over anything the country itself thinks/wants. They're aware that we may take an economic hit, but they think it's short term and we'll be way better off afterwards as the money will pour in. They do think lots of immigrants from the EU lower our wages, take all the jobs, take all the housing, cost us a lot in various means to keep them - and probably cause more crime. There is no statistical evidence to give weight to this; quite the opposite in fact.

The problem is for years there has been a drip feed against the EU by the media for decades. A big part of it is that EU legislation seems to allow utterly bonkers things to happen which makes us all roll our eyes and say "that bloody interfering EU!". So for those not fearing immigration, or not caring hugely, this is another angle which means they've always wanted us to leave the EU.

Here's a great example:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ritain-officials-tell-Bolivian-immigrant.html



Feel free to read the article, it's a genuine bit of news. That damned Article 8 of the EU Convention on Human rights! *shakes fist*. They even have commentators from several places saying how shocking the ruling is...

The media, however, aren't reporting the truth. They're playing to their crowd... knowing they'll be spitting bile and angry over this perceived meddling of our laws - and buying the paper to read about it.

The reality is the cat played no part whatsoever in the case; the reality was the Home Office hadn't applied it's own rules to the Gentlemen in question.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...grant-allowed-to-stay-because-of-pet-cat.html

But examples of such reporting (misleading the public) are legion.

So whilst immigration played a part (which has absolutely nothing to do with Islamophobia whatsoever), it had people voting for reasons of rules of law, fear of the EU closer integration, loss of national identity, economic well being, and yes... even "independence!11".

The fact that without being an independent nation we could never hold a referendum on EU membership seems lost on them.

I voted to remain. I still think it's a mistake to leave - but mainly because of lost opportunities. I would love the chance to work, visa free, in dozens of EU countries; I also love our EU family of nations - despite their issues. But that doesn't mean I love the EU entirely; it desperately needs reform. Just once we're out... we're out. That's a mistake imo.

I should also point out that many areas voting out of the EU have small amounts of migrants. Some rely heavily on the EU for trade (the areas exporting the most to the EU tended to vote out the most too! They'll take big hits if the companies employing the people decide to move). There's a perception that migrants are causing job issues, but reality is wayy different. For example, currently there are 750,000 job vacancies in the UK. That's enough jobs for every single EU migrant for the next 4 years.

Then since the vote the fun starts. The £350 million a week we pay to the EU won't go to the NHS (part of the leave campaign slogan). Furthermore, they can't really stop the immigration; we need it.
So all that "Turkey is about to join the EU and flood us with up to 80 million inhabitants" (they're not about to join, they've been in negotiations since 1988 and have passed just 1 of the 30+ checks required to gain EU membership), so the immigration argument is out.
France immediately says we should look after our own borders and stop trying to stop immigrants in Calais (Major of Calais wants UK border police to go home - basically so they can wave migrants onto the boat i imagine ).
Furthermore, if we want access to the common market (like Switzerland and Norway) we'll have to accept all the EU regulations anyway... and free movement of people. And we'll have to pay for the privileged... without being able to make any impact upon creating / changing the laws either.

Basically... most of the arguments for leave are either found to be significantly lacking, or will be irrelevant as we'll have to accept them for trade purposes.

The alternative is not having access to the common market. What the impact will be from that I don't know and haven't bothered reading. Kind of stopped caring at present, just wait to see what happens and hope the small minority of racist arseholes don't manage to drag the UK's name through the mud.

Very eloquently put. Basically what I wanted to say but due to stupid comments about Scottish independence I was too angry to actually form a decent argument without the typical, ah fuck bastard fucking fucker blah meh shit bag.

Edit to add: this I why I will never be a politician.

 

[JerryBoBerry]

The FTSE has already bounced back slightly by close of play today

But I think the U.K. will be better off for having done it.

So, for a full recovery, you can expect at least 5 to 10 years if not more.

Most pundits are watching how the financial markets are reacting and looking to see when they will get their pants on straight and settle down.

All time high.
The U.S. Dow hits an all time high as well.

 

[Guy]

All time high.
The U.S. Dow hits an all time high as well.


View attachment 68295
View attachment 68296

Things are not looking good for Northern Ireland. http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...ales-betrayed-english-this-week-a7545026.html

 

[fandango]

All time high.
The U.S. Dow hits an all time high as well.


View attachment 68295
View attachment 68296

This has been artificially inflated by the weakness of the Pound. The FTSE 100 are mainly international companies who deal day to day in other currencies which when converted back to GBP to report on their profits seem higher. They have also helped with exports. A more reliable measure would be to look at the FTSE 250 which has many more companies that deal primarily in the UK market. The FTSE 250 has lagged behind the FTSE 100.

http://news.sky.com/story/ftse-100-in-record-setting-winning-streak-because-of-weak-pound-10724221
http://moneyweek.com/ftse-100-of-ftse-250-which-is-the-best-gauging-to-the-health-of-uk-plc/

For your average Joe on the street the strength of the currency will have a far larger impact on their day to day lives as the costs of things we buy that we have to import are going up.

Also Brexit hasn't happened yet, it's still all largely uncertain what the effect will be. The politicians are all still debating about how and when to trigger it. No one will know the full implications for at least 5-10 years.

 

[Ambers Troll]

For the financial side, it is much the same as breaking any free trade agreement, if you won under the agreement you will most likely lose a bit, if you lost under the agreement then you will most likely gain a bit.
Not that the Brexit decision had much to do with financial decisions. As the US will find out under DJ Trump, freedom from trade commitments and focusing solely on home issues has its price. Time will tell if it is worth it.