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Who would you vote for?

  • Donald Trump

  • Hillary Clinton

  • Bernie Sanders

  • Gary Johnson (Libertarian Party)

  • Jill Stein (Green Party)

  • Other

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A lot of stuff said about Trump and his supporters is pure slander!! Been following this thread a while and literally he was called every name in the book including stupid. On the other hand ppl who don't like Hillary don't call her names is just mentioned she lies a lot.
 
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Ok. I'm just trying to offer examples of how I think, not trying to convince anybody.
The Sowell article points to a lot of things I agree with so I'll use it as an example of "kernels of truth" lol.

Like Sowell says.. crime hurting black communities... check..
Democratic policies and teachers unions hurting schools in inner cities... check

Trump gets behing a podium(im paraphrasing dont have time to look up), "The school system is failing black children! Violence is hurting black communities!"
Oversimplified but Trueee

people's reaction, "what does Trump know about black people!"

you know? That's what I mean..it's like the guy can never win.
Trump goes to Louisiana "Photo op!"
Obama goes to Jersey right after Hurricane Sandy..(a week before running for re-election mind you...) "What a great leader!"

That's all. Hillary's like.. "trump's voters are racists!"
ok... great... really helping calm things down there hill... way to go. Again... paraphrasing. lol Im multitasking! but IM ADDICTED TO ACF POLITICS SEND HELP
 
A lot of stuff said about Trump and his supporters is pure slander!! Been following this thread a while and literally he was called every name in the book including stupid. On the other hand ppl who don't like Hillary don't call her names is just mentioned she lies a lot.

Oh I've definitely called her a cunty mccuntface and/or like the devil or something lol so i'll take one for the team.
 
Oh I've definitely called her a cunty mccuntface and/or like the devil or something lol so i'll take one for the team.
Well, to your credit she is a cunty mccuntface.
 
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Ok. I'm just trying to offer examples of how I think, not trying to convince anybody.
The Sowell article points to a lot of things I agree with do I'll use it as an example of "kernels of truth" lol.

Like Sowell says.. crime hurting black communities... check..
Democratic policies and teachers unions hurting schools in inner cities... check

Trump gets behing a podium(im paraphrasing dont have time to look up), "The school system is failing black children! Violence is hurting black communities!"
Oversimplified but Trueee

people's reaction, "what does Trump know about black people!"

you know? That's what I mean..it's like the guy can never win.
Trump goes to Louisiana "Photo op!"
Obama goes to Jersey right after Hurricane Sandy..(a week before running for re-election mind you...) "What a great leader!"

That's all. Hillary's like.. "trump's voters are racists!"
ok... great... really helping calm things down there hill... way to go. Again... paraphrasing. lol Im multitasking! but IM ADDICTED TO ACF POLITICS SEND HELP

Yes.
And my personal favorite :
Secure borders = Nazi
 
I stand firmly by my calling Hillary a turd sandwhich.
 
I would say something clever about those bags under Bill's eyes being engaged in a race to the bottom with Hillary's saggy ass, but I don't want to inadvertently offend any camgirls by insinuating a saggy ass can't also be beautiful.
 
can this thread just turn into memes already making fun of everybody.

I also think... like ok. worse case scenario whoever wins, we have the impeachment process right? So like.. a year goes by and we're like "oh shit oh shit oh shit" get rid of em.

Trump gets impeached for something stupid. Everyone's like.. yeah guys my bad.. .dunno what we were thinking... thought we'd be great again!

Clinton gets impeached (the true teflon don)... people start suiciding themselves with three gunshots to the back before falling out a ten story window... >:)
 
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Ok. I'm just trying to offer examples of how I think, not trying to convince anybody.
The Sowell article points to a lot of things I agree with so I'll use it as an example of "kernels of truth" lol.

Like Sowell says.. crime hurting black communities... check..
Democratic policies and teachers unions hurting schools in inner cities... check

Trump gets behing a podium(im paraphrasing dont have time to look up), "The school system is failing black children! Violence is hurting black communities!"
Oversimplified but Trueee

ok... great... really helping calm things down there hill... way to go. Again... paraphrasing. lol Im multitasking! but IM ADDICTED TO ACF POLITICS SEND HELP


I agree with virtually everything Sowell says. Teacher unions have an insane amount of influence on the Democratic party. Teachers union are fanatical about protecting their member's jobs, and a big result is that crappest, most incompetent teachers get sent to poor intercity schools, instead of being fired. School choice and charter schools is a natural area where Republican and poor people who are disproportionately minorities have a natural alliance. It is not a new argument but I think it could be an effective one. But it is not one Trump makes.

Instead, he says "You're living in poverty, your schools are no good, you have no jobs, 58% of your youth is unemployed -- what the hell do you have to lose?"

But it is not true, 73% of African American don't live in poverty, and while a staggering 45% black kids under 6 do live in poverty, that still leave a majority who don't live in poverty and don't go to crappy schools.

It's not like Trump is pointing out something that everybody doesn't know, and he is not the first white, black, or purple, Democrat or Republican politician to point out the biggest victims of violence and bad schools are minorities and say it in blunt language.

His solution to all these problems is what???? and frankly saying what have you got to lose, ignore the reality that Good old days when America was great, sucked for most minorities.
 
His solution to all these problems is what???? and frankly saying what have you got to lose, ignore the reality that Good old days when America was great, sucked for most minorities.

While racism/sexism and every other kind of ism is terrible... if you are a fan of Sowell... you will also know that he disproved things like racial/gender wage gaps as far back in the 70's.

These are lies democrats(including hillster) still pander too, while not accepting responsibility for their own roles in hurting these groups.

The reality for most Americans, no matter race or sex there was once upon a time MORE job opportunity than there is in 2016

Edit: the access to these opportunities has not been limited as much by racism/sexism as it has by educational system flaws.

and on that note I am buzzed and shall bow out til manana lol
 
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People are tired of being guilt tripped and being told that unless they go against their own self interest, unless they stop protecting their country and their children and their future they are bad racists. Well, people are wising up. And they are challenging these ideas. At this point 40% of America realized already that the word "racist" is just a buzzword to silence dissent. You can only use the word "Racist!" so many times before it loses all it's meaning. People don't buy the binary world view anymore where anything short from total open borders and handing "welcome refugee!" happy meals is neonazism. The left is going to have to come up with a new vocabulary or a new strategy because this one is spent.

The left is really worried because the grip they had on the media for the past 40 or 50 years is no longer enough. We can now communicate with each other and find relevant information online, we can color outside the party lines, and fill in the gaps that the carefully edited content of mainstream media didn't show. And the result is the Alt-Right and 40% of the country voting for Trump. There are still another 60% unconvinced, among them there are still a few Hillary voters... mostly Tumblrinas, low T men, and old spinsters who read XoJane and didn't get the memo that being a lefty is no longer fashionable. And of course they will call the 40% of fed up americans all the names under the sun, but when they are done insulting Trump voters, the truth will still be the truth, and they will still vote for Trump.
 
I think people are tired of having to deal with contrived claims of racism on the one hand, and goose-stepping idealogues who claim racism doesn't exist on the other. I think people are sick of illegal immigration being a problem that politicians don't know how to deal with because self-serving capitalist vultures want it.

The left and the right need to be worried, because they are both losing their grip on the media. They have discredited themselves so badly that even conspiracy theories and rumor-mongering seem preferable. I think the alt-right has been there for a long long time, and it's been a lot higher than 40% in the past. I think the truth is, at this point in history, it is the right that really has its ass hanging out here, and you have to be pretty damn indoctrinated not to see that.
 
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. . . . For the record, Sowell can't stand Trump and has said so many times. Basically his take on this speech is like mine... if it's gotta be Trump.. at least someone's saying it.

http://townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/2016/08/18/trump-and-blacks-n2207012

Somebody should be pushing these issues into the political discourse. The problem is that Trump is not the messenger or advocate these issues need. He lacks credibility and trustworthiness. He can't articulate his positions in a way that makes sense to most people. He can't seem to refrain from alienating a majority of the electorate with his hateful and clueless outbursts. He lacks self-discipline and the will to win in the political arena (he's not running his own business here; what works for his business doesn't necessarily work in a political campaign).

If, as seems likely now, Trump loses, the issues he's championed will still be there. They will probably be more visible than they were before Trump, but they will also be compromised (for a while) by their association with Trump.
 
People are tired of being guilt tripped and being told that unless they go against their own self interest, unless they stop protecting their country and their children and their future they are bad racists. Well, people are wising up. And they are challenging these ideas. At this point 40% of America realized already that the word "racist" is just a buzzword to silence dissent. You can only use the word "Racist!" so many times before it loses all it's meaning. People don't buy the binary world view anymore where anything short from total open borders and handing "welcome refugee!" happy meals is neonazism. The left is going to have to come up with a new vocabulary or a new strategy because this one is spent.

The left is really worried because the grip they had on the media for the past 40 or 50 years is no longer enough. We can now communicate with each other and find relevant information online, we can color outside the party lines, and fill in the gaps that the carefully edited content of mainstream media didn't show. And the result is the Alt-Right and 40% of the country voting for Trump. There are still another 60% unconvinced, among them there are still a few Hillary voters... mostly Tumblrinas, low T men, and old spinsters who read XoJane and didn't get the memo that being a lefty is no longer fashionable. And of course they will call the 40% of fed up americans all the names under the sun, but when they are done insulting Trump voters, the truth will still be the truth, and they will still vote for Trump.

I wonder if it's possible to cram any more memes, cliches and generalizations into two paragraphs? This isn't snark; I just know you can make better arguments than this.
 
I wonder if it's possible to cram any more memes, cliches and generalizations into two paragraphs? This isn't snark; I just know you can make better arguments than this.
YCka9ts.jpg
 
I wonder if it's possible to cram any more memes, cliches and generalizations into two paragraphs? This isn't snark; I just know you can make better arguments than this.

Calling people racists just for disagreeing with you though? Totally not a cliche. That one is a novelty.

You all act the same way when you have nothing to say, you resort to these cheap non-arguments against the messenger, against the tone of the message, the form, etc. That way you can avoid the debate because the truth is not on your side.

I am surprised you haven't pulled out the "It is the current year!" card out of your pocket to drive your point home, you know, "It is the 2016 man! how can people still believe in borders! lmao"

HMD8uls.jpg


All I am saying is it isnt working anymore, 50 years of this fanatic bullshit made everyone resistant so you need to up your game or update your vocabulary. No matter how much you twist the truth the truth will catch up with you eventually. You can call only half of America primitive and racist for so long.
 
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I am surprised you haven't pulled out the "It is the current year!" card out of your pocket to drive your point home, you know, "It is the 2016 man! how can people still believe in borders! lmao"
...
All I am saying is it isnt working anymore, 50 years of this fanatic bullshit made everyone resistant so you need to up your game or update your vocabulary. No matter how much you twist the truth the truth will catch up with you eventually. You can call only half of America primitive and racist for so long.
50 years you say?
http://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2016/03/50-years-ago-a-look-back-at-1966/475074/
Look at how much has changed. How much of it was due to the left? Do you ever consider this?

So somebody called somebody a racist. Get over it.

Now come down off your cross, and get yourself cleaned up. You've got to get ready for 4 years of bitching about Hillary.
 
Calling people racists just for disagreeing with you though? Totally not a cliche. That one is a novelty.

You all act the same way when you have nothing to say, you resort to these cheap non-arguments against the messenger, against the tone of the message, the form, etc. That way you can avoid the debate because the truth is not on your side.

I am surprised you haven't pulled out the "It is the current year!" card out of your pocket to drive your point home, you know, "It is the 2016 man! how can people still believe in borders! lmao"

HMD8uls.jpg


All I am saying is it isnt working anymore, 50 years of this fanatic bullshit made everyone resistant so you need to up your game or update your vocabulary. No matter how much you twist the truth the truth will catch up with you eventually. You can call only half of America primitive and racist for so long.

You're still doing it! Let me try to tackle the original post. Two posts is too much for me.

"At this point 40% of America realized already that the word "racist" is just a buzzword to silence dissent."

The 40% figure represents Trump supporters, I'm assuming. Are you saying that all, or even most of those people think racism is just a buzzword? Yes, "racism" can be and is used that way, some of the time. But does 40% of the electorate believe that's all it is, a liberal buzzword to silence dissent?

"People don't buy the binary world view anymore where anything short from total open borders and handing "welcome refugee!" happy meals is neonazism. The left is going to have to come up with a new vocabulary or a new strategy because this one is spent."

Where and when did (does) this binary view of immigration exist? Immigration policy/practice has always been on a continuum between exclusion and inclusion, avoiding the extremes. Contra the right-wing trope of "open the gates let 'em in" democrats, total deportations under Obama have been higher than any previous president, except for Bush 43, whose numbers were about the same. But the number of returning deportees is much lower under Obama. [source -- lots of charts at bottom]

"There are still another 60% unconvinced, among them there are still a few Hillary voters... mostly Tumblrinas, low T men, and old spinsters who read XoJane and didn't get the memo that being a lefty is no longer fashionable."

The 60% are those who almost certainly won't vote for Trump, and that figure seems to be increasing over time. Most of them will vote for Hillary, perhaps without much enthusiasm, simply because Trump is beyond the pale. Note that I said Trump, not his followers or their politics. The issues of the 40% will have to be addressed, but that's not going to happen with candidates like Trump. As for the rest of the quote, I can't understand half of it, much less take it seriously.

"And of course they will call the 40% of fed up americans all the names under the sun, but when they are done insulting Trump voters, the truth will still be the truth, and they will still vote for Trump."

I give credit to Trump for one thing, which is elevating the importance and visibility of the issues motivating "The 40%." That's because so many moderates and leftists have been at a total loss to understand why some people support a flawed candidate like Trump, so there have been many articles and books written, and there will likely soon be academic conferences (if not already). And I think these issues will begin to be taken seriously as they are better understood and appreciated. Part of the urgency is avoiding someone else like Trump four years from now. So, I think the mistake you make is thinking that "the establishment" will reject, "insult" or co-opt the 40% (though I'm sure that will happen to some degree). What they reject, and what most Americans reject, is the style of politics, the character, and the qualifications of Trump.

Assuming Trump does not win, his political campaign actually may have done the country a service by lighting a fire under the establishment to start taking the issues seriously. A more conventional candidate probably couldn't have generated the attention and consternation Trump has.
 
You're still doing it! Let me try to tackle the original post. Two posts is too much for me.

"At this point 40% of America realized already that the word "racist" is just a buzzword to silence dissent."

The 40% figure represents Trump supporters, I'm assuming. Are you saying that all, or even most of those people think racism is just a buzzword? Yes, "racism" can be and is used that way, some of the time. But does 40% of the electorate believe that's all it is, a liberal buzzword to silence dissent?

Yes, the 40% does represent Trump supporters. And I am saying that most of Trump's supporters realize that the left uses the word "racism" to silence dissent. If you doubt this then you haven't taken the time to actually see for yourself or understand what motivates Trump voters. Have you seen anything other than what CNN and MSNBC shills?

I have gone to 2 Trump rallies, I donated to the campaign. I have read what people who support him write about him, I have spent countless hours browsing pro Trump websites and watching Youtubers who support him explain why they do. This is a movement that, at it's core, is about 2 things: rejecting the corruption of the governing class, something Hillary is the brightest representative of, and against the PC bullshit of the left. It is funny because the left seems to be completely oblivious to the fact that Trump is a direct result of their policies, of their witch hunts, and their rejection for diversity of ideas. If the left had been more accepting of other people's opinions we wouldn't have Trump. But ideology is like a pendulum and you have been forcing it too much to the left, so when it finally slips, it will go all the way to the other side. Trump is the best outcome because if you bury Trump under the character assassination the left is famous for, the next person to pick up the torch will be all the ugly things that you are falsely accusing Trump of being.

Inb4 you go down the tangent with the leftist cliche of nitpicking a post ad nauseam just to derail it: I don't have sources to back up exactly how many of Trump's voters have a distaste for the left's 1984 tactics, but neither do you. There are probably some Trump supporters who are just fans of The Apprentice, but we are talking about the bulk of the supporters.

Where and when did (does) this binary view of immigration exist? Immigration policy/practice has always been on a continuum between exclusion and inclusion, avoiding the extremes. Contra the right-wing trope of "open the gates let 'em in" democrats, total deportations under Obama have been higher than any previous president, except for Bush 43, whose numbers were about the same. But the number of returning deportees is much lower under Obama. [source -- lots of charts at bottom]

You can't really be saying this with a straight face, can you? The media and the internet is literally filled with examples of people calling someone else a racist neonazi simply because they show the tiniest ambivalence towards immigration of any kind. There are a few very vocal people on this very forum even calling anyone who says that they think the Syrian refugee crisis in Europe is dangerous racist hate-mongering nazis. That Obama deported 5 people back in 2010? Maybe. What about the 30 million illegal immigrants currently in the US (give or take, we don't even have the exact number as making a census on this would be racist)

Many of you are calling Trump the worst of names from white supremacist to "literally Hitler" for saying that the US needs to have secure borders and that they need to address the illegal immigration problem. He isn't talking about killing them, mind you, he isn't saying he wants to put them in prison. He just wants to enforce the laws that already exist. And Hillary compares him and anyone who supports him of being racists just because of it. I think it is easy to see how anything short of total embracement of immigration no matter who the immigrants are or where they come from, will be labeled racist by you.

The 60% are those who almost certainly won't vote for Trump, and that figure seems to be increasing over time. Most of them will vote for Hillary, perhaps without much enthusiasm, simply because Trump is beyond the pale.

I don't know about that, unless you think the US will have a 100% turnout this election cycle. I doubt that will be the case. Most likely there will be a 30% or more of people abstaining. I actually hadn't met a single person who openly supported Hillary and wasn't paid to say that until about a month ago. In contrast I see Trump supporters everywhere, just as I saw Bernie supporters everywhere. I think Hillary stole her party's election from Bernie because she couldnt even secure that one on her own. Polls are often meaningless in the US where so many things are bought and sold to the highest bidder, so we will have to wait and see who gets the upper hand.
 
I don't think I've met a Hillary supporter either but that's because I don't get out a whole lot and I avoid politics. I suppose if I were to go to Trump rallies, I'd see Trump supporters everywhere too.
 
I suppose if I were to go to Trump rallies, I'd see Trump supporters everywhere too.
Sounds like a damn good reason not to go to a Trump rally if you ask me. Well that, and Trump.
 
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I don't think I've met a Hillary supporter either but that's because I don't get out a whole lot and I avoid politics. I suppose if I were to go to Trump rallies, I'd see Trump supporters everywhere too.

I have met many Bernie supporters though, and I never went to one of his rallies.
 
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If you count lawn signs and bumper stickers, that's another thing entirely.

While we're on anecdotes, I had a game day with some friends of mine yesterday. All of them lean conservative/libertarian. That's fine, we don't talk politics much and I enjoy their company. Anyway, we listened to Billy West's Zapp Brannigan does Trump quotes thing together and after we picked ourselves off the floor from the gut laughs, there was this uncomfortable silence accompanied by terrified glances. All of them are struggling with the idea of either voting either for Hillary or not at all. The libertarians aren't for Gary Johnson. He has no chance and they consider him libertarian in name only.
 
....And I am saying that most of Trump's supporters realize that the left uses the word "racism" to silence dissent.....

So, anytime someone on the left/center--actually, let's say anyone not in the "40%"--uses the word racism, it's meant to stifle dissent? That would seem to imply that there is no actual phenomenon of racism behind the word. What I'm understanding you to say instead is that they use the word that way sometimes, and I would have to agree with that.

This is a movement that, at it's core, is about 2 things: rejecting the corruption of the governing class, something Hillary is the brightest representative of, and against the PC bullshit of the left.

It's about more than that; it's about loss of good jobs for the middle and working classes and the ability to support oneself and family, it's about the demographic changes the country has experienced (and that doesn't mean the 40% are racist), and it's about the feeling of being left behind as a group (again, doesn't imply racism on their part).

It is funny because the left seems to be completely oblivious to the fact that Trump is a direct result of their policies, of their witch hunts, and their rejection for diversity of ideas. If the left had been more accepting of other people's opinions we wouldn't have Trump.

I would add that the responsibility is shared by the Republican establishment and the economic interests behind them. Both, along with democrats, are responsible for the economic policies, such as free trade agreements and off-shoring, that are the root cause of all of this. I'm not saying free trade agreements are all bad. They've brought a lot of benefits. And maybe these trade realignments were inevitable. My point is just that "the left" is not the only culprit. And if you (the 40%) don't realize who your "enemies" are, and erect simplistic caricatures to be your adversaries, well, it's hard to see how that will succeed.

Inb4 you go down the tangent with the leftist cliche of nitpicking a post ad nauseam just to derail it:....

So facts and evidence are a left-wing phenomenon. Good to know...
 
http://www.cnn.com/2016/08/27/politics/donald-trump-hillary-clinton-kkk/

Interesting. From the article...
[Sen. Byrd] wrote in his autobiography that he "reflected the fears and prejudices" of those years and that he mainly joined the Klan because he identified with the hate group's anti-Communist politics.

I've certainly witnessed a lot of this in my time, hateful ideology justified with anti-communist/socialist/leftist thinking. I come from the rural South. Is it just a regional thing?
 
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