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Good-afternoon everyone,


Back in July I visited the forum to discuss an idea around providing confidential support to the model community, in terms of taking the day to day chores or pain points away from you that would allow you to concentrate on the part of your business that you need to do to earn a living - being live on cam.


At the time, it is true to say that I rocked up on the forum without a properly thought out plan and took on board some really good feedback from everyone that was very valid.


A few months on, and having chatted to several models I have now come back with a properly thought out and well-priced packages available.


The common areas that were mentioned to me that take up valuable time was blogging in order to keep your profiles and web presence fresh and to market offers and speciality event cam days that you maybe planning. Other areas were managing video compilation sales and identifying the trends of what is selling so that you can refine your content to achieve the best results and income.


Please do not hesitate to email me gareth@abs.wales if you would like to discuss or visit www.abs.wales which has package prices which are currently holding a 10% discount until the end of 2017.


Many thanks and take care,


Gareth

Business to Business B2B Business Administration Support Packager Offer Best of Torfaen.png Business to Business B2B Business Administration Support Packager Offer Best of Torfaen.png Business to Business B2B Business Administration Support Packager Offer Best of Torfaen.png
 
I'm going to be completely honest with you Gareth, £20 per hour is quite a lot of money when you think that a reasonable amount of models earn around that when working on cam, and paying you would need to be ongoing, I'm not saying you aren't worth it, just that I cannot currently see any evidence that you are. I cannot see any evidence that what you are offering requires a degree or any expertise, or even that you have any expertise in this area. Why should you be paid a premium wage that most people only get years down the line in a certain field with a degree? Camgirls may make a decent amount per hour without qualifications, but they run numerous risks for it.

As someone who has worked in self employment I don't want to say to anyone that they aren't worth what they want to charge, but I will say as a potential customer, what you are offering seems to be the easier stuff and also stuff that I should really do myself. Blogging is not the problem for many, nor is it something that really generates that much income, and it should also be personal and therefore cannot really be done by another person (unless that person is highly skilled and knows the tone to give off). I personally would not trust anyone, especially a man (no offence meant) to write from my perspective within the camming world.

Creating offers and retweeting them is also not really that big a deal. Unless I were so crazily busy with camming and life and was making such a killing I would not pay someone for anything that I can easily do myself.

I guess I am just a little bit confused about what you are offering, you have placed most of the emphasis on your prices, and much less on your skills, qualifications, experience and what it is you would actually be doing that would make it worth paying you for it.
I would like to know more about you, who is Gareth and what is it that you can do that I cannot do?
As you want an hourly rate, are you especially experienced so that what you can do in an hour would take me 3? Or Am I going to need to pay you for twice the hours that it would take me to finish the job because this is your first shot at it?
What is it you are experienced at?

Please don't expect any of us to remember your previous post, I vaguely remember you and the advise I gave you, but there have been many before you and many since. I appreciate you've taken advise and have come back, but I cannot really see that you have listened to anything I said or have provided a worthwhile business plan.

Sorry, I don't want to come off as being really harsh or rude, I mean this to be constructive criticism. I will be honest though, I would not hire you as you seem to have nothing to offer which I want or could not do myself. I cannot speak for every camgirl though. As for me, I will quote the Dragons in dragons den and say "I'm out".
 
I'm going to be completely honest with you Gareth, £20 per hour is quite a lot of money
In the UK £20 per hour is not much, a competent IT person are typically on £40 an hour and over for hourly work. Gareth might not be competent and the service might not be required at that rate, but the rate of £20 is very competitive and perhaps not sustainable.
 
In the UK £20 per hour is not much, a competent IT person are typically on £40 an hour and over for hourly work. Gareth might not be competent and the service might not be required at that rate, but the rate of £20 is very competitive and perhaps not sustainable.


Many thanks both, I really do appreciate the time taken to comment for me. Since July, I've chatted to many models as market research and I got to this point from their comments and what they considered would be worthwhile, Whilst I agree with Isabella that the activities I’ve mention can appear quite basic, to a lot of models it appears not to be. The common comments I received during my research were "I don’t know what to do" "I don’t really understand computers, can just about switch it on and come on here" "I am no good with words so could never write a blog" "I can’t sell videos as have no idea how to send them". That was the most common and formed the basis. £20 an hour based on 5 hours was again from the research with most models feeling £90 a month would be worthwhile as it would take the grunt away from them and let them get on with things. I found by the research that the models that were taking it seriously, told me that they aim (using MFC as an example) to take 2000 tokens in a 3 hour session, as they find that shorter sessions increase their viewer fan base and allows them to perform to 70-100 viewers for a shorter time than 5-10 viewers if they stay on all day/night. Using $0.05c a token this meant a minimum target of $100 (c£75) in a session with an average of 10 sessions performed per week. If these figures are wrong, I can only apologise as they were supplied by a base of 57 models that helped me. It was therefore felt that £90 / £120 a month was value, and I believe it is sustainable within my business plan alongside my other work.

As for experience, www.abs.wales explains a lot and I would be more than happy to go into more detail if anyone wanted to know.

Totally appreciate that the things I’ve advertised may seem kids play for some and easy, but of the models that helped me it was not.

I made a promise that I would research and come back, and I wanted to be true to my word.

Many thanks again and best wishes to everyone for the future - Gareth
 
In the UK £20 per hour is not much, a competent IT person are typically on £40 an hour and over for hourly work. Gareth might not be competent and the service might not be required at that rate, but the rate of £20 is very competitive and perhaps not sustainable.

I am from England, and I am not debating that some people are paid decent money. I am debating whether what he is offering needs any skills, is worth the money to many cam models, or if he actually has the required skills which would be worth hiring. Therefore £20 is a lot of money to be making, in a regular working week he would be earning over £40k per year which is generally considered to be a good wage. More than many people with degrees, more than most teachers, even many doctors. I just cannot see at present why this work would justify that salary.
 
Many thanks both, I really do appreciate the time taken to comment for me. Since July, I've chatted to many models as market research and I got to this point from their comments and what they considered would be worthwhile, Whilst I agree with Isabella that the activities I’ve mention can appear quite basic, to a lot of models it appears not to be. The common comments I received during my research were "I don’t know what to do" "I don’t really understand computers, can just about switch it on and come on here" "I am no good with words so could never write a blog" "I can’t sell videos as have no idea how to send them". That was the most common and formed the basis. £20 an hour based on 5 hours was again from the research with most models feeling £90 a month would be worthwhile as it would take the grunt away from them and let them get on with things. I found by the research that the models that were taking it seriously, told me that they aim (using MFC as an example) to take 2000 tokens in a 3 hour session, as they find that shorter sessions increase their viewer fan base and allows them to perform to 70-100 viewers for a shorter time than 5-10 viewers if they stay on all day/night. Using $0.05c a token this meant a minimum target of $100 (c£75) in a session with an average of 10 sessions performed per week. If these figures are wrong, I can only apologise as they were supplied by a base of 57 models that helped me. It was therefore felt that £90 / £120 a month was value, and I believe it is sustainable within my business plan alongside my other work.

As for experience, www.abs.wales explains a lot and I would be more than happy to go into more detail if anyone wanted to know.

Totally appreciate that the things I’ve advertised may seem kids play for some and easy, but of the models that helped me it was not.

I made a promise that I would research and come back, and I wanted to be true to my word.

Many thanks again and best wishes to everyone for the future - Gareth

I'm going to address each of these issues individually and explain why they're not really worth paying someone constantly for it:

"I don’t know what to do" - I'm not really sure what this is regarding, but not knowing does not mean they cannot learn, it just means they haven't yet. Most models start without having a clue, same with anything. Learning is better than paying someone constantly unless what you are offering needs a 3+ year degree to learn.

"I don’t really understand computers, can just about switch it on and come on here"
Something that is surprising seeing as many new camgirls are of a generation where they have learned to use computers as they learn to read and write. In fact, most of us carry a computer in our pockets every single day. But I can understand not knowing software, but what is it with computers they are needing? If you are talking about building say an MFC profile, then this would be great, but are you an expert in HTML and CSS, or are you a web designer? I would love to see examples of where your expertise lies.
There are many people who are offering custom profiles for a price so this is not unique.

"I am no good with words so could never write a blog"
- Blogging is not necessary for being a cam model. Some clip sites have a blog section which can be useful, but I have cammed for 6 years now and have never blogged, even though I'm a decent writer, it's just not worth my time in terms of time versus financial income. It could be a nice touch, but I would not part with money for someone else to write one if I have deemed it not worth it. My advice is to models who cannot write, don't even bother. Just focus on what you are good at. Members enjoy reading blogs because they are written by the model, not some random dude she has paid. Also, most members are not idiots, many will notice if you speak in a totally different way on a blog to when she's on cam, or if you say she likes things which she doesn't like.

"I can’t sell videos as have no idea how to send them"
- This would take like 5 minutes to teach a model, and if you know how to do this I am appalled that you did not simply tell a model where to go to send videos but instead tried to get her to pay you a ridiculous fee for something a monkey could do. If she's an MFC model, MFC has even created a way to upload and send videos on site. There are also plenty of places to send links. No model walked into the world knowing this, they all learned.

I cannot see anything that you have stated which would be worth a model spending so much on your services, except for the website, which really should be a flat quoted fee for the website or profile page and then extra if they want edits.

With your figures, I think you over estimate how often most models work. Yes there are models who work two sessions a day every day, but I see many more who cam one session a day, and sometimes not in a 5 day working week but actually only a few days per week. Let's put it this way, on my mega top 100 month I needed to put in two 3-4 hour sessions per day 5 days per week roughly. That was knackering and I would not do that every month. Also if you aim for 2k per session, you will still have many which you will not earn that. Different times are also different in traffic. You just cannot look at what you think a model might be earning and then discern how much your services are worth. For one you are missing out on taxes, national insurance, clothing, costs of toys, costs of high speed internet, cost of a high quality computer and keeping it all up to date, cost of a good phone which can support selfie taking and snapchat, cameras, other equipment, props, make up, an apartment with a spare room to have set up for camming, lighting, all these things which models need to spend on their business. Our "earnings" are not all profit, just like any other self-employed person. The more you earn, often the more you end up spending on your business.
Also, if a model is earning 2k tokens for a 3 hour session, they are only earning £20 per hour themselves (assuming they manage to make their goal). As there is tax, national insurance and all the other camming costs on top of that, they're actually earning less. Meaning they are actually paying you more than they're being paid for this service.... Yet this whole business plan is surely set up that cam girls earn enough money that it is not worth their time to do some of the other jobs when they could be earning more on cam.

The problem with your business plan, is that most of the more established models who are earning enough to pay someone for the extra work, can already do all of the things you say you can do. This means you are primarily going to the girls who are having trouble, usually the beginner models, who will likely not be earning enough to pay you, but might because they think it will increase their income.

Sadly what worries me is that you will end up running a scam, even if with the best intentions. You are speaking to girls who are clearly overwhelmed and don't know what they're doing, and rather than forwarding them to this site where they could get all of this information, you are saying they can pay you a premium wage to do it for them. But really what you are offering is peanuts, things that they just don't need or could easily learn themselves. It is no different to the guys who get girls to do free shows for them in return for "camming tips", except you're actually trying to turn this into a business venture. Yet it is also a common scam.

You will have trouble finding ways to help more established models, but these women are where you want to be if you have any hope in forming a genuine business rather than a scam. Most new models never continue, even if they find success. And those who do continue will quickly realise that you are scamming them on things they can either pay someone to do for cheaper, or can do themselves easily. Therefore your whole business will rely on finding inexperienced models who have the money to part with their cash, and are willing to give it to a member on a camsite. This will take hours and hours of your time in persuading girls to trust you. And as no experienced models will likely use your service, you won't have a good reputation. In fact, many models may see you as scum for taking advantage of inexperienced girls to make a profit. They may not see it as you being helpful when there is a free site right here for models to use and get this information from.

My advice is not to listen to the girls who don't have a clue. Listen to the women who do, and listen to what they would pay you for. If I was told by an established model on here "I got help on my profile or something else from this professional guy and he was well worth the money as it saved me loads of time!" I would listen. And we really do talk. Then you can have a few long term, serious models as clients while helping out the new girls. But you've got to think of things which would actually help an established model, and blogging or sending videos for them is not going to cut it.
 
A Cam Model is a single entity business. How many hours a day do they work, how many hours a day is spent blogging, or tweeting promotions? I'd have thought most would tweet a promotion before going on cam, or afterwards, so a service which is x hours later seems... odd. I don't read any blogs though, so maybe they are spending an hour a day typing out their musings.

As for things like video sales (meaning access to the material), if I were a customer I'd want it to be the model sending it to me - not an unknown business person going "oh, so this email address is buying porn huh".

The whole point (as a "customer") is interaction with the model. Remove that and I wouldn't follow the twitter account.

As for hourly rate - I wouldn't say its unreasonable because the skills required to do it are low. So? You charge what you deem worth your time, not what someone else deems worthy. They pay what they deem worthy - if no-one is willing to pay £20 then no-one will. If they are, then its not overcharging. You ask a teenager to build a simple html website you may get charged £20 for 2 hours work. Ask me, it'd likely be far higher... for exactly the same outcome. Why? Because it's not worth my time to do it for less. I'd rather watch TV :p
 
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As for hourly rate - I wouldn't say its unreasonable because the skills required to do it are low. So? You charge what you deem worth your time, not what someone else deems worthy. They pay what they deem worthy - if no-one is willing to pay £20 then no-one will. If they are, then its not overcharging. You ask a teenager to build a simple html website you may get charged £20 for 2 hours work. Ask me, it'd likely be far higher... for exactly the same outcome. Why? Because it's not worth my time to do it for less. I'd rather watch TV :p

I want to second this as this is really important, as well as the excellent points about camming being about interaction with the model.

When I question the prices, it is because I know that what the OP is offering per hour would not be worth it to me, and almost certainly not worth it for a model who earns 2k per 3 hours if she really thought about it. I earn 2k per hour and it's not worth it to me. Maybe this is just me, but I would far prefer to spend an hour blogging about my day than working hard on webcam. Far less risky, far less energy and would mix it up. But then, I post on this forum for fun so blogging probably isn't the best one to pick as an example... I might prefer camming to learning how to create a website, or say if I wasn't very creative I might enjoy someone helping me with the creative stuff if I felt those things were essential. But if they weren't essential I certainly would not pay that person more than my hourly wage. In the camming world I would be hard pushed to part with my cash. Cash in my hand is a guarantee, while cash in the future is abstract in the cam world. Unless it were essential I would not do it. I cannot speak for every model, I'm just saying that I would not pay that price for those services and cannot see many models being willing to part with their cash either. It may not be worth it to you to do this work for cheaper, but I am not sure you will be able to run a business on those services for so little.

List of things I would/might pay for:
- Accounting/help with accounting.
- Website design (but only if that person were doing it to a high level)
- Potentially with the web design part, if I were camming often and therefore making a lot of money and videos, I might pay someone as an assistant to update my profile with names of members who tipped for certain fan clubs. Not difficult work once you know how to do it, but if they could do it and make it look super professional and it took all the work off me, yeah I might do that. But this is so long as each week/day there are a lot of updates to do, and of course if I were earning enough to justify it.
- Possibly video/photo editing, but only if that person had good skills and the right equipment.
- Photographers.
- Security if I were to go to a date raffle meet

The only thing I can really see that you'd be able to do online is the web design stuff, but there are plenty of people who could do this. Most of all the other stuff which you've offered, I feel like if I were going to pay someone for those things, I would rather the money go to someone I know and trust. Unless it's a specialist situation then why would I hire a random?

I wonder if maybe rather than doing an hourly amount, the OP gave an amount per service with an rough estimate of the hours it would take, it might be more clear. Because I don't know if during that "hour" you actually twiddle your thumbs or go on facebook (or MFC) for half of it and therefore I have to pay double for the work. Then if you choose to procrastinate or take 5 toilet breaks, that's your decision and will not impact my outcome. For example, when I quote someone a price for a custom video, I have a "per minute" rate which incorporates all the extra work I need to do for the video. I do not charge an abstract amount for the amount of time it took in total. I charge for the finished product they will receive. Many professionals do this, especially in a situation where you're not being watched on the clock.

One of the biggest problems with this business model is that one of the pet hates of many cam models (as far as I can tell), is that we hate it when men try to get a slice of the cam model pie without ever working on cam. This can come in the form of building a shit website without much pre thought, skills or experience, or finding a way to "help" models and make money through it. I guess it's a bit like saying: "hey, here are a load of young, vulnerable women who have found a way to make a lot of money through their looks, but have no idea yet how to do any of the business side (bless their silly brains). I'll swoop in and do these easy odd jobs which they don't have a clue about and I'll be able to make money while doing it! And the best part is, they'll pay me more than I deserve because they're loaded!"
Yeah, it's going to grate on a fair few girls when you don't appear to be offering a serious service.
 
If this was a thread of someone trying to cost justify a model there would be outrage but it's ok if it's anyone else put on the block.

He's charging what he feels he's WORTH. Take it or leave it. I could see if you limit the argument to how much a model could do on her own vs need another's service but it's very hypocritical for any model to suggest if someone's price is too high or too low unless they specifically are asking about it.

Bringing anyone on is a risk/reward venture in business. Not every business owner needs an assistant either but there are people (like myself that write horrible) who find the benefits cover the cost.

Someone offering business support isn't a SCAM it's just letting you know what's available. If you feel anyone helpful service is a scam then do you also feel accountants, plumbers or electricians are also scams because the hardware store and google exists? Gender also has no factor in this if it was a woman offering the same service it would have to be rationalize by the model the same as if it's a man.
 
If this was a thread of someone trying to cost justify a model there would be outrage but it's ok if it's anyone else put on the block.

He's charging what he feels he's WORTH. Take it or leave it. I could see if you limit the argument to how much a model could do on her own vs need another's service but it's very hypocritical for any model to suggest if someone's price is too high or too low unless they specifically are asking about it.

Bringing anyone on is a risk/reward venture in business. Not every business owner needs an assistant either but there are people (like myself that write horrible) who find the benefits cover the cost.

Someone offering business support isn't a SCAM it's just letting you know what's available. If you feel anyone helpful service is a scam then do you also feel accountants, plumbers or electricians are also scams because the hardware store and google exists? Gender also has no factor in this if it was a woman offering the same service it would have to be rationalize by the model the same as if it's a man.

This is nothing to do with male versus female. This discussion happens in the models only section of this forum where models ask why no one is paying for such and such, and prices do get mentioned. If you're starting out and haven't got much traffic but are trying to charge top model prices, it's not seen as being negative to say that you may not get many people spending. Prices are important, I don't believe you should lower them and devalue what you have to offer, but it is important to look at your market. If you are offering a service to save a business time and money, yet actually you are charging what the business tries to make per hour, you aren't doing what you say on the label. Prices are not about what you believe you are worth, they are about what people are willing to pay. In this situation when dealing with cam models, you are tapping into something that no one really seems to do, and models don't usually pay for, so to expect to start out with such high prices with absolutely no credit to your name is a bit, well, delusional. Models are already distrusting of members. Be realistic, how many models will truly respond to a non tipping member with "yeah, sure, let me hand over my money to you for some random service where you will learn many of my personal details."? Especially when the service isn't really offering services which a model really needs to make money.

The "scam" in this is that many of this help is readily available for free. It's kind of like the "studios" who pretend to be the myfreecams sign up, get girls onto them and then take a % of their earnings. They haven't lied exactly, and they haven't broken the law, but they have mislead new models to take a profit. The reason I mentioned scam, is that say information like knowing how to send videos, and some of the other questions the OP posted, are really easy, but it seems that rather than signposting to this site for free, the OP is trying to make profit. It is not exactly scamming, but IMO it's foul play for a business to do this and make it seem like you need to pay someone to do this work for you when really you do not.

There is a big difference between a model having high prices for products, and a member going around inexperienced models and convincing them that they need to spend money on his help (much of which will not improve their earnings/and/or is easy to do on your own if you know how). The first is take it or leave it, and the second is not. Not only that, but models are providing a luxury product, the price tag for this is completely abstract and sometimes is part of the feeling of luxury. In a business plan, your product pretty much needs to provide monetary value to the model or you are selling them a dud product. Maybe I am wrong, but I do not see that any of the support offered would actually increase a models income. It would be like being a sales person and wanting to be paid more than what you can sell the products for. You would be essentially redundant. Hence why sales has a high turnover and usually pays commission.

Usually in any business, no matter what you're doing I would say more power to you if you can get good money on your work, but in this situation it doesn't seem entirely ethical. I also felt like the OP was pretty shady on the details of what help he was actually going to do and his experience. The "website" is just a page with a list of his information, but there was no evidence of what experience he had. Just "20 years of business management experience" or something like that. To someone inexperienced to business this could appear professional enough (and is how many people are scammed), but it's actually pretty unprofessional. Especially just having a mobile number, and also having a page like that which is clearly one person but then talking in "we" all the time. Is it a freelancer or is it a business with numerous members of staff? Personally I would want to know this information before hiring anyone. Unfortunately this is an industry where models (and members but that's a different story) get regularly scammed, stalked, harassed, threatened, blackmailed and basically all sorts of pretty awful things. Due to this it's especially important to be skeptical of anyone coming into the business if they do not seem professional. This isn't to do with gender, if it were a female with no model experience advertising this to male models without sharing their previous experience or what exactly they were going to be doing, I would be saying exactly the same thing, so please do not turn this into a "reverse sexism" thing.
 
Usually in any business, no matter what you're doing I would say more power to you if you can get good money on your work, but in this situation it doesn't seem entirely ethical. I also felt like the OP was pretty shady on the details of what help he was actually going to do and his experience.

That's his problem if he doesn't convince people to use his business. It doesn't open the door for 'unsolicited' advice on what's wrong. My point is if a member did the same back to you there would be a reaction about it.

Because there's 'free' alternatives doesn't mean there's no place for paid services. You're using the freeloader argument here. It's myFREEcams so why buy tokens? There's free tax help sites out there as well but there's still value in paying a tax professional.

I'm not saying what he's selling has value or not that's for him to do but I just see a very hypocritical situation unfolding and you may not be aware of it. If you feel your business shouldn't be scrutinized then how do you feel justified in the same actions?

Your first response is this
I'm going to be completely honest with you Gareth, £20 per hour is quite a lot of money when you think that a reasonable amount of models earn around that when working on cam, and paying you would need to be ongoing, I'm not saying you aren't worth it, just that I cannot currently see any evidence that you are

What if someone had written this to you?

I'm going to be completely honest with you IsabellaSnow, <put a number here> per minute is quite a lot of money, I'm not saying you aren't worth it, just that I cannot currently see any evidence that you are.
 
That's his problem if he doesn't convince people to use his business. It doesn't open the door for 'unsolicited' advice on what's wrong. My point is if a member did the same back to you there would be a reaction about it.

Because there's 'free' alternatives doesn't mean there's no place for paid services. You're using the freeloader argument here. It's myFREEcams so why buy tokens? There's free tax help sites out there as well but there's still value in paying a tax professional.

I'm not saying what he's selling has value or not that's for him to do but I just see a very hypocritical situation unfolding and you may not be aware of it. If you feel your business shouldn't be scrutinized then how do you feel justified in the same actions?

Your first response is this


What if someone had written this to you?

I'm going to be completely honest with you IsabellaSnow, <put a number here> per minute is quite a lot of money, I'm not saying you aren't worth it, just that I cannot currently see any evidence that you are.

Firstly, I get that kind of comment all the time, I am in the business of webcamming, of course I get people commenting. It is up to me to convince someone that I am, or just accept that they are not within my price range. If I had no pictures, no reviews or previous experience and refused to give a description of what I would be up for doing in a private show then I would definitely be expecting to receive these comments. This is essentially what the OP has done.
But instead when people see me they can see my pictures, clips of videos, or can see me streaming live. From that they should know if they like me or not. Members generally have to make a bit of a leap of faith with models on how they'll be in a private show, but generally say in my room lots of members will pipe up and say my private shows are amazing when people ask.

And what I am saying is completely different to the "myFREEcams" argument.

In this situation, him saying models didn't know how to send videos and that he would do that, he is not actually providing a secure way to send videos. He would just be using the free sites which work hard to provide that service and would be getting the profit out of it. The model would still need to send him the video (and you may see another problem with this) and then he would be uploading them to a site which sends the links. This would take her the same, or more time than doing it herself. Except she would be paying a third party to do it for her.

Do you understand why this is not reasonable to charge models? It's kind of like if you go travelling sometimes you might arrive in one place and a taxi driver will insist you need a lift to your hotel as it's miles away, even though it's only a 4 minute walk. They will then take you in a roundabout way so it seems like longer. You will get to your destination yes, but you did not need to pay money to the taxi driver. They essentially scammed you so they could make money off you. This is not honest business practice however you spin it. Yes, people can do this, and you may say it's the drivers business what they do, but I don't really agree with knowing someone may be planning on that and not expressing concern.

Another example might be if a member got into the models only section and took lots of information and started selling it to models. It is not the information he/she has found out, and he/she is aware this information should have been free to the model, yet they still take advantage of the situation by withholding that information to try to profit off it.

Not only this, but the OP actually e-mailed me thanking me for previous advice before I responded to this post, and was clear they wanted thoughts. So I am not just throwing out unsolicited advice, the OP put this out there, and I shared my thoughts as honestly as I could. It really isn't that far out there to say that if your target client is someone who earns £20 per hour on cam pre tax and expenses, that it's probably not going to be worth it to them to spend £20 per hour for a few tasks which most successful models do not do. Doesn't matter if you're amazing at your job, if your business is about saving people time which could be better spent working, they should be making a profit from that time, not a loss. And as I am essentially a potential client, it is not unreasonable for me to say that without any evidence of his qualifications, his reviews or his work, I would not rank him at such a high amount per hour.

Come on, would any business seriously hire someone who refused to give a CV and/or references and couldn't even explain some of the work they have done or their qualifications? Do you not think these questions would be what any potential employer would ask if someone came to them with a similar business proposition? I have never heard of any business just taking someone's word for it that they're really good unless the information they provided was seriously solid. Why should camming be any different?
 
To be honest it seems like most of this business support stuff could be replaced with a couple of video tutorials. For instance uploading stuff to somewhere whether it be Dropbox, MFC Share or some place else and send people a link is pretty easy. Heck I think I might make a tutorial on how to upload stuff to MFC Share and create a voucher link just to show how easy it is. It would maybe take half an hour of actual work to make such a thing. Because I am a gosh darn socialist when it comes to educating people I would give that tutorial away for free out of solidarity.

I am of the opinion that Aspire Business Support doesn't offer anything that would be of substantial value to a cam model. The only way I could see this business making any money is by going out and actively talking to brand new models that have no clue about what they are doing and wrongfully convince them that this is something they need. I might be wrong but it would be because the benefits of the service being sold has not been well presented and that is entirely @ABS_Wales own fault.
 
Because there's 'free' alternatives doesn't mean there's no place for paid services.

Cam Models have to deal with lots of predators, scams, snake oil, extra. People interested in them for all the wrong reasons. So it's only natural to be protective of themselves and their community.

What if it was your bank account? And some stranger was offering to 'help you out' with your bank account for a 20. Do you really want to give this random stranger your bank account info? I mean they might drain your account; they might show up at your door. Is this a reasonable service to offer?
 
Cam Models have to deal with lots of predators, scams, snake oil, extra. People interested in them for all the wrong reasons. So it's only natural to be protective of themselves and their community.

What if it was your bank account? And some stranger was offering to 'help you out' with your bank account for a 20. Do you really want to give this random stranger your bank account info? I mean they might drain your account; they might show up at your door. Is this a reasonable service to offer?

If someone offered me services that I didn't trust. I WOULDN'T DO BUSINESS WITH THEM. I wouldn't tell them it's because they're charging too much or tell them how better to sell snake oil. I don't disagree with what she says about this just felt the approach taken was hypocritical.

My issue is if you're already decided why you feel something if fishy then WHY make a discussion about pricing? That's to imply if he was cheaper then everything else is OK. My argument was if the shoe was on the other foot and it was a person discussing model price at the same time decided they won't spend anyways they would be torn apart here.
 
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It's important to discuss these ideas because models use these threads for information. As a community we discuss things thoroughly from as many angles to better build our library of information for future camgirls. An informed decision is the best one.
 
If someone offered me services that I didn't trust. I WOULDN'T DO BUSINESS WITH THEM. I wouldn't tell them it's because they're charging too much or tell them how better to sell snake oil. I don't disagree with what she says about this just felt the approach taken was hypocritical.

My issue is if you're already decided why you feel something if fishy then WHY make a discussion about pricing? That's to imply if he was cheaper then everything else is OK. My argument was if the shoe was on the other foot and it was a person discussing model price at the same time decided they won't spend anyways they would be torn apart here.

I feel like you're only listening to half of what I write. The discussion of pricing is separate from whether he's dodgy or not. The pricing comment is entirely based on what I would spend and what I believe other camgirls could honestly afford to spend. The OP seems to be assuming that all camgirls work a 6-8 hour day split into two shifts, 5 days a week, and therefore are earning a really decent wage and can afford to hire him for a higher rate. What I am pointing out is that most camgirls do not work that much and realistically would probably find their money better put into things which they can actively use while camming than hiring a helper. Especially in the cases of less experienced models, which he is clearly marketing to as he is not willing to offer anything which might assist a more experience and successful cam model. It is not unreasonable for a potential customer to comment on this when someone comes here for advice on their business plan. I am being honest, most people in this country would be happy at getting £10 per hour, I do not see why I would be paying him £20. I would like to know what he would be doing for me which would make that a worthwhile price.

I do not see why this is hypocritical. What have I said in this post that says that I do not take constructive criticism about pricing? You are calling me a hypocrite based on your own presumptions of my personality because I am a cam model. You are ignoring me stating that I do have many discussions with members on pricing and unless they offer me something ridiculously low (say less than minimum wage), I do not get insulted. I have also stated that if I were to post an ad for services up but not provide any reviews or photos of myself and was pretty vague on the details, I would definitely expect to hear questions about my pricing and about what makes me worth it.
I am not sure if you just don't know what hypocrite means, but in this situation I am not being one.
 
I'll go against what most are saying here and say I would love to pay for someone to do "background" work for me. I have a ton of videos I need to get screenshots of to put into bundles, but I just haven't had the time to do it. I need to go through my video collection and reorganize things and make sure I have everything uploaded to my drive (and get many lost videos off of C4S). I can think of lots of little things I would pay someone hourly (at that rate) to do.
But... my problem is that I would probably spend almost just as much time teaching someone how to do what I want and looking over their work as I would spend just doing it myself. Like how do I know that the screenshots someone else would choose from my videos would not be horrible? Women are picky about that stuff and men send selfies from a low angle... I don't think I would trust a guy to find the best pictures :p sorry dudes.

I feel like.. you need to show some examples of work you've done for anyone to consider using your service.
 
Many thanks to everyone for your interaction.

Just to confirm.....
- I did the research
- Listened to models
- Offered to provide what was requested
- Priced it accordingy at a level both I was happy with and what the models said would be affordable and value to them

It seems like time to draw a line under this one as I dont want it to take up hours of everyones time debating it for no value.

I was a little disapointed to have the scam word used so freely, when i have been as transparent as possible. I know that some tasks are easy to some, but not everyone is the same. Its no different to saying if someone wants a plumbing job done and a plumber offers a service, that they are just exploting members of the public who cannot plumb......I was a bit surprised at that one.

Many thanks again to everyone and I wish everyone well for the future.
 
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I'll go against what most are saying here and say I would love to pay for someone to do "background" work for me. I have a ton of videos I need to get screenshots of to put into bundles, but I just haven't had the time to do it. I need to go through my video collection and reorganize things and make sure I have everything uploaded to my drive (and get many lost videos off of C4S). I can think of lots of little things I would pay someone hourly (at that rate) to do.
But... my problem is that I would probably spend almost just as much time teaching someone how to do what I want and looking over their work as I would spend just doing it myself. Like how do I know that the screenshots someone else would choose from my videos would not be horrible? Women are picky about that stuff and men send selfies from a low angle... I don't think I would trust a guy to find the best pictures :p sorry dudes.

I feel like.. you need to show some examples of work you've done for anyone to consider using your service.
Really appreciate this response Caireen, and I totally get the trust thing. I simply responded to a request made but a couple of models who thought it would be a great service, but then they already know me. I think it goes down as one of the greatest but totally unfeasible business ventures.......but I can say I tried, What is it they say, if you have never failed you have just simply never tried anything new :) Thanks all.
 
Really appreciate this response Caireen, and I totally get the trust thing. I simply responded to a request made but a couple of models who thought it would be a great service, but then they already know me. I think it goes down as one of the greatest but totally unfeasible business ventures.......but I can say I tried, What is it they say, if you have never failed you have just simply never tried anything new :) Thanks all.

I don't think it's a total bust. I just think that a lot of us in the industry have no reason to trust you (yet?). There are a lot of sketchy guys out there trying to "help" us in order to get free things or for whatever reason. And a lot of really incompetent people presenting themselves as professionals asking for pay (I can think of a lot of photographers and "profile designers"). So if you are serious about this you'd need to build a portfolio, and also have some model testimonials. Unless camgirls already know you (because you've helped them for free I imagine?) it's pretty unlikely we would start paying you without any evidence showing you'd do a good job.
 
I don't think it's a total bust. I just think that a lot of us in the industry have no reason to trust you (yet?). There are a lot of sketchy guys out there trying to "help" us in order to get free things or for whatever reason. And a lot of really incompetent people presenting themselves as professionals asking for pay (I can think of a lot of photographers and "profile designers"). So if you are serious about this you'd need to build a portfolio, and also have some model testimonials. Unless camgirls already know you (because you've helped them for free I imagine?) it's pretty unlikely we would start paying you without any evidence showing you'd do a good job.

Thankyou Caireen, really appreciated :)
 
I don't think it's a total bust. I just think that a lot of us in the industry have no reason to trust you (yet?). There are a lot of sketchy guys out there trying to "help" us in order to get free things or for whatever reason. And a lot of really incompetent people presenting themselves as professionals asking for pay (I can think of a lot of photographers and "profile designers"). So if you are serious about this you'd need to build a portfolio, and also have some model testimonials. Unless camgirls already know you (because you've helped them for free I imagine?) it's pretty unlikely we would start paying you without any evidence showing you'd do a good job.

I completely agree with this, and I want the OP to know that this is a part of what I was saying before. It wasn't a "stop this business", more that a lot more work needs to go into it to show what you can do to help models, and you would need to really clearly show why models would not only trust you but pay you. For example what Caireen stated would help her, this is the kind of thing that would be helpful, and not because models do not know how to do it, or because you are working with newer models who are barely making the game, but because it's time consuming and needs to be done. But as Caireen said, you would need to show evidence that you can do as good a job as she could without her having to spend ages training you and checking your work. This would be the same in any industry you might get into. I cannot speak for Caireen on this, but I would imagine she and others would also want to know who you are and why they should trust you first before sending you all of their videos over for free (and sending you payment).
In Caireen's situation, she is a long term successful model and is the kind of model who I think you would be better off focusing on how to help if you want to run a sustainable business. Not only could she or someone similar provide you with regular work, they would also be respected in the industry and could get you more regular work.

To the OP, I don't know what would get me trusting the credentials, maybe a linked in account or something that showed some proof of your work history. Maybe not just a mobile number and an e-mail as forms of contact. What is up there on your webpage would be so easy to fake. Though examples of work would also be very important and a list of what it is you can actually do. The plumber analogy is also not the best on terms of why I mentioned the word "scam". A plumber would be skilled within that area and offering a clear service. In your situation with not just informing models how to send videos and instead charging them to do the work for them (even though they'd need to do the same work), would be like calling a plumber and them realising you just don't know how to switch the hot water on, and instead of telling you how to do it yourself, making you pay a regular hourly fee to turn it on for you. I would say that would be a scammy plumber. They know they should tell the person, but instead are using their ignorance to make a regular profit. Do you understand the difference? This is actually a real life scam which does happen in some businesses and it is a known problem with certain organisations. Perhaps you did not know that sending videos is that easy and is more of a "pass the word on" sort of thing if you know how to do it, but it was one of the few examples you used, so I would like you to be aware that you probably should not charge for that as a service. I learned how to do it just like everyone else, and once upon a time I was lost and confused about it. If someone does not know, it does not mean they cannot learn quickly. And certainly if they have the ability to make videos and send them to you, they can certainly upload them to somewhere and then create and send links to members. This I would say is one of the quickest jobs, and also should really be between a model and a member. I wouldn't feel comfortable telling an outside party what videos such and such is buying so they can make me a link. I also think it's best to send links as soon as they're purchased while still streaming. It takes less than a minute and maintains a sense of trust.
 
Yeah so I'm also someone that hires someone to do background work. I don't know if my experiences will help but I'll pop them here for your information:

I currently hire someone and have done so in the past.

I need uploading, description writing for videos (with a good working knowledge of clipsites and fetish trigger words etc as well as the rules of each site and work arounds), basic video editing (Titles/cuts/preview rendering) Gif making, mass emailing (i try to send out an email to every tipper at the end of each month and i want to do more of this with some clip sites), picture conversion/uploading into zip files, profile edits (so they have to be familiar with the profile builder) etc. Sometimes I need someone to run to the post office for me, or help me package up shipments of panties. I also occasionally need technical writing and graphic design services - though I usually hire someone separately for this.

Basically, I need a PA so I hire locally from my community. I've used a personal assistant three times now and the two that were in person were much more successful for me.

Ultimately, take out the mailing help I could have someone do things virtually but it increases the amount of time to send/recieve files etc. I can give her thigns on a harddrive in person it makes it much easier.

I want someone I can train to do everything the way I want it, how I want it.


As a reference point (if it helps) I pay her $17 an hour. I'd probably pay a good bit more if someone came already familiar with the industry and software that I use. (i did have to train her at length about clip sites, how to upload, how to use my wordpress blog poster, how to create a gif etc). I also tend to prefer to hire women, and people who are sex workers or former sex workers.

If i was to consider hiring a virtual assistant instead of a local one I'd need to see testimonials/examples of work and this person would need to offer the skills I need (or be willing and able to pick them up quickly)

Your rates aren't bad at all to me but your services seemed limited. I also agree that you're better to focus on already successful models who are feeling swamped by the amount of work that they are doing that someone else could do. People who KNOW they will be able to earn the money they pay you per hour + with the time they save. Just the other day i was talking to a top MFC model who was saying she despearately needed to hire some help to handle admin.
 
Yeah so I'm also someone that hires someone to do background work. I don't know if my experiences will help but I'll pop them here for your information:

I currently hire someone and have done so in the past.

I need uploading, description writing for videos (with a good working knowledge of clipsites and fetish trigger words etc as well as the rules of each site and work arounds), basic video editing (Titles/cuts/preview rendering) Gif making, mass emailing (i try to send out an email to every tipper at the end of each month and i want to do more of this with some clip sites), picture conversion/uploading into zip files, profile edits (so they have to be familiar with the profile builder) etc. Sometimes I need someone to run to the post office for me, or help me package up shipments of panties. I also occasionally need technical writing and graphic design services - though I usually hire someone separately for this.

Basically, I need a PA so I hire locally from my community. I've used a personal assistant three times now and the two that were in person were much more successful for me.

Ultimately, take out the mailing help I could have someone do things virtually but it increases the amount of time to send/recieve files etc. I can give her thigns on a harddrive in person it makes it much easier.

I want someone I can train to do everything the way I want it, how I want it.


As a reference point (if it helps) I pay her $17 an hour. I'd probably pay a good bit more if someone came already familiar with the industry and software that I use. (i did have to train her at length about clip sites, how to upload, how to use my wordpress blog poster, how to create a gif etc). I also tend to prefer to hire women, and people who are sex workers or former sex workers.

If i was to consider hiring a virtual assistant instead of a local one I'd need to see testimonials/examples of work and this person would need to offer the skills I need (or be willing and able to pick them up quickly)

Your rates aren't bad at all to me but your services seemed limited. I also agree that you're better to focus on already successful models who are feeling swamped by the amount of work that they are doing that someone else could do. People who KNOW they will be able to earn the money they pay you per hour + with the time they save. Just the other day i was talking to a top MFC model who was saying she despearately needed to hire some help to handle admin.

Many thanks agaon, I really am humbled by the time you are taking to provide such great feedback, I so respect the genuine and helpful nature and cannot thankyou all enough, and I mean that so sincerely.
I really want to be transparent, you may have realised that www.abs.wales is hoted on a Nataionally recognised UK platform, I did this to take away the "anyone can set a website up and scam people" away, Best Of is totally independant and I have needed to be verified and DBS (police check for those outside of the UK) checked to join.

I am more than happy to do a live webinar for even great transparency if you think that would help. Its great to see that the need is out there, but I totally get the trust issues and I think I would be more concerned for a model if that trust issue wasnt present as I feel they would be vunerable.

Take care.
 
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